Fat Controller Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I've seen photos in various books on the AC electrics of the early types hauling all sorts of pre-Nationalization stock including passenger carrying vehicles of Thompson, Gresley, Stanier and Hawksworth design, although all the photos were taken in the summer so probably didn't require heat. That said, there were also a number of steam heating vans used for a while where non-ETH stock was hauled by AC electrics particularly on inter-regional trains. Weren't some of the Stanier 'Porthole' stock fitted with ETH, as well as steam-heating? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 As far as I am aware, there were NO steam heating vans in use on trains on the mainland. Over in Ireland they were used though. The only steam heating vans on BR were used in sidings to preheat stock before being used on a train. There was a thread discussing this on RMWeb recently. Stewart Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 As far as I am aware, there were NO steam heating vans in use on trains on the mainland. Over in Ireland they were used though. The only steam heating vans on BR were used in sidings to preheat stock before being used on a train. There was a thread discussing this on RMWeb recently. Stewart Page 6, "Rail Portfolios 13, the AC electrics by Chris Shaw": a picture of AL4 E3042 with 1V57 11.10 Manchester to Cardiff/Paignton train taken approaching Crewe on 1 March 1961, clearly showing (and is captioned as such) a steam heating van immediately behind the loco. It appears to be an ex-LMS Period 1 or 2 coach converted. Page 6, "West Coast Blue Electrics", compiled by Hugh Ballantyne: a picture of a double headed Pines Express at Manchester Picadilly, taken 2 October 1960 with an AL3 and an AL1 on the front of what is clearly a working steam heating van which is right next to the camera, judging by the steam leaking from underneath it. Again, it appears to be a Period 1 or 2 ex-LMS vehicle. I've also got somewhere an old "Locospotters Annual" from the mid-60s showing heater vans in formation on moving trains, so clearly they were not just used for pre-heating. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I remember that there is also a photo in the Observers Book of Locomotive from the period showing an AL coupled to a heating van (Gresley type coach I think) numbered M444xxM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 Stewart, Not so, I'm afraid. See the second photo and accompanying text at http://www.lmsca.org...reservation.php . Regards, John Isherwood. John, thanks for that. You learn something every day! I stand corrected. Stewart Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted April 30, 2012 Author Share Posted April 30, 2012 more archive newsreel footage, again no class 85 in this one but other bits of interest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 They've made the 60 day list on the Bachmann web-site............. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Well, seeing as the weathered vans and high steels are on 60-day warning and already here... Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted May 1, 2012 Author Share Posted May 1, 2012 Wigan North Western by Kerry Parker (KP), on Flickr 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaneofFife Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 someone tried to get all flirtatious with a paintbrush on the headcode surround? well the big day is getting close now then......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekEm8 Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Great shots Derek, thanks for sharing them. To the locals who were so used to Stanier's fine machines, these newfangled electrics must have seemed as though they'd landed from outer space at the time...! Nidge, Your comments reminded me of this shot - the driver looks a bit apprehensive. An 81 not an 85 E3008 (81007) Crewe c1961 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted May 1, 2012 Author Share Posted May 1, 2012 85015 Liverpool 28.9.86 by D9006, on Flickr 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
reevesthecat Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Incidentally when were the overhead warning flashes fitted, none of the 85's in the pictures have them! (or were they never fitted to the 85)? mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Incidentally when were the overhead warning flashes fitted, none of the 85's in the pictures have them! (or were they never fitted to the 85)? I seem to recall that they were only fitted where there was an opportunity to ascend to within dangerous proximity to the overhead (you'll notoce that the the Mk1 behind the 85 in the last poicture has a warning flash, whereas the 85 itself of course doesn't have handrails etc that will get you in the danger zone). Not sure when the practice changed (80's onwards perhaps?) but the AC electrics were mostly devoid in the 70's and any diesel that might go under the wires would be so adorned but it was common for a lot of units to not be so indicated (third rail EMUs weren't generally marked). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaneofFife Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Cant see this being picked up anywhere here so far......the TOPS model of 85026 (31-678) has no orange cant rail warning stripes. I assume this is based on the actual loco's condition pre May 1986 minimum and probably back further than that by at least 6 months whilst it was in the works - I have a photo of this actual loco on this date in mint ex works condition with the stripes but whether they existed before this visit I dont know. I have asked Bachmann the question today to clarify what year they have based 85026 on. Its an easy transfer or paint add on and it may be a deliberate omission so as to cater for modellers pre and post the circa 1983-1986 period during the time many 85s received their works overhauls. Had Bachmann added the stripe this would have excluded a certain number of buyers who didnt fancy painting the stripes out! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lokomotivfuhrer Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) I seem to recall that they were only fitted where there was an opportunity to ascend to within dangerous proximity to the overhead (you'll notoce that the the Mk1 behind the 85 in the last poicture has a warning flash, whereas the 85 itself of course doesn't have handrails etc that will get you in the danger zone). Not sure when the practice changed (80's onwards perhaps?) but the AC electrics were mostly devoid in the 70's and any diesel that might go under the wires would be so adorned but it was common for a lot of units to not be so indicated (third rail EMUs weren't generally marked). Thats right. Classes 81-87 weren't fitted with the "Danger Overhead Live Wires" sign during their time in BR Blue livery. Edited May 2, 2012 by Lokomotivfuhrer 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaneofFife Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) Bachmann Update.......the decorated samples of the BR Blue TOPS version 31-678 has omitted the orange warning stripes on the cant rails and this is not what is being produced. The production models will come with the stripes and this places the loco in its later years of BR TOPS life. I can say it definitely wore the stripes from at least May 1986 onwards on my evidence but this seems very late in the locos life to have had the stripes painted on when fellow class members had their stripes going back as far as 1979. Further update from Bachmann 3/5/12......they have photographs of 85026 wearing the stripes in July 1982 with further possible evidence of sightings in 1981 with stripes but unconfirmed due to poor quality of the pictures. This will help modellers working to a specific year especially if they were planning to model between 1982 and 1986 using Class 85s. My gut instinct was that 86 was very late to receive the orange stripes so its nice to have the confirmation. Shawplan will be releasing horn baffles/hoods and reinforced cab front window frames. Edited May 3, 2012 by ThaneofFife 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
87 101 Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Thanks guys for uploading all the pics I've just spent an enjoyable half an hour going through them. Good to hear that the models are on their way. I now have my fingers crossed that they will be here soon as I would love to run my pre ordered one on my layout at next months show at Shildon. Going right back to the beginning of the thread there was mention of using an 85 to build an 83. The 83's were the shortest of the early locos so its proberly easer to cut and shut a Hornby 86 shell. I realy must finish mine........ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Further update from Bachmann 3/5/12......they have photographs of 85026 wearing the stripes in July 1982 with further possible evidence of sightings in 1981 with stripes but unconfirmed due to poor quality of the pictures. The orange stripe is clearly visible in this 1981 shot Hth Jim 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Call me a heretic (well I am from the Southern) but I can't give a flying pantograph whether the orange stripe is there or not - it's too good a model to worry about it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugd1022 Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Nidge, Your comments reminded me of this shot - the driver looks a bit apprehensive. An 81 not an 85 E3008 (81007) Crewe c1961 Hi Derek... that's a corker, I bet he's thinking "they didn't mention owt about these when I did me boiler training..." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted May 5, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 5, 2012 Nidge, Your comments reminded me of this shot - the driver looks a bit apprehensive. An 81 not an 85 E3008 (81007) Crewe c1961 He looks like The Third Sam to me !! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share Posted May 6, 2012 E3059_Euston_3-8-73 by robertcwp, on Flickr 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share Posted May 6, 2012 E3083_WeaverJct_1963 by robertcwp, on Flickr E3094_Motorail by robertcwp, on Flickr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share Posted May 6, 2012 E3095_KingsLangley_1H27_3-67 by robertcwp, on Flickr 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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