HS2

[black and decker boy]

I suspect the current government view that investing in infrastructure as a way to boost the economy (originally to offset B****t) will at least continue if not be supercharged to overcome Covid-19.

 

as HS2 is the pinnacle of UK infrastructure investment, is shovel ready and already a major employer, it would be utterly baffling if it was cancelled.

[Davexoc]

There were people on-site at Hartwell just yesterday. I let part of the convoy turn across in front of me to keep the traffic flowing into Aylesbury...

[Tricky-CRS]

2 hours ago, Dava said:

 

My observations are as valid as yours. We don't know what will happen but on the other side of COVID19 the reality to complete. and ability to fund HS2 could be very different. I know the arguments pro HS2 and have been positive to date but things are changing unpredictably. And we will still have a crap old railway on the MML north of Kettering.  HS2 will not change that for many more years, if ever.

 

Dava

 

 

Nor will scrapping HS2, but scrapping HS2 will sack aload of people as we are potentially entering recession, make us look like a bad investment option and potentially delay other projects that were going to spring board off this one.

[lmsforever]

There are far more projects that need investment  in the UK and I think a project in London to cope with increasing sewage problems is the pinnacle of engineering.They are driving a giant tunnel under London to a vastly improved treatment works and they are on budget and time.A certain rail project is already eating up much needed money that could bring improvements to our health and wellbeing hospitals social housing .The spending in the UK needs to be targeted were it is needed and part of it has to be spent on our existing rail lines .If in ten years a case is proved then build a new line but dont have trains running over the current  speeds and integrate it fully with existing services not as is planned now.Who knows what effect this earth shattering event we are going through is going to have on work life needs but I think we experiencing a true change in attitudes to life. 

[Mark Saunders]

29 minutes ago, lmsforever said:

There are far more projects that need investment  in the UK and I think a project in London to cope with increasing sewage problems is the pinnacle of engineering.They are driving a giant tunnel under London to a vastly improved treatment works and they are on budget and time.A certain rail project is already eating up much needed money that could bring improvements to our health and wellbeing hospitals social housing .The spending in the UK needs to be targeted were it is needed and part of it has to be spent on our existing rail lines .If in ten years a case is proved then build a new line but dont have trains running over the current  speeds and integrate it fully with existing services not as is planned now.Who knows what effect this earth shattering event we are going through is going to have on work life needs but I think we experiencing a true change in attitudes to life. 

 

Will you please let it drop, if it doesn't suit you then it should not be done, ten years time will be too late!

 

Why have you got a fetish for on time and on budget when that project is totally invisible and most of the population have not heard of it and using your logic it should not be built because the current tunnels designed by  Sir Joseph Bazalgette  and the Crossness pumping is there and is working! Plus it was built overcapacity to cope with future demand.

 

 

 

[Northmoor]

4 minutes ago, Mark Saunders said:

 

Will you please let it drop, if it doesn't suit you then it should not be done, ten years time will be too late!

 

Why have you got a fetish for on time and on budget when that project is totally invisible and most of the population have not heard of it and using your logic it should not be built because the current tunnels designed by  Sir Joseph Bazalgette  and the Crossness pumping is there and is working! Plus it was built overcapacity to cope with future demand.

 

The London Supersewer doesn't get a lot of public criticism because (a) it is being funded by a private water company and (b) while the construction is disruptive to some London residents, virtually no-one will be able to see the infrastructure once completed.

[Mark Saunders]

4 minutes ago, Northmoor said:

The London Supersewer doesn't get a lot of public criticism because (a) it is being funded by a private water company and (b) while the construction is disruptive to some London residents, virtually no-one will be able to see the infrastructure once completed.

 

The public are paying for it through their Water Bills and most people don't know it exists as it is out of sight, out of mind!

 

 

 

 

[Northmoor]

8 minutes ago, Mark Saunders said:

 

The public are paying for it through their Water Bills and most people don't know it exists as it is out of sight, out of mind!

 

Yes, that's what I said in (b).  Yes the public are paying for it and most can't change supplier, but a private company still has to recover those costs from their income which is probably more heavily regulated than train fares.

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, lmsforever said:

we experiencing a true change in attitudes to life. 

But absolutely no change in your attitude

[Trog]

11 hours ago, lmsforever said:

 ............................If in ten years a case is proved then build a new line but dont have trains running over the current  speeds and integrate it fully with existing services not as is planned now......................................................

 

So wait ten years and redesign to produce an inferior and less useful product, and you have the hypocrisy to accuse HS2 of wasting money. 

[lmsforever]

Well well  at least I have made some people think  we are going to have to change the way we live like it or not so no heads in the sand.

[Mark Saunders]

9 minutes ago, lmsforever said:

Well well  at least I have made some people think  we are going to have to change the way we live like it or not so no heads in the sand.

