Electric, Hybrid and Alternative fuelled vehicles - News and Discussion

[StuAllen]

6 hours ago, Ian J. said:

And I wouldn't buy a second hand diesel ICE, as they're likely to get banned from town and city centres in the not too distant future.

I wouldn’t be sure about that, I drive a 5 year old Mercedes GLE, it has a 3 litre Diesel engine - not the greenest vehicle I know but it is comfortable and eats up motorway miles with ease. I needed to drive through the new Birmingham clean air zone in rush hour a couple of weeks ago and was shocked when I logged on to the website to pay the charge, there was no charge to pay apparently my car is clean enough not to pay a penalty. TBH I don’t understand why, I would have expected it to be at the top of the list of vehicles they want to ban. It just sends out a really confusing message.

[AndyID]

16 minutes ago, StuAllen said:

I wouldn’t be sure about that, I drive a 5 year old Mercedes GLE, it has a 3 litre Diesel engine - not the greenest vehicle I know but it is comfortable and eats up motorway miles with ease. I needed to drive through the new Birmingham clean air zone in rush hour a couple of weeks ago and was shocked when I logged on to the website to pay the charge, there was no charge to pay apparently my car is clean enough not to pay a penalty. TBH I don’t understand why, I would have expected it to be at the top of the list of vehicles they want to ban. It just sends out a really confusing message.

 

There's a lot of really woolly thinking about diesels. Modern turbo-charged diesel engines are highly efficient which means they output less CO2 compared to petrol engines. The snag is, because of the higher temperatures,  diesels produce more smog generating molecules than petrol engines but that can be mitigated a lot by post combustion treatment.

 

In some areas efficiency should take priority over smog reduction but densely populated areas tend to have more smog. Smog is a local problem whereas CO2 production is a global problem. The two things should not be lumped together but it seems they frequently are.

[2ManySpams]

22 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

This is spot on.

The energy from the Sun arriving on the Earth, every second of every day, 365 days a year, provides something like millions of times the amount of energy the human race would ever need.

Ultimately, everything is or has been solar powered.

The fossil fuels we've been dependant on for thousands of years were all created from solar energy.

 

IIRC, it's reckoned that to power the entire USA (heating, cooling,  electricity, powering all transport etc,) would require a solar farm that is only about 50 miles x 50 miles in size.

Based on an average of 4 hours solar generation a day.

 

 

 

 

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But the downside to the solar argument is that it frequently forgets that a method of storing all the generated energy to match demand is required. The 50 X 50 mile solar array won't be generating much at night! The reliance on battery storage is holding things back at the moment and it's here that a breakthrough is needed. 

[Ian J.]

Molten salt systems are used to store solar energy during the day, and can be used to provide electricity overnight as the hot salt can be used to heat water to make steam to drive turbines. Not very efficient, but it's already being done in countries with a lot of hot sunny days.

[Ron Ron Ron]

2 hours ago, 2ManySpams said:

 

But the downside to the solar argument is that it frequently forgets that a method of storing all the generated energy to match demand is required. The 50 X 50 mile solar array won't be generating much at night! The reliance on battery storage is holding things back at the moment and it's here that a breakthrough is needed. 

 

I believe that calculation took into account storage and that an average of 4 hours of generation could deliver enough power for 27/7 demand.

 

As for grid storage, the use of grid batteries has a long way to go, only being in its infancy.

The grid providers are spending a lot of money in this area, but much more investment is needed, particularly at the local level.

 

 

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[Ron Ron Ron]

4 hours ago, StuAllen said:

I wouldn’t be sure about that, I drive a 5 year old Mercedes GLE, it has a 3 litre Diesel engine - not the greenest vehicle I know but it is comfortable and eats up motorway miles with ease. ........

 

That will be the same 3 litre V6 as in one of our Mercedes (a CLS350 Cdi), although not attached to a 4x4 drive train.

It's a very efficient and relatively clean engine, even as far as particulates go.

It isn't a big polluter or "gas guzzler".

 

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[StuAllen]

58 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

That will be the same 3 litre V6 as in one of our Mercedes (a CLS350 Cdi), although not attached to a 4x4 drive train.

It's a very efficient and relatively clean engine, even as far as particulates go.

