More model ideas

[newbryford]

3 hours ago, DRS Crewe On A Mission said:

I’m back again with another idea…

 

What about the newish Freightliner MWA box wagons. These were the ones that were brought in as an upgrade/replacement for some of the Freightliner MJA box wagons that Dapol have already produced in OO. 
 

The MWA wagons have been around for a few years already and have been hauled by FL 66s and 70s. 
 

I’m assuming Dapol aren’t producing the MWA wagons because I think we would have seen them produced or at least announced by now. 

 

I would expect Revolution to be on the case with the box wagons....... JNA/MWA etc.

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

50 minutes ago, newbryford said:

 

I would expect Revolution to be on the case with the box wagons....... JNA/MWA etc.

You could well be right Mick. 
 

I just thought I would suggest them on this thread because they have been in service for a few years now and we haven’t seen an announcement from any manufacturer. It just made me think that maybe no one is working on this wagon at the moment. 
 

Kind Regards, 

 

Danny. 

[Dunsignalling]

10 hours ago, andythenorth said:

Ffestiniog Horse Dandy in RTR 009?

 

https://dundasmodels.co.uk/webstore/index.php/hikashop-menu-for-module-108/product/5782-festiniog-railway-horse-dandy-wagon-out-of-stock

 

I'm sure it would sell millions.

 

Think of all the different horse colours.

 

DCC sound effects.

 

Miniature rocking horse crap dispenser.

 

I think a working one would need to be proved in G Scale first, though.😉

[No Decorum]

18 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

 

I think a working one would need to be proved in G Scale first, though.😉

G or GG Scale? 😀

[Dunsignalling]

5 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

G or GG Scale? 😀

Oh, How I wish I'd thought of that.....

 

I'm not properly awake yet!

 

John

Edited August 27, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Covkid]

On 24/08/2022 at 22:32, GordonC said:

On thinking about it, I'm a little surprised we've never seen Gatwick Express coaches as RTR. Maybe its more Bachmann terrain for the missing GLV, but in terms of 'prestige' trains in the area its something you rarely see modelled

 

On 24/08/2022 at 22:59, Wickham Green too said:

There's precious little on the market for them to run alongside though - I can only think of VEPs, ....... no CIG/BIGs, 319s, 377s or 455s .....

 

Having had a thunk overnight I can add 2EPBs, 2Hs, occasional 4CEPs and possibly 2HAPs to the availability list ( plus 33s, 47s and coaching stock ) .............. plus 3Ds and innumerable other EPB variants to the 'missing' list.

 

From memory the Gatex coaches were ex WCML Mk2Fs with a few minor differences like bar couplings and SR style high level pipes and jumpers. On that basis I am surprised Hornby have wafted some new paint over their "coffins" and the ex Lima 73.  The problem would be the MLV at the other end which was a heavily converted 2HAP motor coach IIRC. 

[maico]

Metal body BR Standard Class 4 2-6-4T

 

It's possible Hornby Dublo could offer an updated version but that would be an expensive limited run of 500...

 

Edited August 29, 2022 by maico

[atherton]

I remember a rake of Gatwick Express mark 2's rolling into Feilding station....only 12,000km away from home. Pity nobody does a Kiwirail DL diesel to pull them, they looked good behind the big red beast!

 

[TomScrut]

On 26/08/2022 at 19:54, DRS Crewe On A Mission said:

What about the newish Freightliner MWA box wagons. These were the ones that were brought in as an upgrade/replacement for some of the Freightliner MJA box wagons that Dapol have already produced in OO. 
 

The MWA wagons have been around for a few years already and have been hauled by FL 66s and 70s.

 

The only negative I would have to say about this is how many different types of present day/recent aggregate wagons do we need? At the moment the following are available (or would be if another run was done), excluding Network Rail stuff (DB/EWS branded wagons used on their runs too) which is a different use. Bear in mind that hoppers and boxes get used interchangeably on some routes.

 

HIA - Freightliner - Dapol

MJA -Freightliner and GBRF - Dapol

JNA - Pretty much everybody - Revolution

HYA - GBRF - Accurascale

HOA - Pretty much everybody - Revolution

Bardon/AI JGA - GBRF? - Cavalex (although not sure they are doing a recent livery)

Nacco JGA - Freightliner or GBRF - Bachmann (not been done for a while)

JHA - Freightliner - Dapol (not sure a present day livery is on theirs?)

 

I have probably forgotten some. I have the 4 in bold, and so I don't feel I need any more of this type of wagon in all honesty! I wonder if a lot of the market feels the same.

