Western Star Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Hello all, I have also posted this question in the help section, then I thought about scanning my C.P.L. cab gauges. So I gave it a try at 3000 dpi. and this is what I got. Then I did a bit of editing of it and got this. Then a bit more editing and got this. The original artwork must be fantastic to be able to blow it up to this size. Sorry to have wasted anyone's time. OzzyO. Surely this breaches copyright of Carl Legg? If not, then morally this is not a good thing given that Pat Legg has a business which provides her living. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazz Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Fabulous work. A sight to behold. Ken Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 13, 2012 Author Share Posted May 13, 2012 Surely this breaches copyright of Carl Legg? If not, then morally this is not a good thing given that Pat Legg has a business which provides her living. As the original sheets that I bought did not have a copyright symbol or any form of copyright on it. Is it therefore copyright? They also don't have any form of producer wrote on them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
3 link Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Surely this breaches copyright of Carl Legg? If not, then morally this is not a good thing given that Pat Legg has a business which provides her living. I think if anything it shows the quality of Carl's work and I'm sure if he was still with us he would'nt mind Ozzy endorsing his skills, let alone the quality of the CPL etchings and castings that are still available thanks to his wife. It's not as though Ozzy was being derogatory in anyway, quote " The original artwork must be fantastic to be able to blow it up to this size ". Best we leave it here, before it all gets blown out of proportion. Martyn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 13, 2012 Author Share Posted May 13, 2012 Hello all, the start of the inside of the cab. A few more bits in place. Most of the pipe runs in place on the inside of the cab. I don't think that any more will be going in. I'm going to do this post in two parts as when I was up loading the last photo, to the attach files section I got an SQL error message and lost all the photos in that section. OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Smashing work there, Its easy to forget when looking at these pictures how small all this detail actually is when you see it in the flesh. I look at my castle and the pipe work off the lubricator and to appreciate it you need to look at it under a magnifying glass. Its great to know its all there. A true master at work. If I was to post a picture of the finished cab including dials would this then also infringe copy right????? I don't think so. If I was photo copying and then offering them for sale then that would be a total breach of copy right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 13, 2012 Author Share Posted May 13, 2012 Hello all, the second part of my main post tonight. At least I got all the photos uploaded this time. To start with back to the cab. In this photo you can make out a line at the top middle below the pencil line it's about 2mm lower. This is about the same as the top of the firebox cladding on the outside, when the inside firebox cladding was normally slightly smaller than the outside cladding. And this is after I took off about 1.5mm from the bottom of the backhead. Most of the pipes that are in this photo are about 0.45mm. The backhead at close of play a day or so back. a few changes to the backhead and its finished, I hope! Two photos of this one normal one and one arty farty one. The backhead in place in the cab. The colour is a bit strange as it was taken under an halogen lamp. About the only bits that are missing are the slacking cock, this I will fit. The release cock and the reservoir (timing) tank for the A.T.C.. The tank should be between the reverser and the cab side sheet. Maybe the loco should have seats, but if I was to fit the drivers seat it would foul the reverser, and if I fitted one to the fireman's side only I think that the union may be on my case. OzzyO. Edit. PS. The "thing" on top of the vacuum pipe looks to have something to do with the loco vacuum brakes. I think? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BR(W) Posted May 13, 2012 Share Posted May 13, 2012 Hello all, this ones going to be a good one for yous. What is the part that is circled in this photo? What does it do? It's here on the early shot of the cab as well, but the pipe for the vacuum gauge runs to the train pipe. Not a problem as it's a single gauge. [Photo.] In this photo, you can see a pipe coming out of the "thing" and running to the R/H side of the vacuum gauge. When you follow the L/H pipe with the dotted line it appears to run to the train pipe. Also in this photo you can see a union with two nuts on it towards the top of the bottom circle with a copper pipe running out of it what is this for? [Photo.] Thanks for any help. OzzyO. Hello, OzzyO, everyone. The item in question is the automatic loco. steam brake application valve, operated by actuation of the train vacuum brake valve. This is, obviously, only found on locos. which have a steam brake only. Beautiful work, as ever. Regards, BR(W). Edit to remove photos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 Hello, OzzyO, everyone. The item in question is the automatic loco. steam brake application valve, operated by actuation of the train vacuum brake valve. This