Penrhos1920 Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 I'm trying to persuade my club to go DCC on Awrhyllgwami quarry as we currently extending it. But cost appears to be an issue. Ultimately I think we will need 2 boosters and 3 handsets. We are almost certainly going to be using MERG CBUS for the points and signal controls. How long have you owned your current DCC system for? Did you buy one system and dump it for something better? If I can persuade the group that it will last the life time of the layout and beyond then I might be able to sell it to them. A second tack is that I might just buy the system for myself for Penrhos and lend it Awrhyllgwami Quarry as needed. But Penrhos is unlikely to be progressed much in the next 2 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim V Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 I've owned mine six years, and never looked back. Although chips have been upgraded, the command station is original. Why would you need boosters? It must be a huge layout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penrhos1920 Posted October 20, 2010 Author Share Posted October 20, 2010 I've owned mine six years, and never looked back. Although chips have been upgraded, the command station is original. Why would you need boosters? It must be a huge layout? The Multimaus 'booster' only puts out 2.3 amps. The layout will be 28' x 10'3". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Lenz Compact and Handset, since 2001. Replaced augmented with a NCE Powercab about 10 months ago. I only really went with a Powercab as the capability of the Compact was getting limited compared to more modern systems, and it seemed most other modellers within the local US outline group also used NCE equipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kspoons Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 5 years using ECoS upgraded to colour version september 2010 - no real need to as black and white version was excellent use loksound chips in everything on an o gauge layout 28ft by 2ft 6" can't imagine not using dcc now wiring is straight forward and is easier to maintain than non dcc i have six boards each of which can be diagnosed on its own for any wiring problems all in all best move i made was going to dcc kspoons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StaffsOatcake Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 NCE system fot the last two years. I had Bachmann EZ command thingy for a few months before just to try out DCC before I dived in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harris Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 We are almost certainly going to be using MERG CBUS for the points and signal controls. While not exactly a reply to your original question but, if you're going to use MERG CBUS for point & signal controls, have you considered using it for the DCC system also? More info at: MERG CBUS DCC Best regards, Matt H Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted October 20, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2010 Bought a Roco "Digital is Cool" set in 1997. Quickly realised its limitations, and in mid-98 bought a Digitrax Challenger, which I swiftly upgraded to Super Chief by adding a DCS100 and DT100 the same year. When Digitrax brought out the DT400 throttle in 92 (?) I bought one, and I've added a pair of the cheap and simple UT4 throttles, too. I also upgraded the DCS100 Command Station to give me access to higher Functions (F5-F12), much needed with multiple sound locos on the layout. While Digitrax have now upgraded the DT400 to DT402, with access to F13-F28, that really is the only feature that I lack - and currently have no use for anyway, as none of my locos goes beyond F12. Ok, I have a couple of throttles that don't really feel very modern, the DT100 and DT200 from the '90s, but virtually nothing that I have bought is actually obsolescent as such. I cannot speak for other systems, but believe Digitrax have kept faith in a shifting world of electronics, frankly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryHN Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 HI I have a Lenz LH100 set up which I have owned since my lovely wife bought me it for Christmas 2005, I also got a complete spare set, which I use while controlling my layout at shows to explain about programing engines. Love the ease of use Lenz have and also the awesome service from A and H if anything goes wrong. Chips are a mix between, Lenz, TCS and ESU sound chip, Recently bought a Zimo sound chip and not as happy with that. Gary in Tasmania Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr45144 Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 I'm trying to persuade my club to go DCC on Awrhyllgwami quarry as we currently extending it. But cost appears to be an issue. Ultimately I think we will need 2 boosters and 3 handsets. We are almost certainly going to be using MERG CBUS for the points and signal controls. How long have you owned your current DCC system for? Did you buy one system and dump it for something better? If I can persuade the group that it will last the life time of the layout and beyond then I might be able to sell it to them. A second tack is that I might just buy the system for myself for Penrhos and lend it Awrhyllgwami Quarry as needed. But Penrhos is unlikely to be progressed much in the next 2 years. Is it really cost or is it actually that you are the only one who wants this? Have you looked at things objectively and worked out why the layout should go DCC - what can you do with DCC that you couldn't as it stands for example. Do a cost/benefit analysis rather than just cost. then, have a vote and accept the outcome. Not everyone needs, or wants, DCC . Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wollastonblue Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 I've has a Hornby Select now for nearly 3 years, and I really like it. Still deciding to go with point DCC's but I like the basic Hornby set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike at C&M Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 4th April 1995! Having seen the then new Lenz Set 100 demonstrated by the late Ken Mackay at the Glasgow show earlier that year, I then took a few hundred pounds up to the shop under Paisley Gilmour Street and invested it in a system that has served me very well ever since. Only one direct upgrade has been done in the intervening years, and if I had to start from scratch, the first thing I would buy would be a Lenz Set 100. I have also added another Lenz handset and a Roco route control handset in the following years. Further details will be posted this week on the thread covering my layout: http://www.rmweb.co....__1#entry230377 Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Is it really cost or is it actually that you are the only one who wants this? Have you looked at things objectively and worked out why the layout should go DCC - what can you do with DCC that you couldn't as it stands for example. Do a cost/benefit analysis rather than just cost. then, have a vote and accept the outcome. Not everyone needs, or wants, DCC . Kev When i've heard this discussed before, the general concensus is it's six of one and half a dozen of the other. When you join a club they might dictate that you fit certain couplings or wheel standards to your stock in order to standardise, so DCC really ought not to be any different. With a new project, and in particular referencing the average club that builds a sucession of layouts, using DCC can ensure the wiring is simpler and quicker, and less time is spent learning how to operate sections on layouts, Once you know how to operate the chosen brand of handset, operating other layouts with the same equipment is less of a learning curve. The labour costs within the hobby are rarely calculated, but as shown, the initial investment cost can be spread over a number of years and layouts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locoworks Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 i bought a digitrax chief over ten years ago that came with a DT100. i added a DT100R and UR91 to get radio shortly after. i added an empire builder when the DT400 came out because i wanted a booster and a DT400 and buying the set was cheaper than the 2 items individually. i have since bought the Mk 1 zephyr just to have a play with. when i can get my hands on a chief duplex radio i will be ordering one of those with the DT402D as my original chief is the old type with quick connectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted October 20, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 20, 2010 I started into DCC with a ZTC511 in 2002. Shortly after I then bought a second 511, along with a 622 when they were released. Since that time I have moved over to a Lenz set 100 which is bombproof, I also have a Roco Multimaus handset. All of these can be used together as all are some form of X-bus or XpressNet. Since then I have also acquired two Bachmann Dynamis sets for demonstration use and a ProBox, and then bought myself an ESU ECoS and ECoS ControlRadio. I also use JMRI via the Lenz LI-USB and also the excellent GamesOnTrack voice control software. Once ESU sort out the relevant upgrade to ECoS to allow it to talk to ProBox I will be able to use ALL of these systems at the same time on the layout by using the ECOsniffer input of the ECoS to take the output from the Lenz system. Am I the person with the most different systems in one place? (retailers not included!) For point and signal control I use the MERG RPC system rather than DCC. Andi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 I bought Digitrax. I started with a Sprog. I bought the Super Empire builder and added a Zephyr later. A layout of that size would need Digitrax or Zimo for the power. There is MERG CBUS as well. Still work in progress but a lot of promise and very reasonable in price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted October 21, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2010 A layout of that size would need Digitrax or Zimo for the power. Ravens is 24x12 and will run quite happily on either ECoS (4 amps) or Lenz/ZTC (5 amps) without additional boosters Andi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allegheny1600 Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Hi, I started in DCC in the late 1980's with a Hornby Zero-1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This seemed the answer at the time as i wanted to 'consist' several (US) locos together and have simple (like me!) wiring. Hah! What a washout that was, fortunately i had bought secondhand and managed to sell the lot for a fair profit and washed my hands of digital for a good few years! To be fair, the Zero-1 concept was rather before it's time and with very poor quality decoders with low frequency motor drives - awful! Then about 2005 i bought the Gaugemaster Prodigy (1) and have been generally pretty satisfied with it. The only problems i had with it were really due to my own ignorance. I still have it and use it, occasionally - though it and another are for sale now!! I had bought a Roco multi-maus a couple of years ago, this was primarily to drive my Lenz 0 gauge locos as the Prodigy cannot control them. I have now upgraded