Edited August 30, 2022 by TomScrut

[andythenorth]

40 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

The only negative I would have to say about this is how many different types of present day/recent aggregate wagons do we need?

The CAIB / Procor PXAs as used for TML, Yeoman, other spot hire are on my wish list 🙂

[virginhst539]

7 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

The only negative I would have to say about this is how many different types of present day/recent aggregate wagons do we need? At the moment the following are available (or would be if another run was done), excluding Network Rail stuff (DB/EWS branded wagons used on their runs too) which is a different use. Bear in mind that hoppers and boxes get used interchangeably on some routes.

 

HIA - Freightliner - Dapol

MJA -Freightliner and GBRF - Dapol

JNA - Pretty much everybody - Revolution

HYA - GBRF - Accurascale

HOA - Pretty much everybody - Revolution

Bardon/AI JGA - GBRF? - Cavalex (although not sure they are doing a recent livery)

Nacco JGA - Freightliner or GBRF - Bachmann (not been done for a while)

 

I have probably forgotten some. I have the 4 in bold, and so I don't feel I need any more of this type of wagon in all honesty! I wonder if a lot of the market feels the same.

Open wagons seem very well catered for... PCA VEE tanks however are low hanging fruit crying out for an up date model.

 

I think other than that the only other modern cement wagon not covered would be the JGAs which are rather nice looking wagons.

 

Another option which could be a good money maker if licensing could be secured would be the Wascosa modular infrastructure wagons. four variations so far with it essentially being a intermodal wagon with flat, box and stanchioned modules. 

[Kelly]

NER P4/P7 and NCB hopper wagons would probably be a good option, especially with the variety of NCB locomotives being produced in recent years (Hornby, Hattons, Dapol etc).  They were both long lasting and a pack of 4 would probably be good for a number of potential small layout plans (including my own admittedly!). Coupled with a suitable NCB industrial locomotive with widespread use it could be a joined up thinking success I think.

[TomScrut]

6 minutes ago, virginhst539 said:

I think other than that the only other modern cement wagon not covered would be the JGAs which are rather nice looking wagons.

 

Another option which could be a good money maker if licensing could be secured would be the Wascosa modular infrastructure wagons. four variations so far with it essentially being a intermodal wagon with flat, box and stanchioned modules. 

 

I agree with both of these points, the JGA cement wagons look really good and between Bachmann not making JPAs very often* and other outdated toolings it only leaves the AS PCA as a good modern cement wagon that is readily available. And I do find the idea of just having loads of PCA variants a bit boring when there are a few bogie cement wagons that could be done.

 

In terms of the Wascosa wagons, Network Rail stuff tends to do well (look how many IOA or JNA Falcon runs Dapol have done), partially because of the interest that yellow stuff seems to bring but also because you do not have to think about what to pull them with. If it is a goods/mixed traffic loco of relevant era then it will probably have pulled/will pull them at some point.

 

*I know Bachmann have Colas/Tarmac JPAs available from the CC, but it was the first release in a long time and they are £65 each

[Covkid]

1 hour ago, Kelly said:

NER P4/P7 and NCB hopper wagons would probably be a good option, especially with the variety of NCB locomotives being produced in recent years (Hornby, Hattons, Dapol etc).  They were both long lasting and a pack of 4 would probably be good for a number of potential small layout plans (including my own admittedly!). Coupled with a suitable NCB industrial locomotive with widespread use it could be a joined up thinking success I think.

Would they intermingle with the chaldrons Kelly ?

Not clued up on the NER 

[Islesy]

4 hours ago, Covkid said:

Would they intermingle with the chaldrons Kelly ?

Not clued up on the NER 

Evolutionary @Covkid the P4s were the next iteration, which were then superseded by the P6s and P7s, which were in turn superseded by the 21 tonners.

The Chaldrons would be concurrent with both (in ever decreasing numbers), but would have been used for different purposes within the colliery environments.

[virginhst539]

6 hours ago, TomScrut said:

*I know Bachmann have Colas/Tarmac JPAs available from the CC, but it was the first release in a long time and they are £65 each

 

As far as PCAs go the Vee barrel ones can run with the JPAs, accura PCAs, Heljan KVAs and the Bachmann PCAs. Add on to this weathering and you have yourself a rather nice train with some good variation between wagons. 

