Covid - coming out of Lockdown 3 - no politics, less opinion and more facts and information.

[great central]

Morning after the night before report.

Having had my jab around 5.30 yesterday evening I didn't particularly expect any side effects to kick in before this morning.

I slept quite well, probably due to not going to bed all that early. Getting up took a bit of effort but whether that's anything to do with the jab or simply being comfortable I can't say. The sun direct into your eyes does tend to rule out lying in bed too much.

Definitely feel a bit groggy and achy  now though, so taking it easy. Ate the second apple pie I bought on my way home last night, bit odd for breakfast I know. Stretching out on the settee in front of the stove having put some wood on to warm it up.

The apple pie is another story entirely, and no nothing to do with American Pie!

 

[hayfield]

Europe still seems to be in turmoil over its vaccine procurement and roll out. If the EU member states sign up to the EU system they agree not to order any of the EU chosen makes separately. Though member states can order separately makes not being bought by the scheme, for instance Poland buying the Sputnik version. Germany in November ordered directly 300m Pfizer doses in competition with the EU's own procurement system. Needless to say the EU refuses to comment on this. A German doctor is now pleading with Germany to authorise the Oxford AZ vaccine for the over 65's after the Scottish results were published. Apparently a million doses stockpiled and thousands have gone unused owing to the German stance

 

It also seems in France there is an issue with take up, with the President doing a big U turn on the Oxford vaccine plus seemingly a very laborious process to get the vaccines into peoples arms. Whilst  these issues persist many of the member countries are seeing infections rise sadly in some areas alarmingly. Many increasing lockdowns, also large numbers are under night time curfews. There are also rumblings about internal border restrictions being used by some member states

 

Certainly the quicker our manufacturing processes can help plug the gap the better. Holidaying in many popular spots are looking to be off limits this year, whilst we may be in a better position Europe looks to still be reeling under the pandemic.

 

Certainly a wise choice to go our own way, and looking at the heat maps there is a totally brighter picture in southern England, the midlands and north seem to be lagging behind, but then the south was suffering from the third wave first. Plus looking at East Anglia's vaccine take up for the over 70's being 95% in all areas with some rural areas even higher, lets hope younger ages are as eager 

[APOLLO]

Is there any substance in this news report ? Good news if so.

 

A single jab of either Pfizer or Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine is giving 90 PER CENT protection in huge boost to Britain's world-beating rollout

 

Just one vaccine shot reduces the risk of being hospitalised by Covid-19 by more than 90 per cent, according to stunning new findings.

Public health officials have told Ministers that the remarkable results apply for both the Pfizer and Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine, with the British jab proving slightly more effective.

It represents another huge boost to Britain’s world-beating vaccine rollout, which has now achieved nearly 20 million first injections. The hugely successful inoculation programme is threatened only by the small minority who are still refusing to have the jab.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9307729/Oxford-vaccine-effective-Pfizer-jab-new-figures-show.html

 

I week after my first AZ stab, all OK.

 

Brit15

[beast66606]

17 hours ago, beast66606 said:

 I now have an increasing ache in my arm, hopefully that will ease off soon (ish).

 

Update :

 

The ache in my arm got worse into the evening, to an "uncomfortable but not painful" level, but this morning it's more or less gone, however the tenderness has dramatically increased, I kept waking up every time my right shoulder went anywhere near the bed due to the pain and this morning, first thing, it was bad - it seems to now be easing off so fingers crossed it's getting better, 

In the scheme of things neither of these are anything to worry or grumble about - just sharing my Pfizer experience.

[Hobby]

11 minutes ago, great central said:

Morning after the night before report.

 

My wife gave me here update on the Pfizer jab from yesterday, sore arm sniffles, tired and Diabetes went up to 12 last night. But she also lots going on so difficult to judge.

 

4 minutes ago, APOLLO said:

Is there any substance in this news report ?

 

https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n523#:~:text=The results%2C available as a,73 to 99)%2C respectively.

