Joining Plywood Framed Baseboards Together

[27105]

Hi,

Could anyone please recommend the best way to align and join two 6mm plywood framed baseboards together using Brass Pattern Makers Dowels?

Many thanks

Mark

[Hroth]

This is what I did.

 

1. Clamp the baseboards together with the tops aligned.
2. Drill pilot holes (3mm would do) through the frames for correct alignment of the dowels.
3. Drill out the pilot holes using a diameter thats a smidgeon under that of the dowel bodies.
4. Press/glue the dowels into place.

 

Before doing it with your baseboards, have a trial run or two with scrap plywood.

 

Worked ok for me.

 

How are you going to hold the baseboards together when running trains?

 

 

[PaulRhB]

49 minutes ago, 27105 said:

Hi,

Could anyone please recommend the best way to align and join two 6mm plywood framed baseboards together using Brass Pattern Makers Dowels?

Many thanks

Mark

6mm ply isn’t going to support the dowels over time, glue some another layer of 6mm ply behind to get the depth up to 12mm then follow Hroth’s method. I’d make the additional ply pads at least 50mm square to spread the load. Just glue and clamp them on the rear of the joining face and give them a day or two to dry. 

[brossard]

My method was to use 12mm (1/2") Russian ply for my baseboard ends.  Good solid stuff that won't deform.  The sides are rubbish ply because all they have to is space the ends apart and it is light.  Tops are 3/16" good ply, a bit lighter than 1/2".

 

I used machined steel dowels:

 

 

However, I wouldn't recommend these because they require a precision that is beyond my skill and tools.  I managed to get them in but it took a lot of bodging.  Having got them in, they work well.

 

Brass dowels are probably a better bet as described above.

 

Oh yes, I use 3/8" carriage to hold the boards together.  2 or 3 depending on width.

 

John

Edited October 12, 2023 by brossard

[TheQ]

I'd recommend this type of adjustable toggle clamps to hold the units together in use.

[PaulRhB]

2 minutes ago, TheQ said:

I'd recommend this type of adjustable toggle clamps to hold the units together in use.

They don’t give precise alignment though unlike dowels. They are a valid alternative to bolts but not reliable for rail alignment. 😉
 

8 minutes ago, brossard said:

Brass dowels are probably a better bet as described above.

Brass dowels also don’t rust if the layout is stored in a shed or garage. I used these years ago and the layout rusted together and required prising apart! 😆

I’ve used brass ‘bullet’ dowels ever since. 

[doilum]

Assuming you have bought your boards pre assembled.

If not, end boards are best pilot frilled in pairs on the bench. Better still if you.have access to a pillar drill.

My preference is for.18mm.ply ends.

[TheQ]

Those toggle clamps are for holding the two boards together not for alignment, dowels do that. A lot quicker to do and undo than bolts, especially if you want to go home after a long day exhibiting at a show.

Edited October 12, 2023 by TheQ

[brossard]

35 minutes ago, TheQ said:

I'd recommend this type of adjustable toggle clamps to hold the units together in use.

 

Very good, I will have a think about using these.

 

John

[doilum]

14 minutes ago, brossard said:

 

Very good, I will have a think about using these.

 

John

Definitely need dowels with the spring type fasteners. We are using them on our friends Selby project. With 30 boards the speed of connection is appreciated.

[Free At Last]

1 hour ago, TheQ said:

Those toggle clamps are for holding the two boards together not for alignment, dowels do that. A lot quicker to do and undo than bolts, especially if you want to go home after a long day exhibiting at a show.

On my fiddle yard boards I also run my bus connections through them.

[ISW]

3 hours ago, 27105 said:

Could anyone please recommend the best way to align and join two 6mm plywood framed baseboards together

Whilst I'd never say that the method I employed is the 'best', it is cheap and easy to implement. However, you'd need to 'thicken' up your 6mm end plywood to something nearer 18mm.

 

All I did was:

1. Clamp the baseboards in correct alignment.
2. Drill 2 holes through the ends, gradually increasing the size from 6mm to ~9.6mm (just under 10mm).
3. In one baseboard insert 8mm 'tee' nuts (available from ScrewFix, ToolStation, etc)
4. In the other baseboard insert a ~18mm lengths of 10mm diameter tubing, inside diameter 8mm (this I cut off a 1m length I bought at B&Q)
5. Insert an 8mm diameter bolt (length to suit; I used 70mm & 50mm)
6. Using the bolt head, tighten the bolt into the 'tee' nut. This will help 'push' both the nut and tube into the respective wooden ends of the baseboard.

Here's a few photos to explain / clarify:

 

Components:

 

Assembled, 'tee' nut side:

 

Assembled, bolt side (I also put in a large washer to spread the load a bit):

 

Because the bolt is a 'snug' fit in the steel tube, the baseboards re-align themselves as you tighten them up.

 

All the parts are cheap and easily available. Well, it worked for me.

 

Ian

[brossard]

1 hour ago, doilum said:

Definitely need dowels with the spring type fasteners. We are using them on our friends Selby project. With 30 boards the speed of connection is appreciated.

 

As I mentioned I have the dowels in place.  I only have 4 boards but every bit of time saved is a good thing.

 

John

[27105]

All,

Many thanks for your replies and some very useful ideas.

Mark

[doilum]

13 hours ago, Free At Last said:

On my fiddle yard boards I also run my bus connections through them.

I prefer bolts with large washers screwed to the end boards. The bus bars terminate on the washers. Another dodgy cable eliminated.

[ISW]

59 minutes ago, doilum said:

I prefer bolts with large washers screwed to the end boards. The bus bars terminate on the washers. Another dodgy cable eliminated.