 

As for the latest Bachmann ones there are a number of things missing or not quite right compaired to the prototype which would probably deserve a post of its own on there section on rmweb. But then again for the majority they are probably spot on where i work the 1/1 scale ones and noticed them fairly quickly

[rprodgers]

What about considering an original air smoothed Bulleid light pacific WC/ BofB?
 

The Hornby one was never the best.

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

17 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

The only negative I would have to say about this is how many different types of present day/recent aggregate wagons do we need? At the moment the following are available (or would be if another run was done), excluding Network Rail stuff (DB/EWS branded wagons used on their runs too) which is a different use. Bear in mind that hoppers and boxes get used interchangeably on some routes.

 

HIA - Freightliner - Dapol

MJA -Freightliner and GBRF - Dapol

JNA - Pretty much everybody - Revolution

HYA - GBRF - Accurascale

HOA - Pretty much everybody - Revolution

Bardon/AI JGA - GBRF? - Cavalex (although not sure they are doing a recent livery)

Nacco JGA - Freightliner or GBRF - Bachmann (not been done for a while)

JHA - Freightliner - Dapol (not sure a present day livery is on theirs?)

 

I have probably forgotten some. I have the 4 in bold, and so I don't feel I need any more of this type of wagon in all honesty! I wonder if a lot of the market feels the same.

You have a point, in terms of box/aggregate wagons that are already available, I hadn’t thought of it that way. 
 

I was thinking of it more in a way of that box wagons have been and remain to be good sellers for Dapol and Revolution. Dapol offer the IOAs, MJAs as twin sets and JNAs along with the EWS liveried MOAs although these haven’t been released for a while, but they do have the tooling for them. Revolution also had success with the JNA-Ts which were released in several liveries in 2018/2019 I believe. 
 

As of yet Accurascale don’t have a modern image low or high sided box/aggregate wagon in there range. I just thought it would be a good way of progressing in terms of wagons as other manufacturers successfully have. Also we have a wide range of Bachmann and Hattons 66s and Bachmann 70s to run with FL liveried MWA wagons, that are already available, so in terms of appropriate traction to haul these wagons their is no problem on that front. 
 

I understand your point though, I suppose it just depends how sufficient Accurascale think the demand is. 
 

Kind Regards, 

 

Danny. 

 

[Dunsignalling]

5 hours ago, rprodgers said:

What about considering an original air smoothed Bulleid light pacific WC/ BofB?
 

The Hornby one was never the best.

 

TBF, by the standards of 2002, when it was launched, it was at least the equal of anything else on offer, but the standard of new models overtook it some years ago.

 

The only significant "improvement" carried out since the first releases has been the redesign of the tender to accommodate a DCC chip and speaker.

 

There is certainly an opening for a better model now.

 

John

Edited August 31, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Covkid]

7 hours ago, rprodgers said:

What about considering an original air smoothed Bulleid light pacific WC/ BofB?
The Hornby one was never the best.

 

1 hour ago, Dunsignalling said:

TBF, by the standards of 2002, when it was launched, it was at least the equal of anything else on offer, but the standard of new models overtook it some years ago.

 

The only significant "improvement" carried out since the first releases has been the redesign of the tender to accommodate a DCC chip and speaker.

 

There is certainly an opening for a better model now.

John

 

We are slap bang in the middle of the quandary - do they upgrade an existing model every generation, or does someone new come along with a fresh focus on it ? I cannot really answer that one, maybe because much as I would love a MN or WC, I struggle to qualify for anything other than Rule 1, much as I like the Bulleids. So would the "new" manufacturer want to tool up for a brand new BB/WC with the different cabs, tenders etc, at the risk of some existing owners not having the funds to upgrade from their existing collection ? Seems to be working with deltics, 31s, 37s and manors. The last item particularly as there was an existing Manor from Bachmann as well as the wide open goal mouth from competitors. 

 

Or would one of the dwindling  "never before RTRs" be more of as prize ? Not a preference for me but I always though the K class mogul was an attractive loco.  Perhaps it is an aspiration of a competitor who has recently developed a range of pre grouping Southern models.     

[Dunsignalling]

52 minutes ago, Covkid said:

 

 

We are slap bang in the middle of the quandary - do they upgrade an existing model every generation, or does someone new come along with a fresh focus on it ? I cannot really answer that one, maybe because much as I would love a MN or WC, I struggle to qualify for anything other than Rule 1, much as I like the Bulleids. So would the "new" manufacturer want to tool up for a brand new BB/WC with the different cabs, tenders etc, at the risk of some existing owners not having the funds to upgrade from their existing collection ? Seems to be working with deltics, 31s, 37s and manors. The last item particularly as there was an existing Manor from Bachmann as well as the wide open goal mouth from competitors. 

