Aston On Clun. A forgotten Great Western outpost.

[MrWolf]

13 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

Not wishing to distract Rob from his modelling nor wanting to stray into contentious areas. The point I was making was in relation to the size and number of stations and how they related to the potential profits they offered. It was in some ways the same for sending expeditions to places like America or the far East. Only this time the risk wasn't perceived as being only something the very rich could afford. Hence the bottom up explaination.

 In terms of the carbon cost well anything has a cost we just don't see it as that at the time. Like nuclear power. The UK decided the cost was too much. The French didn't and now they have cheaper power. It's whether the costs can be borne by an individual or a state or a planet for that matter.

 

Sorry Rob but this your fault for not doing any modelling.

 

 

 

Which has reminded me of this. They're having to buy in power.

 

https://news.sky.com/story/nearly-half-of-frances-nuclear-reactors-taken-offline-adding-to-electricity-demand-on-european-grid-12600662

[Alister_G]

2 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

The UK only contributes 1.1% of the world's carbon emissions.

 

That may be true now, but of course that's because over the course of last century nearly all of our manufacturing and industrial processes have been outsourced to other countries. I suspect that in 1922 we would have been nearer to China's present level...

 

Al.

[Winslow Boy]

8 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

 

Which has reminded me of this. They're having to buy in power.

 

https://news.sky.com/story/nearly-half-of-frances-nuclear-reactors-taken-offline-adding-to-electricity-demand-on-european-grid-12600662

 

Now that is interesting and not something said out loud or loudly enough I think.

 

I think the point is whatever you do, there will always be a cost. You could though say would their have been the rockets if politics hadn't got involved. I think their would have been but what would the cost have been. A lot of things don't get done/built/created unless there is a power behind them and finance or greed? will always be a very powerful motivator. I don't think Mr Musk is sending rockets to mars just because he's concerned that we might all die in the next pandemic he sees a business opportunity. Is that greed though? I don't know and whether the cost is ours - we buy things from Amazon- or his it's motivating him to do it.

[MrWolf]

That's something I hear a lot about Britain's industrial revolution Al, but I look at it this way.

 

Not when you consider the size of our country and the population, particularly at that time.

Even as a percentage of the global population.

Plus, one hundred years later, we know far more about the effects.

The middle class white intelligentsia guilt of empire arguments don't hold water.

For instance when one criticizes the regime in Zimbabwe, the immediate response from certain quarters is to bring up Cecil Rhodes, yadda yadda. They're been parroting that kind of thing since the sixth form.

My response to that is if we say what we did 100, 200, 300 years ago is wrong, why should we tolerate someone else doing the same thing now? 

 

That means a lot of people died for nothing all over the world.

 

I have a lot of what might be considered as "green" views, but I get sick of hearing greens refusing to even discuss the huge amount of damage being done to the planet by anyone outside of the "Western" world.

 

Is it out of fear? Monetary agendas? Political and ideological bias about shifting the balance of world power?

 

Or all three?

 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2022 by MrWolf

[Alister_G]

3 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

I have a lot of what might be considered as "green" views, but I get sick of hearing greens refusing to even discuss the huge amount of damage being done to the planet by anyone outside of the "Western" world.

 

It always amuses me to hear greens extolling the virtues of the "untouched" countryside. There aren't many places, if any in the UK that have "natural" countryside, what we have is the result of millennia of man-made interference, from agriculture, industry or just occupation.

 

However, this is all getting a bit close to being considered "political" so I'm not going to comment further.

 

Al.

[Winslow Boy]

What irritates me about the green agenda is the way it protrays man's use of 'chemicals' as being bad. We are made from chemicals and we need them to survive. So saying something is free of chemicals is like saying something is made of air. It is a symphamatic of how science is seen and how art is much gentler. Now don't get me wrong but it does seem as if we have forgotten our history - first industrialise country, and can 'cancel it' in order to avoid seeing the positives it gave us.

[Winslow Boy]

And on that note I'm off to bed and dream about panniers.

 

Night all.

[Alister_G]

1 minute ago, Winslow Boy said:

And on that note I'm off to bed and dream about panniers.

 

Night all.

 

A pannier never offends...

 

Al.

[MrWolf]

8 minutes ago, Alister_G said:

 

It always amuses me to hear greens extolling the virtues of the "untouched" countryside. There aren't many places, if any in the UK that have "natural" countryside, what we have is the result of millennia of man-made interference, from agriculture, industry or just occupation.

 

However, this is all getting a bit close to being considered "political" so I'm not going to comment further.

 

Al.

 

It's an interesting one concerning Britain's moorlands, which have developed their own (probably less diverse and certainly less carbon absorbing) ecosystem, yet are largely the results of deforestation.

 

As for politics and politicians, I despair of them.

 

I have also been informed that it's bedtime. 

 

[Alister_G]

Night Rob,

 

Al.

[MrWolf]

'Night Al, 'night Winslow.