Does that mean you need a bolt connection for each wire? For a simple single bus (2 wires) I can see how it works, but I have 6 bus wires in places (12 wires).

 

Ian

[doilum]

On 13/10/2023 at 09:50, ISW said:

Does that mean you need a bolt connection for each wire? For a simple single bus (2 wires) I can see how it works, but I have 6 bus wires in places (12 wires).

 

Ian

Just a simple 2 bus operation. With a dozen busses you might need an operator's license!

[doilum]

On 12/10/2023 at 19:21, ISW said:

Whilst I'd never say that the method I employed is the 'best', it is cheap and easy to implement. However, you'd need to 'thicken' up your 6mm end plywood to something nearer 18mm.

 

All I did was:

1. Clamp the baseboards in correct alignment.
2. Drill 2 holes through the ends, gradually increasing the size from 6mm to ~9.6mm (just under 10mm).
3. In one baseboard insert 8mm 'tee' nuts (available from ScrewFix, ToolStation, etc)
4. In the other baseboard insert a ~18mm lengths of 10mm diameter tubing, inside diameter 8mm (this I cut off a 1m length I bought at B&Q)
5. Insert an 8mm diameter bolt (length to suit; I used 70mm & 50mm)
6. Using the bolt head, tighten the bolt into the 'tee' nut. This will help 'push' both the nut and tube into the respective wooden ends of the baseboard.

Here's a few photos to explain / clarify:

 

Components:

 

Assembled, 'tee' nut side:

 

Assembled, bolt side (I also put in a large washer to spread the load a bit):

 

Because the bolt is a 'snug' fit in the steel tube, the baseboards re-align themselves as you tighten them up.

 

All the parts are cheap and easily available. Well, it worked for me.

 

Ian

As l may have said elsewhere,.a word of caution about tee nuts.

The industrially fitted ones are perfect. I have had mixed results with the DIY type. A habit of working loose, especially when scenery makes them inaccessible. Two options, first is an extra beer mat of thin ply to trap them in place. The other is to get a tame welder to fix an M8 nut to a 40mm repair washer. A case of beer should be enough to get a dozen or so done. Three small holes are drilled in each washer to fix them in place.

A matching plain washer is fixed on the other board. I like to open the plain washer and holes to 9mm making for an easy fit. Accurate location is down to the dowels.

And if you already have tee nuts, don't let the guy with a socket in his Makita anywhere near them.

Edited October 14, 2023 by doilum

[ISW]

2 hours ago, doilum said:

I have had mixed results with the DIY type. A habit of working loose, especially when scenery makes them inaccessible.

I too have had a couple work themselves loose. However, since they are all located under baseboards they are accessible. I found that it's best to insert them into the timber by tightening a bolt into/onto them. Hammering them in is not as good, and probably leads to them loosening. They can't come loose when tightened, as the bolt is 'pulling' them into the timber.

 

2 hours ago, doilum said:

Accurate location is down to the dowels.

That's certainly the 'executive' option. As I mentioned, I went with the 'economy' method of a steel sleeved hole.

 

2 hours ago, doilum said:

And if you already have tee nuts, don't let the guy with a socket in his Makita anywhere near them.

I do use a battery powered drill to loosen/tighten them, but have not had any problems. Mind you, my Bosch drill is probably not up the 'power' of a Makita!

 

Ian

[doilum]

Given the amount of money that we spend on track, point control systems, sound chips and limited run rolling stock, £10 to ensure perfect alignment of two baseboards is as they say, " a no -brainer".

If I could time travel back 50 years and give my teenage self one bit of railway modelling advice it would be to use pattern maker's dowels .

[polybear]

On 12/10/2023 at 17:20, TheQ said:

Those toggle clamps are for holding the two boards together not for alignment, dowels do that. A lot quicker to do and undo than bolts, especially if you want to go home after a long day exhibiting at a show.

 

Plus they're fixed to the boards - so can't get lost or forgotten when exhibiting a layout.

[AndyB]

On my current build I've used brass dowels for alignment and bolts to hold things together.

 

This worked fine. However the layout is aroundc12' x 2'6". And to access the bolts once the scenery is down the whole layout would need to be tilted on its side. It's not particularly lightweight! 

 

So I tried out the @TheQ's suggestion and it's a lot easier. Thank you, I'd not come across adjustable toggle latches before. 

 

All that said the layout sits on a solid workbench up against the garage wall. It's quite an acrobatic feet to secure the latches at the back. But definitely easier than the bolts.

 

The remaining problem I have is with track alignment. So far I've built the fiddle yard to the rear of the (N gauge) layout. And to do so I had the layout boards "back to front" to make it possible to reach and lay the track. 

Track alignment was fine and running was smooth. I now find that when the boards are returned to their proper position a few of the tracks misalign and cause derailment. Not really sure how to resolve this without resorting to filing the track down. 

 

Andy

 

 

[ColinK]

I took one of my layouts to an exhibition and forgot to take the bolts to hold the boards together, so I just used what was in my toolbox, a G-clamp.  It worked and was much easier than fiddly bolts.  Alignment was taken care of by metal dowels.

[Mark Saunders]

39 minutes ago, ColinK said:

I took one of my layouts to an exhibition and forgot to take the bolts to hold the boards together, so I just used what was in my toolbox, a G-clamp.  It worked and was much easier than fiddly bolts.  Alignment was taken care of by metal dowels.

Many years ago Whitley Bay had a layout where the board was aligned and joined with Door Hinges with the pin removed and using Allen key s as the pin.

 

Ironically this idea is now used on house doors!

[Hroth]

I used the "doorhinge" alignment/board connector method on a layout.

 

 

Choose the right size hinge and the pins are easy to extract and reuse. 

But don't lose or forget the pins...