 

Or would one of the dwindling  "never before RTRs" be more of as prize ? Not a preference for me but I always though the K class mogul was an attractive loco.  Perhaps it is an aspiration of a competitor who has recently developed a range of pre grouping Southern models.     

You can say exactly the same things about all the diesel classes that were built in similar or greater numbers to the Bulleid Light Pacifics. Some of those have been (or are about to be) upgraded or superseded by better models from competitors three or four times since 2002.

 

It's not primarily a matter of money, IMHO, the sticking point is whether potential buyers consider the new model represents a sufficient improvement over what they already have. The common diesels must be nearing the limits of that by now....

 

I have a sizeable fleet of WC/BB locos (in both states) but have stopped buying new Hornby ones due to their stagnation on a very limited number of combinations or variations. I've bought three non-runners in the past few months that I will be  combining and adapting to fill gaps, leaving a residue of hard-to-get spare parts. 

 

Whilst I wouldn't replace most of the Hornby locos I've previously "worked over", I have cash waiting for more and better to assist in abolishing my "pending pile".

 

FWIW, Bachmann hasn't made a Manor for at least a decade, and none with other than their old split chassis technology. While converting one to DCC-operation isn't impossible, it does require a level of expertise. 

 

John

Edited August 31, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[TomScrut]

9 hours ago, DRS Crewe On A Mission said:

along with the EWS liveried MOAs although these haven’t been released for a while, but they do have the tooling for them

 

Just a note that anyone wanting MOAs or MBAs is best off looking at the Bachmann ones IIRC, far better than the Dapol ones.

 

9 hours ago, DRS Crewe On A Mission said:

I understand your point though, I suppose it just depends how sufficient Accurascale think the demand is. 

 

Exactly, I wasn't saying it was a bad suggestion in terms of what it was, more questioning how many people would want them. If I had a bottomless pit of money and more storage sidings I'd be keen.

 

3 hours ago, Covkid said:

at the risk of some existing owners not having the funds to upgrade from their existing collection ? Seems to be working with deltics, 31s, 37s and manors.

 

I think that is the main difficulty. I have an AS 55, because I never had a 55 before (Bachmann one wasn't good enough IMO for something so never got one of those), likewise the 31 as Hornby hasn't made one relevant for my layout. So for me it is only the 37 I am in a position of needing to consider replacement. The 5 AS ones I have on order do not conflict with my Bachmann ones, but if AS announce Colas or WCRC next run then I have a decision to make. I am half tempted to flog my 2 WCRC 37s anyway to maximise value as I will be very surprised if AS don't do these eventually!

[Francis deWeck]

On 27/08/2022 at 08:04, Dunsignalling said:

Oh, How I wish I'd thought of that.....

 

I'm not properly awake yet!

 

John

Must be very nagging to miss that one?

[DRS Crewe On A Mission]

8 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

Just a note that anyone wanting MOAs or MBAs is best off looking at the Bachmann ones IIRC, far better than the Dapol ones.

 

 

Exactly, I wasn't saying it was a bad suggestion in terms of what it was, more questioning how many people would want them. If I had a bottomless pit of money and more storage sidings I'd be keen.

 

 

I think that is the main difficulty. I have an AS 55, because I never had a 55 before (Bachmann one wasn't good enough IMO for something so never got one of those), likewise the 31 as Hornby hasn't made one relevant for my layout. So for me it is only the 37 I am in a position of needing to consider replacement. The 5 AS ones I have on order do not conflict with my Bachmann ones, but if AS announce Colas or WCRC next run then I have a decision to make. I am half tempted to flog my 2 WCRC 37s anyway to maximise value as I will be very surprised if AS don't do these eventually!

I totally get your view and you make a good point. I suppose the good thing is is even if Accurascale wanted to produce the MWA tomorrow it most likely wouldn’t be with us until early 2024. That gives time for the demand for wagons to increase, especially box/aggregate wagons which as you say have already been produced by other manufacturers. 
 

Kind Regards, 

 

Danny. 

[Kelly]

I'd imagine the BoB/WC/MN would be seen by Simon as a range staple like they viewed the Terrier, so anyone proposing a new one has to weigh up if there is already one being worked on by Hornby, and if Simon views it as strongly as the Terrier, then they'd go ahead regardless of competition.

 

On mentioning the Manor, didn't Dapol just release a new version?