 

 

[Regularity]

1 hour ago, Alister_G said:

That's a nonsensical argument, why would Victorian or even twentieth century entrepreneurs and innovators consider something which they knew nothing about, and could not, until the science existed to explore it. And what alternatives were available to them at the time?

That was my point. 
The limitations on knowledge at their point in time, meant that the full long-term cost wasn’t considered - it couldn’t be.

[Regularity]

1 hour ago, Alister_G said:

I don't think I ever postulated that as the only way, I was simply pointing up the historical record.

I didn’t say that you did, merely said that I certainly wasn’t.

[Regularity]

1 hour ago, MrWolf said:

For instance when one criticizes the regime in Zimbabwe, the immediate response from certain quarters is to bring up Cecil Rhodes, yadda yadda. They're been parroting that kind of thing since the sixth form.

My response to that is if we say what we did 100, 200, 300 years ago is wrong, why should we tolerate someone else doing the same thing now? 

 

That means a lot of people died for nothing all over the world.

I think that’s a really sound point, Rob. 
 

According to some, I am responsible for all the world’s ills, for I am a well-educated, middle age, middle class, white-skinned male. I am also English. That makes it worse! I have been told that I need to apologise for many things, or at least feel guilty. Yet 3 of my grandparents were disenfranchised at birth, and I haven’t personally colonised any foreign countries. Yes, lots of things were done which were wrong, according to contemporary sensibilities, which means it shouldn’t be tolerated elsewhere.

 

The point, to me, of history is that we understand how we got to where we are, and what things (looking back) we don’t wish to see repeated by us or anyone. 
 

I am reminded of the GCR and LNER motto at this point, which brings us back to railways…

 

[NHY 581]

Morning all. 

 

I am doing a spot of gentle research over breakfast. 

 

 

 

Rob. 

[Donw]

For all species the supply of food is a limiting factor. We are fortunate as a species that our innovation has enable us to increase our food supply. However the population will keep growing so there will always be some people starving and we need to increase supply. However that also has consequences for the planet such a cutting down forests for agriculture.

Now I dont know if the cause is lack of rainfall or the use of pesticides or something else but this year there seems to be a severe lack of insects and the birds are suffering. I imagine that we have had a large part to play in this.

 

We tried to live in a 'green' manner not being wastefull of resources for all of our life while seeing others that cared not a jot. The warnings were there back in 1973 when we married. Now we are getting lectured by people with blinkers on who think that buying a electric car will save the planet. 

 

Don

[MrWolf]

1 hour ago, NHY 581 said:

Morning all. 

 

I am doing a spot of gentle research over breakfast. 

 

 

 

Rob. 

 

I've been thinking about Eaton, further up the line, a single goods siding and a platform big enough for a couple of four wheelers.

 

A place where the station master's goats ate the timetables off the walls.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 3, 2022 by MrWolf

[NHY 581]

4 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

 

I've been thinking about Eaton, further up the line, a single goods siding and a platform big enough for a couple of four wheelers.

 

A place where the station master's goats ate the timetables off the walls.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Morning Rob,

 

Yes, Eaton does look rather nice. In essence, either could form the basis of an interesting expedition into the weedy world of bucolic backwaters inhabited by scruffy Panniers and even scruffier Dean Goods.............

 

Rob. 

[JustinDean]

25 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

 

I've been thinking about Eaton, further up the line, a single goods siding and a platform big enough for a couple of four wheelers.

 

A place where the station master's goats ate the timetables off the walls.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What’s the origins of that rather imposing signal? This is a location I’m not familiar with; would make a great little layout. 
 

Jay

[MrWolf]

That sounds very appealing, particularly if based on Horderley, with its goods loop for the stone traffic out of Lydham Heath, short platform opposite the station...

Not to mention that the trains could disappear off stage at either end through stands of trees. 

[JustinDean]

Ignore my last question - must remember that Google knows all. 
 

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/e/eaton/

 

 

[MrWolf]

4 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

What’s the origins of that rather imposing signal? This is a location I’m not familiar with; would make a great little layout. 
 

Jay

 

That's a real relic. It's a contraption known as a Station signal and said to probably date back to the 1860s when the line was built. 

IIRC  they were designed to show approaching trains that the station was clear to enter. There was never any other signalling on the line.

 

Impressive bits of wrought iron lattice work though.

 

 

Horderley looking south.

 

 

Bishops Castle, to the right of the engine shed 

[MrWolf]

12 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

Ignore my last question - must remember that Google knows all. 
 

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/e/eaton/

 

 

 

 

Too late!

[MrWolf]

I think that this bit of Eaton station has everything you'd expect to see on an @NHY 581layout. 

 

It's been there since before WWII.

 

 

You can just make out "B.C.Ry." on the left-hand side panel.

Edited June 3, 2022 by MrWolf

[NHY 581]

44 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

Ignore my last question - must remember that Google knows all. 
 

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/e/eaton/

 

 

 

 

That photo is cowing lush.............