 

Some things will change but not as radical as you think; there will still be a Victorian built railway that really should be replaced as using your logic there would only be a road network left by the Romans and the motorway network would never have been built.

 

The good burgers of Aylesbury are going to have to accept change even thousands of more houses, associated roads and traffic!

 

Beware of Luddites as they are terrified of change!

 

There is a future and it will probably look very similar to the present!

[mdvle]

4 hours ago, lmsforever said:

Well well  at least I have made some people think  we are going to have to change the way we live like it or not so no heads in the sand.

 

The irony is that HS2 is exactly that - changing how the people of the UK live.

 

It's about building a modern railway instead of an expansion of a Victorian railway, so that it can replace building more motorways and cars and move people around more efficiently.

 

 

[melmerby]

4 hours ago, lmsforever said:

Well well  at least I have made some people think  we are going to have to change the way we live like it or not so no heads in the sand.

You credit yourself with a lot.  Are you going to pull your head out of the sand as well?

Edited March 21, 2020 by melmerby

[lmsforever]

Wouldnt have my head in the sand not good for you !

[Phaeton]

2 hours ago, mdvle said:

It's about building a modern railway instead of an expansion of a Victorian railway, so that it can replace building more motorways and cars and move people around more efficiently.

 

Did you honestly type that with a straight face?

[mdvle]

28 minutes ago, Phaeton said:

Did you honestly type that with a straight face?

 

Note I did not say that no motorways or cars, but that the "more" in my statement is the additional cars/motorways that would be required to replace HS2 in the movement of people.

 

Will there be more roads and motorway built - yes, because HS2 doesn't serve all of the UK.  But it does help reduce the need for them for one rather busy travel corridor within the UK.

[lmsforever]

Any idea what was happening at Hartwell yesterday they have not been here for a while?

[Zomboid]

On 20/03/2020 at 00:25, Dava said:

People see they can work & survive without frequent long-distance commuting.

4 days into indefinite working from home, and whilst I technically can work from home, as soon as commuting is a responsible thing to do I'll be back in the office almost every day. How home workers cope with the isolation I really don't know.

[jjb1970]

There is going to be a lot of hair cutting on the other side of this, trying to restore finances is going to be hugely challenging and I think we should all be prepared for tax hikes and pretty brutal cuts in places. I think the government will prioritize HS2 but there isn't a bottomless pit of money and the COVID crisis has blown government finances apart.

[billbedford]

But there is a bottomless pit of money as the banks keep proving. As long as the government keeps giving money for people to spend it should be alright. The hard part is persuading companies to invest in producing produces that people want to buy. 

[mdvle]

39 minutes ago, jjb1970 said:

There is going to be a lot of hair cutting on the other side of this, trying to restore finances is going to be hugely challenging and I think we should all be prepared for tax hikes and pretty brutal cuts in places. I think the government will prioritize HS2 but there isn't a bottomless pit of money and the COVID crisis has blown government finances apart.

 

Much of the political instability around the world of the last decade can be traced back to the "austerity" forced on people by both governments (cutting services) and employees (no pay increases for workers while playing with the stock price).

 

If governments repeat that mistake then whether HS2 gets built or not will be a minor matter.

[Trog]

11 hours ago, mdvle said:

 

Much of the political instability around the world of the last decade can be traced back to the "austerity" forced on people by both governments (cutting services) and employees (no pay increases for workers while playing with the stock price).

 

If governments repeat that mistake then whether HS2 gets built or not will be a minor matter.

 

Quite right look how well printing money worked for 1930's Germany and Zimbabwe. They made their populations so rich that both ended up producing notes denominated in the millions. Printing money results in inflation and should only be done in emergency when the alternatives are even worse. Doing it as a matter of course to pay for services your country can not afford is a recipe for financial disaster.  The resulting inflation also tends to penalises the prudent who have saved for retirement or a rainy day, while rewarding the feckless, on whom the money tends to be spent.

[billbedford]

The Germany inflation was a deliberate government policy to, basically, screw the French out of their war reparations. It lasted about 9 months and worked very well. 

 

Those of us that take any interest in economic will have noticed that governments, and banks, have been printing money for the last 40 years without there being any effect on inflation. All that has happened is that the amount of debt in the world has exploded. 

[The Stationmaster]

14 hours ago, Zomboid said:

4 days into indefinite working from home, and whilst I technically can work from home, as soon as commuting is a responsible thing to do I'll be back in the office almost every day. How home workers cope with the isolation I really don't know.

Going way OT, sorry, my son has been working from home for just over a week but is in touch regularly by Skype with all his regular contacts in the company in various other countries so nothing different there although the company cancelled all international travel about a month back so face-to-face meetings have had to end.  But he is having to take a walk every day just to get out of the house for a while and he did dig part of the veg patch yesterday (first time ever!).