is, obviously, only found on locos. which have a steam brake only. Beautiful work, as ever. Regards, BR(W). Edit to remove photos. Hello BR(W), thanks for that, it was when I was looking at this photo, I could see the L/H connection running to the train pipe (no probs.) and the R/H pipe to the thing (now known as the steam brake application valve). It's just that the cab gauge face is now wrong as it says vacuum chamber. Do you think anyone will notice this? :laugh: . I will send you a PM soon. OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 Hello all, well I think that I've got all the bits on the loco body. A photo of one of the A.T.C. conduit clamps, this photo was taken a bit back and I can't remember if was grit blasted. Some more photos of the A.T.C. conduit clamps after grit blasting. You have to remember that the nuts are 0.85mm AF. I think that I'm getting to about the limit of the macro setting on my camera. The drivers side of the cab before grit blasting. The slacking pipe in place, this is approx. a scale 8' long. In about 1982 three of us set off from BIF on the sleeper of Friday night for a week ends spotting in London and ending up at Swindon for the works visit on the Sunday. After we had done Euston, St. Pan and the Cross, I think that we set off for Liverpool st. and Waterloo. Then it was out to Wilsden, and Old Oak. The old Pullman sheds were always worth a good look around.Wish I'd had a digital camera then. Then it was on to Swindon and find some digs for the night, that job done it was out for a few pints. We found this pub a bit on the quiet side but a good pint, we were just standing at the bar talking about the day when this old block came up to the bar for a pint and asked us if we were enthusiasts? He then said that he used to work in Swindon and would we like to join him, well what do you think we said. We found out he was called Bill Hartley and had been the charge hand in the paint shop from 45 - 69 or had worked in the works for that time. He had been in the paint shop when B.R. took over and apparently Swindon had a few idears of how to refresh the new livery one of them was a colour that he describe that was later used on one of the diesels. later on he described it sort of yellow with some orange in it I'm wondering if it was golden ochre. Any how he said that the painted a tender in this colour, the running gear was black and the coal raves black as well, some of them lined out one side with two thick lines and two thin lines between them. A bit like the Coronations I suppose. When the paint shop manager saw it he ordered it to be repainted immediately. But back on to the tender, spurred on by his story I thought I'd put the lines down the tender sides. The chevron lines are so that I can see if there are any hollows left. the length of the line that's left will give me a good indication of that. So it's out with the wet'n'dry tomorrow and see how I get on. I ordered some parts from Scale hardware on the Fri. 4/5/12 and they arrived on Sat12/5/12. Not bad from Florida. I thought the cost was pretty good as well. OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted May 14, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 14, 2012 Pep pipe please on a Western engine! (and very nice too) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 That pep pipe is superb mate. I will have one just like it on the next build. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 I've heard it called slacking pipe, degging down pipe and pep pipe. So pick any one from three. . OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 14, 2012 Author Share Posted May 14, 2012 That pep pipe is superb mate. I will have one just like it on the next build. You will, will you, you'll, get what I give you :drinks: . Speak soon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Williams Posted May 14, 2012 Share Posted May 14, 2012 Try using copper wire for the coiled pipe Ozzyo I find I can make the pipe look tired to varying degrees, for the King here I am going to have it fairly fresh. It seems to sit coiled like it should, tight behind the tap, then spreading out either side a little. Sorry to post my work on your workbench, hope its OK to show you someone else's idea? If not I will whip it off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 15, 2012 Author Share Posted May 15, 2012 Try using copper wire for the coiled pipe Ozzyo I find I can make the pipe look tired to varying degrees, for the King here I am going to have it fairly fresh. It seems to sit coiled like it should, tight behind the tap, then spreading out either side a little. Sorry to post my work on your workbench, hope its OK to show you someone else's idea? If not I will whip it off. Hello Cliff all, I don't mind anyone posting their work on here as long as it has relevance to what is been posted. Even if someone post a photo of the same class of loco that I'm building as a finished job and I'm only starting, so what. What size copper wire did you use? I used 24SWG 0.56mm. My pep pipe is copper wire, I know that it looks silver but it's tinned copper wire from Rapid Electronics I get it on 500 grm. roils I have all the even sizes from 32SWG - 14SWG.approx 0.30 - 2.0mm. It works out a lot cheaper than buying the small packs from the shows. Out of interest, what did yo think I'd used? Who's kit is the King, if it's the D.A. kit and you're doing it approx before 1955 you will need a cab roof without the sliding vents. If you need one PM me and I'll see what I can do for you. OzzyO. Edit. PS. I've just noticed that you have the early damper levers on this build, these were later replaced with lift up ones. But I'm not sure from when. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Williams Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 Hi Ozzyo - it looked like nickel silver to me, but then photos can tell porkies! I would need to check what size of copper I used but it would have been 0.5mm or 0.6mm. I have drums of 0.3, 0.4, 0.5,0.6,0.8, 1.2, 1.4, 1.6 which I bought from "Scientific Wire" (I think) The King is a Mitchell kit started a few years ago then put to one side, it needs a wee push to finish for my own collection and is going to be one of the "William" names to run with my "Clifford Castle" for obvious reasons! EDIT: found the wire supplier online http://www.wires.co.uk/acatalog/cu_bare.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazz Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 This is a fascinating thread. I can't wait to see this this loco in running condition, it will be a masterpiece. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 15, 2012 Author Share Posted May 15, 2012 Hi Ozzyo - it looked like nickel silver to me, but then photos can tell porkies! going to be one of the "William" names to run with my "Clifford Castle" for obvious reasons! EDIT: found the wire supplier online http://www.wires.co....og/cu_bare.html This is a fascinating thread. I can't wait to see this this loco in running condition, it will be a masterpiece. Hello Cliff, now, I can't under stand why you would want to have one of the William named ones!!!!! Where did you get the early damper's from as I've never had any in the M.M. kits and I've done a good few of them. Thanks for the link. Hello Ken, when I receive a comment like yours from a man who builds a loco between dinner time and tea time. I take as a very big complement. If your down at Telford in Sep. we'll have to have a pint and a good gab. If all goes to plan with the rubbing down of the tender sides, it should be finished by the weekend. Famous last words. OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Williams Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 Hi Ozzyo I scratchbuilt the early dampers, a right royal PITA but worth the effort. IIRC I spent a night on them with sore fingers in the end, but worth the effort as I have never seen it done before, a bit like the copper piping on the Duchess footplate - I fitted it all even when the master Tony Reynalds just tucked them right behind the splasher! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Harvey Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 Ozzyo Can I ask why are you going to so much trouble to try to get the tender sides so flat the never came from the factory perfectly flat it's the nature of their construction that they had distortions in them. A truly flat panel has only been achievable in recent years with modern techniques, but even then they don't look as good. Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 15, 2012 Author Share Posted May 15, 2012 Ozzyo Can I ask why are you going to so much trouble to try to get the tender sides so flat the never came from the factory perfectly flat it's the nature of their construction that they had distortions in them. A truly flat panel has only been achievable in recent years with modern techniques, but even then they don't look as good. Pete Hello Pete, when I had got the primer on and it was still wet it really showed up how bad they were, if it had only been a bit here and there I may have let it go but in this photo you can see how bad it is, and this is the good side. The flash has highlighted it more. The two sides after grit blasting, you can still make out the highs, in these photos they don't look to bad, but I was not happy with them and if I'm not happy with them I know my customer will not be as well. The worst bit filled in with knifing putty, this was about 6-8 thou. deep. Now that is not good. I know that the tender sides were not flat, but if we let them go when they have too many hollows and bumps, it just looks like bad workmanship. After I get the filler primer rubbed back I will try and remember to take some photos. Would you let one of your etches out onto the market if you knew it was 10 thou out? I don't think so. OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Harvey Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 Ozzyo I can see exactly what you mean from those pictures and I agree with you about your reasons for the extra work, if you had known that distortion would be such a big problem before construction had started you may of be able to thicken up the material from behind. Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted May 15, 2012 Author Share Posted May 15, 2012 Hello Pete, it was a new make of kit for me so I just did what I normally do and have no probs. But look what happened here. OzzyO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazz Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 Hello Ken, when I receive a comment like yours from a man who builds a loco between dinner time and tea time. I take as a very big complement. If your down at Telford in Sep. we'll have to have a pint and a good gab. OzzyO. Thank you, I'm very humbled. Telford is my annual prilgrimage. I look forward to meeting there. (Will you have an horses head on your T Shirt?) PS. To build a Finney kit would probably take from breakfast to teatime. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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