2023 Overall Feeling

[finelines]

Am I the only one to notice the similarities between the new Hornby control system and the Lego train control, unless it’s in the previous pages? I’ve always been attracted to what I understand is called “dead rail”. 
 

Roger

[Johan DC]

1 hour ago, finelines said:

Am I the only one to notice the similarities between the new Hornby control system and the Lego train control, unless it’s in the previous pages? I’ve always been attracted to what I understand is called “dead rail”. 
 

Roger

The only similarity is the use of BT for control. But you need two controllers for two trains, three for three etc. And unless there are new ones, the options are very limited. Also, LEGO is indeed dead rail, even plastic rail, both controller and train is battery powered. For TXS, the power still comes from the rails. However, a follow up with a battery powered loco is a possibility. No idea if Hornby is working on that.

[finelines]

Thanks for your reply. There are already people who use radio control from other models in model railways with rechargeable batteries but when I last heard about it it didn’t include sound. 

[vikingsmb]

I can assure you that the new 4f 0-6-0s are tender drive as its in the catalogue.

[frobisher]

1 hour ago, vikingsmb said:

I can assure you that the new 4f 0-6-0s are tender drive as its in the catalogue.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/sdjr-class-4f-0-6-0-no-61-era-2-r30285

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/sdjr-class-2p-4-4-0-no-46-era-2-r30286

 

The descriptions don't seem to indicate that at all; 

[Dunsignalling]

6 minutes ago, frobisher said:

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/sdjr-class-4f-0-6-0-no-61-era-2-r30285

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/sdjr-class-2p-4-4-0-no-46-era-2-r30286

 

The descriptions don't seem to indicate that at all; 

Though the illustrations look to be Photoshopped versions of ancient images that might well be of tender-drive models.

 

Can't Hornby afford a camera to take some new pictures, or is it just laziness?

Edited February 19, 2023 by Dunsignalling

[frobisher]

3 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Though the illustrations look to be Photoshopped versions of ancient images that might well be of tender-drive models.

 

Can't Hornby afford a camera to take some new pictures, or is it just laziness?

 

The problem is they have to photoshop anything that isn't actually in production so they will continue to work from previous stock side views hence the preponderance of models with ringfield bogies both Lima and Hornby.

 

This didn't stop people speculating that the Class 66 in TT would have a single bogie drive as a scaled down version of the ex-Lima tooling...

 

I also can't see any evidence that the new Railroad+ 67 has a single motor bogie, just that it has a 3 pole motor and simplified gearing compared to the main range one...

[Dunsignalling]

1 minute ago, frobisher said:

 

The problem is they have to photoshop anything that isn't actually in production so they will continue to work from previous stock side views hence the preponderance of models with ringfield bogies both Lima and Hornby.

 

This didn't stop people speculating that the Class 66 in TT would have a single bogie drive as a scaled down version of the ex-Lima tooling...

 

I also can't see any evidence that the new Railroad+ 67 has a single motor bogie, just that it has a 3 pole motor and simplified gearing compared to the main range one...

Yes, but they might at least start from an image of a current-specification model taken in 2019 rather than 1999!

[sawyermodels]

14 minutes ago, frobisher said:

 

The problem is they have to photoshop anything that isn't actually in production so they will continue to work from previous stock side views hence the preponderance of models with ringfield bogies both Lima and Hornby.

 

This didn't stop people speculating that the Class 66 in TT would have a single bogie drive as a scaled down version of the ex-Lima tooling...

 

I also can't see any evidence that the new Railroad+ 67 has a single motor bogie, just that it has a 3 pole motor and simplified gearing compared to the main range one...

The Railroad+ Class 67 is just one bogie drive with two traction tyres as I have seen inside whilst DCC fitting several for customers. A backwards step in my opinion especially when they spent time adding NEM couplings to the old twin bogie drive Lima chassis before doing a super detailed version. 

[frobisher]

2 minutes ago, sawyermodels said:

The Railroad+ Class 67 is just one bogie drive with two traction tyres as I have seen inside whilst DCC fitting several for customers. A backwards step in my opinion especially when they spent time adding NEM couplings to the old twin bogie drive Lima chassis before doing a super detailed version. 

 

I presume the lighting is gone as well?

[slow8dirty]

The 2012 tooling for the 4f was loco drive, looking closely you could see the motor protruding under the boiler. It wasn't that noticeable but  the contemporary Bachmann effort managed it without having gubbins where fresh air should've been. So I could understand a return to tender drive if they are incapable of improving on the loco drive one?

[meatloaf]

2 hours ago, vikingsmb said:

I can assure you that the new 4f 0-6-0s are tender drive as its in the catalogue.

I can assure you they are not tender drive.

 

Ive got 2 recent ones. One with factory fitted TTS and the railway children one. Both are loco drive.

[slow8dirty]

Hattons list the Railway children version as the 2012 tooling also. Hornby website has gone to the length of photoshopping clear air above the middle splasher. Bit disingenuous, it's not that big a deal from normal viewing distance.  

[sawyermodels]

31 minutes ago, frobisher said:

 

I presume the lighting is gone as well?

No the basic white lights are still present and working in direction of travel 

[vikingsmb]

5 hours ago, meatloaf said:

I can assure you they are not tender drive.