It isn't a big polluter or "gas guzzler".

 

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It is, I had a CLS 350 before this one - the GLE is less fuel efficient particularly in towns, but as you say it does have the 4x4 drive train to deal with. On average they both do similar mileage per tank, but the tank in the GLE is 10 litres larger. The GLE does have AdBlue post combustion treatment so I guessing that must help. 
 

I do think we’ve arrived at the tipping point now, I know my next car (in 3-4 years time) will not be ICE or hybrid - it will be battery powered, probably an EQC that’s rolling off the production line now as we speak, and I’m sure I’m not alone in that thought process. I just hope that the infrastructure also improves, the range is acceptable now for most day trips, but not everyone can get home to charge overnight, you will still need to charge during your journey. I don’t mind that it might take half hour to charge, this fits with having a break in the journey to get a coffee, but there needs to be enough chargers, I just don’t  want to wait for some else to finish their coffee before being able to plug my car in. 

[Fenman]

50 minutes ago, StuAllen said:

… I know my next car (in 3-4 years time) will not be ICE or hybrid - it will be battery powered, probably an EQC that’s rolling off the production line now as we speak, …. 

Buying an EQC in 3-4 years time is a bold prediction. It seems to me the pace of innovation in EVs is already such that what is on sale today is unlikely to be your best choice at that time.
 

The EQC, for example, does not use a purpose-designed EV platform so it is spatially compromised by the need to fit on an ICE platform.

 

Perhaps even more significantly, we’re now seeing the arrival of “mid”-range EVs with 800v architecture — Ioniq 5 and Kia EV6 — whose charging rates beat even the previous market-leaders like Tesla, while leaving most other EVs standing.
 

As it happens, I don’t think charging away from home is the big deal that many others claim — most of us rarely drive in any one day further than the range of most new EVs (especially since 250-300 miles is the new “normal” range). But while range anxiety is a big deal in the minds of most of the marketplace, slower-charging EVs are at a significant disadvantage. 
 

With the new E and S class EVs Mercedes has now shown what it can do with purpose-designed EV platforms: I’d expect the next generation EQC to be a step-change over the current model (just as Hyundai’s 2nd generation Ioniq 5 is a step-change over their Kona). 

Fascinating times ahead. 
 

Paul

[Ron Ron Ron]

34 minutes ago, Fenman said:

Buying an EQC in 3-4 years time is a bold prediction. It seems to me the pace of innovation in EVs is already such that what is on sale today is unlikely to be your best choice at that time.......

 

Paul, I think Stu was talking about a car being produced today, purchased as a used car in 3-4 years time.

 

1 hour ago, StuAllen said:

.......I know my next car (in 3-4 years time) will not be ICE or hybrid - it will be battery powered, probably an EQC that’s rolling off the production line now as we speak......

 

 

 

36 minutes ago, Fenman said:

......The EQC, for example, does not use a purpose-designed EV platform so it is spatially compromised by the need to fit on an ICE platform.....

 

......With the new E and S class EVs Mercedes has now shown what it can do with purpose-designed EV platforms: I’d expect the next generation EQC to be a step-change over the current model (just as Hyundai’s 2nd generation Ioniq 5 is a step-change over their Kona). 

 

 

The current EQC (and EQA & EQB ) will be relatively short lived and almost certainly replaced by newer vehicles, based on dedicated EV platforms, in 3 or 4 years time.

 

Same with the Audi e-tron (the full fat version), which will also be replaced as soon as a dedicated platform is available.

The VW group are developing a larger platform than the MEB, called PPE (Premium Platform Electric), for larger and luxury vehicles in their various brand ranges.

 

 

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[StuAllen]

30 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

Paul, I think Stu was talking about a car being produced today, purchased as a used car in 3-4 years time.

 

Exactly that, obviously depends on the used car market at the time.

[idd15]

Currently on our 2nd charge/coffee/comfort break on our roadtrip to Suffolk. This stop is Instavolt and so far going well. First stop was at the new Rugby Gridserve services, truly brilliant. 12 super fast chargers and 12 Tesla chargers. Never seen so many EV's at once charging. Fortunately no queuing unlike the poor souls in ICE cars...