to NCE's Pro Cab and am loving it! I have a 27' x 9' multi track layout with lots of trains available and i drive the Pro cab(s) with a Lenz 3.5amp transformer with no problems. I have three cabs and can have two guest cabs and the fun to be had is wonderful! A couple of collegues and i have attempted to push our club to go digital but then we have some cranky people make statements like "I'm not going to put chips in all my 200 locos"!!!! They simply don't listen when you tell them that it's only neccessary to fit decoders to a handful of decent locos, no more! "Sticks in the mud" or what?!? Anyway, good luck with your endevours but if you can't persuade your club to go DCC, accept that some people will never change - at least you can and you can enjoy yourself whilst doing it! Cheers, John E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Sincr 1999, bought just prior to going completely across Canada. Digitrax DB150/DT200. I still have both, both still work. Booster is used reguarly, not so much with the 200 throttle, but that comes down to having a 400, and a couple UT2's. UT2 works great when you want someone else to run the layout. The big limit on number of boosters would be the # of trains desired to be in motion at the same time. Or, reversing areas...I use 3 boosters to ensure that when I have multi trains starting at the same time I don't have issues. When I started with reversing loops, the easiest way to deal with it was getting the 2nd booster. (it also gave redundancy). The 3rd booster was added when voltage drop exceeded what I considered acceptable- the layout stretches over a 36x24 basement, and the locations of the boosters is not central. Even using 14 gauge wire, there was still enough voltage drop to prevent the auto reverse units (a PSX-AR) from reliably tripping over. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike at C&M Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Ravens is 24x12 and will run quite happily on either ECoS (4 amps) or Lenz/ZTC (5 amps) without additional boosters Bayerndorf is some 18' x 18' and runs on a Maerklin transformer taed at about 4.5 amps. Likewise we have no boosters for train running and have had 8 locos in motion at the same time. Tthe accessory decoders have their own Lenz TR100 power supply,as they require a lesser power supply anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted October 21, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2010 I've had a ZTC511 since 2003 (I think it was then). I am considering changing this because of the software / firmware that just has not kept pace with developments (and was a little flaky when released). Other than the poor software - from the time of manufacture - there are no issues with the controller. This controller has been more reliable than others that I have owned, with the exception of an old H and M unit I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super D Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Two years with a Gaugemaster Prodigy². Layout is 23ft x 12ft and 39 locos. No problems whatsover and no need for a booster. Point operation - when installed - will be by DC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Had a lenz compact for 6 years.I've thought many times of upgrading but Lenz is the only manufacturer with a 10 year guarantee. If when I upgrade it's likely to be for another lenz system. It's been used on a layout 15 x 7ft new layout is 16 x 13. there was no need for power buses on either layout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted October 21, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2010 Used, but didn't own Zero 1 and CTR (iirc) systems back in the day. Went digital when building the first (and prototypically correct) version of Widnes, the wiring would have taken too long for the two of us building the layout, I bought a Lenz Set02 and a circle of track, from the minute I ran two trains I was hooked, that was back in 1997 iirc, demoed the system at several shows for a couple of years, at a show in Hull I had a yard of track and was running two trains back and forth, the spectators were 5-10 deep ! Changed to Digitrax several years back, to make the point and signal control more straightforward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted October 21, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2010 Bought a Hornby Select off eBay in spring 2007, this confirmed to me that DCC was for me so Santa brought me a Dynamis the following Christmas. Used this both at home and at exhibitions with Summat Colliery until it lt me down at the Elizabethan show in 2009 when I just couldn't get a signal. Disco-dave was helping me operate so brought his NCE Powercab along to get us out of the poo. Traction's Dad sold me his Powercab at the Mansfield Show this year and I've been using it ever since. Still use Dynamis at home and Summat Colliery is 100% DCC controlled with MERG Pulsed Accessory Decoders oprating the points (and signal) and prototype BCO1 block cut-outs protect against shorts and seperate the two scenic boards into their own sections. Standard 2A PSU has always and always will be powerful enough. I use Lenz Standard decoders as a default, switching to TCS-M1s for split chassis locos and applications where a Standard won't fit. I will use the cheapie Bachmann 3 function decoders in modern chassis that can take them (class 20 etc). Never got on with Lenz Silver Minis especially in split chassis, they just don't seem to work as well as the M1s. Loksound sound decoders when I can afford them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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