[4630]

9 minutes ago, beast66606 said:

 

Update :

 

The ache in my arm got worse into the evening, to an "uncomfortable but not painful" level, but this morning it's more or less gone, however the tenderness has dramatically increased, I kept waking up every time my right shoulder went anywhere near the bed due to the pain and this morning, first thing, it was bad - it seems to now be easing off so fingers crossed it's getting better, 

Sounds as though your post-jab experience mirrors mine - I had my first Pfizer dose a couple of weeks ago - the tenderness I experienced in my arm gradually faded over 3-4 days.  No other effects experienced. 

Edited February 28, 2021 by 4630
missed a vital word out!

[great central]

I've just been walking around the garden for a few minutes. Made me wheeze quite a bit so I don't think I'll be doing much more today.

I can normally walk for miles by the way.

[hayfield]

34 minutes ago, APOLLO said:

Is there any substance in this news report ? Good news if so.

 

A single jab of either Pfizer or Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine is giving 90 PER CENT protection in huge boost to Britain's world-beating rollout

 

Just one vaccine shot reduces the risk of being hospitalised by Covid-19 by more than 90 per cent, according to stunning new findings.

Public health officials have told Ministers that the remarkable results apply for both the Pfizer and Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine, with the British jab proving slightly more effective.

It represents another huge boost to Britain’s world-beating vaccine rollout, which has now achieved nearly 20 million first injections. The hugely successful inoculation programme is threatened only by the small minority who are still refusing to have the jab.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9307729/Oxford-vaccine-effective-Pfizer-jab-new-figures-show.html

 

I week after my first AZ stab, all OK.

 

Brit15

 

27 minutes ago, Hobby said:

 

My wife gave me here update on the Pfizer jab from yesterday, sore arm sniffles, tired and Diabetes went up to 12 last night. But she also lots going on so difficult to judge.

 

 

https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n523#:~:text=The results%2C available as a,73 to 99)%2C respectively.

 

This certainly is very good news but the 90% figures are the risk of being hospitalised, not not catching the virus, which must be lower as some of those vaccinated were already infected. No doubt over the coming weeks, both the results of not catching the virus and not spreading it will become clearer. And as more are vaccinated the infection numbers will reduce even more  as there will be less people with no protection to it

 

As for the sceptics there is far more chance of being adversely affected from covid that a reaction to the vaccine

[Pete the Elaner]

Hopefully the vaccine reactions were are hearing about are less severe that the reactions to the virus itself which they are supposed to prevent?

 

The good news is that new detected infections are still falling & deaths are dropping more rapidly then during the 1st lockdown. This is with cooler & more virus-friendly weather too.

I get the impression many are relaxing with distancing etc though. While running yesterday, I noticed the queue outside my local Indian take-away looked more like a close huddle & I went to a DIY store the other day for the first time in months (because my kitchen light had blown so it was a choice of darkness or go shopping). I just got a feeling that the DIY store was full of customers shopping like normal, not doing essentials only).

 

Now is not the time to be relaxing. That would be like coasting through a tunnel because we can see the end portal. We need to keep things up to get there faster.

[john new]

Interesting positive societal side effect reported here for a good chunk of society, especially those already retired, namely lockdown is assisting with monetary savings.

 

I have noticed it, I have finally managed to get my overly large credit card balance down and this year pay outright rather than put the annual insurance renewal on the card (why it got too high in the first place). We also got a major house roof repair done without recourse to a loan. 
 

The reduced interest from paying the card down means more free money for railway purchases so good for the hobby. Kernow, Rails, Monk Bar Models and NRM have already benefited along with other smaller suppliers. Possibly accounts for the boom hobby manufactures have reported.

 

Sad for those on the other side of the equation though, I doubt my wife and I will continue this trend post lockdown as we are missing the trips, but a pointer to something to think about.

 

Edited February 28, 2021 by john new
Punctuation corrected and minor revision for clarity.