Idd

 

[Fenman]

1 hour ago, StuAllen said:

Exactly that, obviously depends on the used car market at the time.

Apologies for misunderstanding you. 
 

This morning I read a What Car? review in which the one year-old ID.4 (a car I liked when I drove it) was described as now being an “also ran”, so far had it been overtaken by newer rivals in its class. While last week a new Audi EV not on a purpose-designed platform was described in Car as being completely out-classed by rivals. Those reviews have clearly stuck in my mind. 
 

Paul

 

[StuAllen]

Paul - TBH you have a valid point so no need to apologise - change is happening quickly with EV’s, what will happen to those first released models will they be less desirable on the used car market? Does that make them cheaper to buy as they don’t have the right bells and whistles? Comparing it to the ICE market is there really much of difference between an ML or a GLE, I guess only time will tell in the long run.

[idd15]

24 minutes ago, StuAllen said:

Paul - TBH you have a valid point so no need to apologise - change is happening quickly with EV’s, what will happen to those first released models will they be less desirable on the used car market? Does that make them cheaper to buy as they don’t have the right bells and whistles? Comparing it to the ICE market is there really much of difference between an ML or a GLE, I guess only time will tell in the long run.

Your not wrong about rapid change. Was parked next to a Taycan at Rugby today. He was charging at four times the rate of my Leaf! 50 KwHr charging is a bit passé these days..

Idd

[Clive Mortimore]

With this weekend's panic buying of petrol, as I live by the coast I thought it would be a good idea to fill up with petrel, damn things keep flying off.

 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, idd15 said:

Your not wrong about rapid change. Was parked next to a Taycan at Rugby today. He was charging at four times the rate of my Leaf! 50 KwHr charging is a bit passé these days..

Idd

 

I can only charge at 30kW (actually seems to go a little over). Getting over 5 miles/kWh helps though.

[rocor]

5 hours ago, Fenman said:

Buying an EQC in 3-4 years time is a bold prediction. It seems to me the pace of innovation in EVs is already such that what is on sale today is unlikely to be your best choice at that time.
 

 

Paul

 

From the outlook of the buyer of a new EV. It is perhaps not good news.

 

Looked at from the perspective of both the buyer of used vehicles (often because they can not afford to buy new), and the overall transition to EV's, it is not so bad.

 

If you are buying a new ICE car, sucks is a word that comes to mind.

[idd15]

3 hours ago, 30801 said:

 

I can only charge at 30kW (actually seems to go a little over). Getting over 5 miles/kWh helps though.

That is a cracking level of efficiency and probably double what the Taycan can do! 

[Ron Ron Ron]

For the boy racers.

 

A Polestar 2 (with the latest updates and revisions) mixing it with supercars on the Nürburgring.

 

 

 

[Fenman]

This is nice: the overall “Car of the Year” in the new Parker’s Guide new car awards is the Skoda Enyaq. 
 

That’s not just “Electric Car of the Year”, but “Car of the Year”.

 

Runners-up in the EV category were the new Hyundai Ioniq 5 and the Tesla Model 3.

 

Paul

 

 

 

Edited September 28, 2021 by Fenman
Fat fingers

[Ron Ron Ron]

Polestar have outlined their plans to introduce more models into their range.

 

"Polestar to launch three new electric cars by 2024

Polestar 3 to make its debut next year, followed by the Polestar 4 coupe-SUV in 2023 and the Polestar 5 saloon in 2024"

 

 

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/polestar/356139/polestar-launch-three-new-electric-cars-2024

 

 

 

 

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[Ron Ron Ron]

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The VW Camper van is reborn...as an EV.

Shown here in retro style.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[Monkersson]

Rather ironic moment in work today...

 

A woman I work with has been going on and on about her first electric car purchase (a Kona) for weeks on end, due to get delivered on friday coming.  Yesterday she was going on about soon she'll be able to drive by and laugh at those queuing for petrol & diesel.

 

She received a call today informing her she wont be getting her car on friday, as the transporters cant get diesel due to the panic buying...

Edited September 28, 2021 by Monkersson

[AndyID]

And only $77,400

 

https://news.yahoo.com/lucid-start-deliveries-electric-cars-203309566.html

 

 

[Guest]

In SWBO's car yesterday. Fun times.