Colin parks Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 Ha! I'm back after a nasty virus hit the computer. The cab fronts have been suitably cut away to accept the buffers. Many thanks to Dave for pointing this curious feature of the prototype 2 HALs: the buffers were too big for the headstocks. I can remember filing down the Branchlines buffer castings when making the Kirk 2 BIL kit, thinking they were over-size. Perhaps this pattern of buffer also necessitated cut-aways on 2 BIL cab fronts too. I added conduit made from .009" guitar string. Now, a phenomenon that I hadn't anticipated, was a slight kinking of the metal string by the day after fitting these through the turned brass fittings. I have a hazy memory of a physics lesson when we were taught the "co-efficient of linear expansion" rule. I can only conclude that the palstic roof is expanding and contracting at a different rate to the metal guitar string during temperature fluctuations. This was never a problem with my previous use of 0.4mm plastic rod for conduits. The guitar stirngs have been arranged to slide freely in the lamp tops at present, but it remains to be seen what happens after painting. The toilet water tank filler pipes need to be done, along with filler dome and a ventilator. At the front ends, the horns are on. These have been soldered to tiny (inverted) U-shaped brackets, the rear legs of which pass down through slots in the cab roofs. This has worked out very well. (Something had to go right!) I am tempted to add the pipes to the horns, but just about anything thicker than a hair's breadth would be too thick. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 I was thinking more along the lines of drawing the sides in full colour in Cad, including door line, handles, etc. Then printing them on transfer paper for applying to clear sides. This would probably be more viable in the teeny weeny scales, however ! gerrynick Hi gerrynick, It would be interesting to hear from anyone who has produced EMUs that way. I think dasatcopthorne uses a method of a similar kind for his 2 HAL. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share Posted September 2, 2011 Colin that is some fantastic work! Please tell me you are taking orders for such a magnificent scratch-built model. I shall be watching with very keen interest - I have never seen a HAL in real life only in SR Photos I always thought them quite bland like the first production 4 SUBs the 'Queen of Sheba' ones especially compared to the flat Bullied front end. But looking at how this has formed into such a realistic looking model is making me reassess my original thinking. Good show sir! ~ Gary Hi Gary, Thanks for your comments and no, I am not taking orders! I agree with you that at first sight, the 2 HAL is quite plain in design. However, since starting this project, (and luckily not after completion), it has become clear what a quirky design it was: cantrails that change height in an odd place; buffers that don't fit; waterstrips that seem to stop short and slightly tapered cab sides. I have also just noticed that the driver's cab window is a bit deeper that the left-hand, hinged one. So it's out with the needle files again. As for the Queen of Sheba 4 SUBs, there are too many windows for me to cut out! I do like the look of a 1st series 4 LAV though, but there is such a dearth of side-on pictures of these units, it would be a challenge or you could say a risk to attempt one. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomstaf Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I am tempted to add the pipes to the horns, but just about anything thicker than a hair's breadth would be too thick. Colin Hi Colin, It's looking great! I found that an acceptable thickness wire for the air pipes can be made from a single strand of multicore wire. If you dip in in chemical blackening solution you can avoid it being made thick by paint too. HTH Cheers Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerrynick Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 An alternative source of thin wire is Eileen's , who will supply down to 0.31 mm. It has been suggested that this is the correct diameter for signal operating wires..............I'll let you know ! Good to see you back online.I feared that work ( the curse of the modeller) had taken over. gerrynick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 3, 2011 Author Share Posted September 3, 2011 Hi There, I have noted the advice on wire. I shall have a look at some multi-standed wire to harvest a piece Tom. As for 0.31mm wire gerrynick, that is approximately what has been used for the cabside and luggage compartment grab handles (in brass). 0.31mm scales out at 23.56mm or about 15/16". This seems right for handles, but I wouldn't use it for signal operating cables! Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Hi Colin, I've got some wire that's 0.21mm dia. I've used it before for N Gauge diesel nose end handrails. For sharp bends it will need annealing. If this is useful, send me a PM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerrynick Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Peter Squib, in his book on scratchbuilding signals apparently uses this diameter wire in 4mm scale..but, then, he makes forked joints for same by slitting 0,6mm tube ! I will be trying this with 0.8mm tube, and will let you know how things progress Sorry.....I'm off topic !! No wonder you model the blue era...............all colour lights.! gerrynick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 10, 2011 Author Share Posted September 10, 2011 The HAL is up on its bogies - well, three of them at least! I still await a trailing pick-up bogie kit from the SRG/Phoenix range. I hope they are still trading, as there seems to be no other source of this type of bogie at present. A start has been on the underframe equipment, with all the fuse boxes fitted. The next thing on the list is to wire up the motor bogie and inner bogie pick-ups to the DCC socket. The motor coach has been tested on analogue control promises to run well. More use of available parts has been made for this model than for the 2 HAPs. Some of the underframe components need improving, such as mounting fuses on two brackets rather than the solid cast supports. The restistance banks are, I suspect a bit two-dimensional, so research will be needed to see what the prototype ones looked like. The Kean-Maygib central buffer is not 100% correct in shape, but works very nicely. Bending up the water tank filler pipes nearly drove me mad, but they are done now. I can see that one needs a little tweaking still. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 10, 2011 Author Share Posted September 10, 2011 Peter Squib, in his book on scratchbuilding signals apparently uses this diameter wire in 4mm scale..but, then, he makes forked joints for same by slitting 0,6mm tube ! I will be trying this with 0.8mm tube, and will let you know how things progress Sorry.....I'm off topic !! No wonder you model the blue era...............all colour lights.! gerrynick Hi gerrynick, I think I misunderstood your comment regarding signal operating wires. I can see now that you meant wire for model signals, for which 0.31mm dia. sounds good. All the best - now back to that HAL..... Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted September 10, 2011 Share Posted September 10, 2011 Colin, Help is possibly at hand for the trailer bogie - Roxey sell the ones from their 2-Nol kit separately http://www.roxeymouldings.co.uk/store_front/view_product.php?product=4EMU27. Not tried one yet, but will soon if the NNK ones don't resurface.Their website is being updated at present, so holding my breath... Your HAL looks rather good now! Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 10, 2011 Author Share Posted September 10, 2011 Colin, Help is possibly at hand for the trailer bogie - Roxey sell the ones from their 2-Nol kit separately http://www.roxeymoul...?product=4EMU27. Not tried one yet, but will soon if the NNK ones don't resurface.Their website is being updated at present, so holding my breath... Your HAL looks rather good now! Pete Hi Pete, I have looked a t the Roxey website. Their trailing pick-up bogie is stated as a scale 8' 6" w.b. . The HALs, BILs etc. had 8' 9" w.b. ones. I had thought the NOLs were the same, but apparently not. Thanks, Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dasatcopthorne Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 Hi Pete, I have looked a t the Roxey website. Their trailing pick-up bogie is stated as a scale 8' 6" w.b. . The HALs, BILs etc. had 8' 9" w.b. ones. I had thought the NOLs were the same, but apparently not. Thanks, Colin Didn't know the SR had 8' 6" DT pickup bogies. That would mean they had to have special short showbeams. Will dig a bit on this. Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Hi Colin, The Hal is looking really good. I have just measured the Roxey trailer bogie, it measures 35.4 mm which equates to a 8'9" wheelbase. Can't say what it looks like when finished, as I have not built it yet but looks Ok in it's unbuilt state. Hope this helps. Cheers for now, Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 Hi Colin, The Hal is looking really good. I have just measured the Roxey trailer bogie, it measures 35.4 mm which equates to a 8'9" wheelbase. Can't say what it looks like when finished, as I have not built it yet but looks Ok in it's unbuilt state. Hope this helps. Cheers for now, Ian. Many thanks Ian! It seems that the Roxey website just has a typo error then. Meanwhile, I have phoned the chap at SRG just to make sure my order for one 'Ajustaride' 8' 9" trailing pick-up bogie has been received. I have been assured the bogie kit will be on its way soon. I might order a Roxey version too. Didn't know the SR had 8' 6" DT pickup bogies. That would mean they had to have special short showbeams. Will dig a bit on this. Dave No need to dig any further Dave! Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 The underframes have had nearly all their details and equipment fitted now. I opted to make a new arc chute as the supplied casting did(n't -edit) look look like the ones in pictures of the prorotypes. Edit: The arc chute seems to be leaning inwards - grrr.! I had a go at making the resistance banks more three-dimensional. Having fitted the modified part, it seems the casting is too high and only just fits between the solebar and trussing. All the plans and photos of 2 HALs and 2 BILs show the front of the resistance bank as being much shallower, with a gap between it and the solebar . The nature of the problem: Not sure what to do about this! Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 14, 2011 Author Share Posted September 14, 2011 A night off from modelling while I wait for a trailing pick-up bogie to arrive in the post. So a bit of actual running of models resulted in this picture: Maunsell versus Bulleid or Parks versus Kirk ? I'm pleased to see that the two units line up heightwise (unlike some RTR ones I have been reading about elsewhere on RMweb!) as HALs and BILs often ran together. Given that both models will have screw couplings, there shouldn't be too much trouble in connecting them. The 2 BIL will really have to have its ventilators changed for Branchlines' oval ones. I'm not sure how many HALs were fitted with air horns by 1969-70, but I do like the look of the HALs fitted with these horns. I now have to think whether to paint the HAL green with a small yellow warning panel or go for the more likely late 60's livery of green with full yellow end. BR blue it will not be! There is very little clearance between the top of the motor bogie side frames and the underside of the solebars, less than 1mm in fact. A bit tight, but I've got away with it (so far). As an aside, I now have five Black Beetle powered EMUs, three of which run very well. (The BIL is not so good, but the HAL runs well even without running-in or extra pick-ups). I just can't work out why two Black Beetles are running less than perfectly. I should be lucky the HAL runs at all after dropping bits of plastic into the gears and super-glueing the brake gear onto the cast sideframes with the motor bogie in situ. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 Hi Colin, The Bil/Hal combination looks excellent. If the Hal were mine I would opt for the green full yellow end livery, I think it suited these units very well. As for the Black Beetle's I have three and they all run well, so can't help there I am afraid. Cheers for now, Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium zarniwhoop Posted September 15, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 15, 2011 I'm not sure how many HALs were fitted with air horns by 1969-70, but I do like the look of the HALs fitted with these horns. I now have to think whether to paint the HAL green with a small yellow warning panel or go for the more likely late 60's livery of green with full yellow end. BR blue it will not be! Looks depressingly good (for those of us without the skills), as usual. My own notes, based on photos I've seen online or in books, show the following with horns while green (date is date of photo, not date of fitting, m/yy) 2603 with full yellow ends (FYE) 4/69 2609 with small yellow panels (syp) 8/69 - withdrawn in 1969, presumably in green 2615 syp 3/67 2630 syp 6/69 - withdrawn 1970, possibly still green 2634 syp 8/69 - withdrawn 1970, possibly still green 2641 3/66 syp 2656 FYE 6/69 - withdrawn 1971, possibly still green 2674 FYE 5/68 If not noted, these units were later repainted in blue. I'm sure many of the others had horns too - hardly any photos from after 1967 show HALs with whistles. I also have a note from one of the books that 2654 was the first HAL to be fitted with horns, in 4/62. ĸen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerces Fobe2 Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Really impressed Colin - How many hours have you spent on your 2 HAL project? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 15, 2011 Author Share Posted September 15, 2011 Looks depressingly good (for those of us without the skills), as usual. My own notes, based on photos I've seen online or in books, show the following with horns while green (date is date of photo, not date of fitting, m/yy) 2603 with full yellow ends (FYE) 4/69 2609 with small yellow panels (syp) 8/69 - withdrawn in 1969, presumably in green 2615 syp 3/67 2630 syp 6/69 - withdrawn 1970, possibly still green 2634 syp 8/69 - withdrawn 1970, possibly still green 2641 3/66 syp 2656 FYE 6/69 - withdrawn 1971, possibly still green 2674 FYE 5/68 If not noted, these units were later repainted in blue. I'm sure many of the others had horns too - hardly any photos from after 1967 show HALs with whistles. I also have a note from one of the books that 2654 was the first HAL to be fitted with horns, in 4/62. ĸen Ken, many thanks for all that information! I have more choice of unit numbers than I had at first thought. Now, if only I could find a picture of a green HAL with air horns on a Brighton-Seaford service -that would be good. As for skills, they can be learnt, it's not magic! Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 15, 2011 Author Share Posted September 15, 2011 Really impressed Colin - How many hours have you spent on your 2 HAL project? Hmm. This has been going on since June, but there was a period of three weeks in which nothing was done due to our annual holiday and a family visit. Given that I spend a couple of hours a night (usually quite late in the evening) five days a week, plus the odd extra session, that's eight weeks x 10 hours + extra time = 100 hours approx. (And it's not finished yet). I expect to spend around 140-150 hours on this by the time I'm done with the 2 HAL. (And that doesn't include writing about it on RMweb!). I could say that making an identical, second 2 HAL model would be quicker, but I tested that theory by making a second 2 HAP - it wasn't any faster! Anyway, I do really enjoy the making of these models and don't really want to finish them too quickly. My wife, on looking at me working on one of the models recently said: "Gosh Colin, with your patience and dexterity couldn't you think of a way of making money out your skills?" I replied: " Yes dear, it is called: 'being an upholsterer'!" Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Harvey Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Colin The build is looking very nice. Is the distance between the rear of each of the cars great enough to allow clearance of the curves on the layout with out the inner corners touching? Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 16, 2011 Author Share Posted September 16, 2011 Colin The build is looking very nice. Is the distance between the rear of each of the cars great enough to allow clearance of the curves on the layout with out the inner corners touching? Pete Hi Pete, Good to hear from you! Your question is very timely. The answer is - or was, no, the gap needed to be increased 2mm. I have been pottering about with the coupling of the two coaches today: 'Plan A', hasn't worked, because the lovely Kean-Maygib buffer has proved to be too short and too softly sprung for use as a centre buffer on the 2 HAL. 'Plan B' is to couple the unit with fixed length of wire on the trailer coach inner bogie which has a square loop locating on a plastic lug on the motor coach inner bogie. This keeps the coaches apart, which is especially necessary on my sharp curves. 'Plan C' is to make a new sprung centre buffer myself which will be slightly over-length to cope with the curves and use a stiffer spring so that the buffer doesn't compress so much. The buffer head will remain in contact with the buffing plate on the motor coach. A sprung buffer is needed, as it will stop any bouncing of the trailer car and will help to limit any 'deflection' of the trailer car when being pushed by the motor coach. All the best, Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 A trailing pick-up bogie arrived from Roxey on Friday - don't know where the SRG one has got to. So now the trailer coach is up and running. The Roxey bogie kit was devoid of transoms, but did have a generator cradle and some vee-hangars. This bogie is part of a 2 NOL kit, so the missing transoms must be on another etch. Anyway, after adding some extra rivets, brake gear, transoms and guard irons, it looks quite nice. I'm not sure about the shape of the shoe fuse holder, which ought to be mounted on the underside of the solebar. A new plastic one to make perhaps? The luridly decorated vacuum pipes come from a bargain second-hand pack of Hornby detailing which included many more pipes, three pairs of screw couplings and some dummy buck-eye couplers. Not bad for a pound! The coupling arrangement between vehicles is crude but effective. The buffer has yet to be changed, as even fully extended, it is 1mm too short to touch the buffing plate at all times. The new resistance bank with 'daylight' above! This has turned out more like the prototype fitting. As luck would have it, there is picture on my 2 HAP topic posted by dasatcopthorne showing the underframe of an EMU's generator set. This picture also shows the resistance bank from behind so that was a great help. Colin (sorry about the layout of this post - can't seem to get the text in the right place) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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