[Hobby]

1 hour ago, hayfield said:

 

 

This certainly is very good news but the 90% figures are the risk of being hospitalised, not not catching the virus,

 

My understanding is that the vaccine doesn't stop you getting it but what it does is have your immune system up and running and ready to tackle it, and so reduce hospitalizations so it's doing its job. The flu vaccine does the same. Eventually the hope will be that it mutates to a less harmful version and that most humans will have some sort of resistance so it won't be as harmful. 

 

1 hour ago, Pete the Elaner said:

Hopefully the vaccine reactions were are hearing about are less severe that the reactions to the virus itself which they are supposed to prevent? 

 

Of course they are. Ask any older person who's had covid... And survived... 

[62613]

I must say that our local health authority (Tameside and Glossop) has, with a few exceptions, run an extremely efficient campaign. They seem to have been ahead of everyone else right the way through. I am 67, and had mine about 3 weeks ago (10th February), when the news was talking about the 70 to 75s getting theirs. In January, they had to be ordered to stop administering second jabs to the over 80s.

 

As to my experience; drove over to a local sports centre, in at the correct time, sat on a socially - distanced seat in the sports hall. the jabs were administered by rows of seats by all the staff at once; they then when on to the next row once they were ready. After 10 minutes, and drove home. No side effects whatsoever. Pfizer vaccine

[rocor]

 

It seems we are seeing increasingly, references to Covid vaccine refuseniks. I am beginning to think that I could be considered under a new category, Covid vaccine forgotniks. The "book your coronavirus vaccine" letter arrived at the beginning of February, I opted for the "wait for your GP services to contact you, if they haven't already done so" option. Still waiting.

 

As a fit but fat 67 year old (one initial letter f word, probably cancels out the other on the "how healthy are you?" graph), I see that the under 50's will soon be due for their inoculations. Have I been missed?.

 

I shall have to contact my doctors surgery health centre this week to demand "where's my jab?".

 

 

 

 

[APOLLO]

8 minutes ago, rocor said:

 

It seems we are seeing increasingly, references to Covid vaccine refuseniks. I am beginning to think that I could be considered under a new category, Covid vaccine forgotniks. The "book your coronavirus vaccine" letter arrived at the beginning of February, I opted for the "wait for your GP services to contact you, if they haven't already done so" option. Still waiting.

 

As a fit but fat 67 year old (one initial letter f word, probably cancels out the other on the "how healthy are you?" graph), I see that the under 50's will soon be due for their inoculations. Have I been missed?.

 

I shall have to contact my doctors surgery health centre this week to demand "where's my jab?".

 

 

 

 

 

 I'd book online and be certain of a date - I did and also booked my second jab in May.

 

Brit15

[caradoc]

22 hours ago, Neil said:

The balance between the right not to be vaccinated vs the right to a safe society isn't easy to find. This particular passage sums up the dilemma and (I think) hits the right note.

 

Discussing compulsory vaccinations

 

" .....disastrous for workers who can’t have the jab on medical grounds, including pregnant women for whom it isn’t universally recommended, and people suffering from various medical conditions.

 

The 'pregnant women issue', if I may call it that, will be temporary, given that pregnancy only (!) lasts a maximum of 9 months, so every such woman will at some stage be able to be vaccinated safely. I was not aware of medical conditions making vaccination unsafe (as opposed to psychological conditions such as fear of needles); What are these, and what proportion of the population is affected ?

 

I agree that vaccination should not be compulsory, however might we reach a situation where the unvaccinated will be barred from certain activities; Those involving close contact with other people, such as taking part in, or watching, sport, or indeed any mass spectator event, including for example model railway exhibitions ? 

 

 

[John Harris]

4 hours ago, hayfield said:

 

Certainly a wise choice to go our own way, and looking at the heat maps there is a totally brighter picture in southern England, the midlands and north seem to be lagging behind, but then the south was suffering from the third wave first. Plus looking at East Anglia's vaccine take up for the over 70's being 95% in all areas with some rural areas even higher, lets hope younger ages are as eager 

 

Aside from the EU's internal politics on drug procurement, the UK's big advantage is the NHS.