 

Ive got 2 recent ones. One with factory fitted TTS and the railway children one. Both are loco drive.

ok, how come the description mentions tender drive in the catalogue then?

[Johan DC]

21 minutes ago, vikingsmb said:

ok, how come the description mentions tender drive in the catalogue then?

It's Hornby. Seek no further. 

[slow8dirty]

20 minutes ago, vikingsmb said:

ok, how come the description mentions tender drive in the catalogue then?

Is there a different description/more info in the catalogue than the Hornby website? It's not clear on the website, it does say new for 2023 but not sure if that means new livery or new tool?

[vikingsmb]

8 minutes ago, slow8dirty said:

Is there a different description/more info in the catalogue than the Hornby website? It's not clear on the website, it does say new for 2023 but not sure if that means new livery or new tool?

according to the catalogue, it states both the SDJR and the railway children 4f's  are tender drive and I was gobsmacked when i was reading through my new catalogue, I only got it at 13:30 ish yesterday

Edited February 19, 2023 by vikingsmb

[vikingsmb]

11 minutes ago, scumcat said:

Best ask Hornby then

think I might actually, I will ring them tomorrow as off all next week on leave 😁

Edited February 19, 2023 by vikingsmb

[meatloaf]

No idea tbh but sams trains has reviewed both the TTS 4F and the railway children 4F and they are both loco drive as i said.

 

I cant see them retooling them to make them tender drive again, especially given the decoder sockets in the tender. 

 

The image in the catologue is a photoshop on an old airfix era model.

 

Also the catologue has been wrong before - it lists the 06 in the set as being DCC ready which it isnt., i think they said the same for the bagnall in the HM6000 set as well. Neither was the J94 a few years back despite the catologue saying it was.

[Hroth]

21 minutes ago, meatloaf said:

No idea tbh but sams trains has reviewed both the TTS 4F and the railway children 4F and they are both loco drive as i said.

 

I cant see them retooling them to make them tender drive again, especially given the decoder sockets in the tender. 

 

The image in the catologue is a photoshop on an old airfix era model.

 

Also the catologue has been wrong before - it lists the 06 in the set as being DCC ready which it isnt., i think they said the same for the bagnall in the HM6000 set as well. Neither was the J94 a few years back despite the catologue saying it was.

 

The J94 was the "Lord Phil" Austerity which was listed by Hornby as DCC Ready for a while, until it wasn't....

 

[Dunsignalling]

As others have cited, there is hands-on evidence that the Railway Children 4F (at least) does have loco drive, and it would seem perverse to do any others or the 2Ps differently.

 

I personally consider that most printed catalogues (and not just Hornby's) have long ceased to be a meaningful source of information on what products will be available during the year printed on the cover.  They nowadays mostly appeal to those who like to collect catalogues.

 

An argument is sometimes put forward that they act as a record of past products, but most recent editions have featured several new ones that didn't see the light of day during their currency. 

 

For well over a decade, each edition appears to have been largely cut-and-pasted from earlier ones, so it's perhaps not surprising that outdated information resurfaces occasionally.

 

Hornby clearly consider that the traditional printed catalogue still has a place, but (IMHO) a company of their iconic (damn, there goes another 50p) status could, and should, be producing something far more attractive, imaginative, and informative than an annual formulaic rehash of the one before, the one before that, and....

 

That would restore "the book" to real collectability, and I'd start buying them again instead of disappointedly flipping though copies bought by others....

 

If you must do it, Hornby, do it properly. The release of each one should be an event. 

 

John

Edited February 20, 2023 by Dunsignalling

[Flying Pig]

18 hours ago, slow8dirty said:

The 2012 tooling for the 4f was loco drive, looking closely you could see the motor protruding under the boiler. It wasn't that noticeable but  the contemporary Bachmann effort managed it without having gubbins where fresh air should've been. So I could understand a return to tender drive if they are incapable of improving on the loco drive one?

 

The 2012 loco drive 4F and 2P were from the Late Boggle period, just before the change to motors housed in the lower part of the boiler which allow the transmission to be hidden in the firebox.  Although that is now pretty much universal in new models, earlier Bachmann designs were just as boggly, the Super D being particularly egregious.  It would be quite possible for the 4F and 2P to be redesigned in the modern style, but it would require a completely new chassis and a change to the body moulding to accommodate the motor tray as part of the boiler.  I doubt that would be considered worthwhile in 40+ year old toolings (Airfix and Mainline respectively).

[slow8dirty]

23 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

 

The 2012 loco drive 4F and 2P were from the Late Boggle period, ....

 

Boggle! That was the engineering term that I just couldn't remember. I remember bogglegate now, as you say the airfix tooling is a very venerable and different starting point to the more recent baccy effort. Thanks FP.

[vikingsmb]

Just had it confirmed by Hornby as I spoke to the technical bods, 

it is loco drive (my apologies) and he said the catalogue is wrong, 

I'm a bit miffed about the 47 and warship not being ringfield type, however there is something in the pipeline regarding motors you can service again....... watch this space I think, I will buy the warship but will remotor it as its using lima tooling

Edited February 20, 2023 by vikingsmb