 

The NHS (Covid aside) spends around £16 billion a year on drug procurement, as an organisation it's used to dealing with drug companies.  Many countries don't even have a centralised audit of how much is spent on drugs.

 

Anyone born since 1948 in the UK would be used to the NHS and getting vaccinated, albeit a while ago in many cases!  Aside from my flu jab late last year, my last injection in my arm was my BCG at school, around 50 years ago.  It is no surprise to me that vaccine take-up is good in the UK.

 

Well done us!

 

jch

[beast66606]

4 hours ago, beast66606 said:

 

Update :

 

The ache in my arm got worse into the evening, to an "uncomfortable but not painful" level, but this morning it's more or less gone, however the tenderness has dramatically increased, I kept waking up every time my right shoulder went anywhere near the bed due to the pain and this morning, first thing, it was bad - it seems to now be easing off so fingers crossed it's getting better, 

In the scheme of things neither of these are anything to worry or grumble about - just sharing my Pfizer experience.

 

Final Update :

 

Arm tenderness is going, now requires significant pressure to feel it.

Went for a walk to watch the hares getting ready for their boxing matches, 2.5 miles, no real issues, I feel slightly more tired than normal, but that could be the pork pie I had for lunch yesterday

[eastglosmog]

As a 69 year old, I had mine on Friday afternoon (Oxford AZ, this is Oxfordshire after all).  Bit of a sore arm, low level headache and tiredness on Saturday (indications it is working, I hope) but all OK today (I managed a 13 mile circuit around the forest this morning).  Operation was very slick, in and out in under 15 minutes.   Bit surprised there were not any checks to see if I had a temperature before being let in (unlike Dentists and vets).

One slight problem, my cat didn't want to know me when I got home (probably smelt all wrong and I had fed her before going).  I had to wait for attention until 3:30 in the morning when she came and jumped on my bed!

[Neil]

4 hours ago, caradoc said:

 

The 'pregnant women issue', if I may call it that, will be temporary, given that pregnancy only (!) lasts a maximum of 9 months, so every such woman will at some stage be able to be vaccinated safely. I was not aware of medical conditions making vaccination unsafe (as opposed to psychological conditions such as fear of needles); What are these, and what proportion of the population is affected ?

 

I agree that vaccination should not be compulsory, however might we reach a situation where the unvaccinated will be barred from certain activities; Those involving close contact with other people, such as taking part in, or watching, sport, or indeed any mass spectator event, including for example model railway exhibitions ? 

 

 

 

Re. those who might not be able to tolerate the vaccine I was quoting directly from the article. Your question piqued my curiosity so I've done a bit of looking around and have found this advice from the NHS. The relevant passages on pregnancy and breastfeeding are here:

 

"There's no evidence the COVID-19 vaccine is unsafe if you're pregnant. But more evidence is needed before you can routinely be offered it.

The JCVI has updated its advice to recommend you may be able to have the vaccine if you're pregnant and:

at high risk of getting coronavirus because of where you work

have a health condition that means you're at high risk of serious complications of coronavirus

You can have the COVID-19 vaccine if you're breastfeeding.

Speak to a healthcare professional before you have the vaccination. They will discuss the benefits and risks with you."

 

& on allergic reactions here:

 

"Tell healthcare staff before you are vaccinated if you've ever had a serious allergic reaction.

You should not have the COVID-19 vaccine if you have ever had a serious allergic reaction (including anaphylaxis) to:

a previous dose of the same vaccine

any of the ingredients in the vaccine

Serious allergic reactions are rare. If you do have a reaction to the vaccine, it usually happens in minutes. Staff giving the vaccine are trained to deal with allergic reactions and treat them immediately."

 

I doubt that any of us are qualified to advise others on these points, but we don't need to as the key advice is contained within both. "Speak to a healthcare professional" & "tell healthcare staff if you've ever had a serious allergic reaction".

 

 

[Pete the Elaner]

4 hours ago, caradoc said:

 

I agree that vaccination should not be compulsory, however might we reach a situation where the unvaccinated will be barred from certain activities; Those involving close contact with other people, such as taking part in, or watching, sport, or indeed any mass spectator event, including for example model railway exhibitions ? 

 

 

So those refusing the vaccination are effectively barring themselves from enjoying non-compulsory activities?

Seems fair to me.

[boxbrownie]

I had to wait 15 minutes in a “recovery area” after my AZ jab because I had anaphylactic (blues and twos) reaction to pistachio nuts in a biscuit a few years ago, but both of us had absolutely no reaction at all, not even a sore arm.

[TheQ]

As I've mentioned before pfizer jab Thursday, 

But not mentioned,

Sore arm Friday no other effects.

No pain at all Saturday or today. Same applies to SWMBO.

 

The covidiots were out due to the nice weather, police fined 8 at a nearby beach to us, some came from Peterborough 95miles away.. Many others from nearer give warnings. Same happened up at Hunstanton 20 fines issued to distant travellers, warnings to others. The traffic wardens were busy too, issuing tickets to people parking in, closed because of the virus, car parks .

[john new]

22 hours ago, Neil said:

 

Re. those who might not be able to tolerate the vaccine I was quoting directly from the article. Your question piqued my curiosity so I've done a bit of looking around and have found this advice from the NHS. The relevant passages on pregnancy and breastfeeding are here:

 

"There's no evidence the COVID-19 vaccine is unsafe if you're pregnant. But more evidence is needed before you can routinely be offered it.

The JCVI has updated its advice to recommend you may be able to have the vaccine if you're pregnant and:

at high risk of getting coronavirus because of where you work

have a health condition that means you're at high risk of serious complications of coronavirus

You can have the COVID-19 vaccine if you're breastfeeding.

Speak to a healthcare professional before you have the vaccination. They will discuss the benefits and risks with you."

 

& on allergic reactions here:

 

"Tell healthcare staff before you are vaccinated if you've ever had a serious allergic reaction.

You should not have the COVID-19 vaccine if you have ever had a serious allergic reaction (including anaphylaxis) to:

a previous dose of the same vaccine

any of the ingredients in the vaccine

Serious allergic reactions are rare. If you do have a reaction to the vaccine, it usually happens in minutes. Staff giving the vaccine are trained to deal with allergic reactions and treat them immediately."

 

I doubt that any of us are qualified to advise others on these points, but we don't need to as the key advice is contained within both. "Speak to a healthcare professional" & "tell healthcare staff if you've ever had a serious allergic reaction".

 

 

It is why the questions are asked when you go for your jab and the check list process works.

 

My sister was asked the questions, on disclosing she had a previous allergy reaction (which was now many years back), they decided the trigger cause* was on the risk list and she was re-scheduled for one of the other varieties. (She has now had it too).

 

I have allergies and take Aspirin for blood thinning, neither the allergies nor the Aspirin dosage are on the list to stop me having the AZ jab, and the process went on through. I suggest if you are on any regular meds take a photocopy of your prescription with you in case they ask/need to check.

 

* I can't remember definitely what it was but have a vague memory it was a wasp, bee or hornet bite but sufficiently strong a reaction she was hospitalised for checks from the whatever i was.

 

 

Edited March 1, 2021 by john new
Spotted a couple of typos.

[62613]

1 hour ago, Neil said:

 

I doubt that any of us are qualified to advise others on these points, but we don't need to as the key advice is contained within both. "Speak to a healthcare professional" & "tell healthcare staff if you've ever had a serious allergic reaction".

 

When I had mine, the staff member doing the jab asked this question before our row was done

 

[Jonboy]

A relative is on medication that means they shouldn’t have the jab without further advice (list is high-dose corticosteroids, immunosuppressants or cancer medicines), they discovered this from the paperwork handed to them as leaving the vaccination centre and read at home...