Heljan Beyer garratt

[Stevelewis]

Think of two 4Fs slightly out of rhythm, or any double-header, except all the noise emanating from one smokebox ? 

I have  some  0n30  Mallets,     now  I  know  the 2 sets  of  cylinders  are   closer to each  other  than  the  Garratts,   AND  the  sound  speakers  are in the  tenders!

 

But  the Tsunamni  sound  does  sound  OK,,  I have  never  heard  a  Mallet  so I cannot  say if it  is  correct, but  it  does  sound acceptable.

 

As an aside  the  Tsunami sound  decoders  are  very  versatile,  and   can  easily  be  altered  sound  wise, to   improve  the  sound  required  regarding  chuffs  per  wheel  rev etc,  I

 

So in my  opinion  if  I do  decide to go  ahead  and   buy a garratt  and  if  I decide  I want  sound  in it so long  as  it  sound reasonable ..... that will do me!!

[coachmann]

Puffs are very quiet on the Welsh Highland Railway and I have yet to hear one of their Beyer Garratts making voluminous sounds. Often the only audible warning of an approaching train is the whistle. A 'shuffle' rather than distinct 'woofs' is more the order of the day. This might be due to the fact that the exhaust steam from the cylinders has to make its way down passages back and forward to the smokebox.  

[Corbs]

Here's some other garratts, to give an idea

 

A variety of sounds - including a huge wheelslip

 

Some runpasts, and a pulling away with the engines in sync

 

Pulling away with the exhaust beats off-sync - ignore the music

 

 

 

 

Some Mallet sounds here, slow and fast

 

and here at speed - I think you can see variations of the exhaust beats being in time and offset

[JZ]

In the first of those videos, it sounds like many 4 cylinder engines working hard. Now I know many purists won't sleep until they have the definitive sound, but I for one would be with a generic 4cyl' sound. The whistle is likely to be the most distinctive sound anyway. Would this have been an off-the-shelf BP or LMS item?

[Rail-Online]

In the first of those videos, it sounds like many 4 cylinder engines working hard. Now I know many purists won't sleep until they have the definitive sound, but I for one would be with a generic 4cyl' sound. The whistle is likely to be the most distinctive sound anyway. Would this have been an off-the-shelf BP or LMS item?

LMS Fowler whistle (never Stanier hooter) I believe

 

Tony

[7013]

NZR sounds nice that would do for me.

[robmcg]

Thankyou Corbs for those clips.

 

Sounds very much to me like a typical 2-cylinder engine but with in some of the clips an added second engine, as often recorded with double-headers.

 

To be safe I'd make a chip with a standard 2-cylinder beat, maybe add a function with an over-dubbed second engine out of sync?  Not sure how to do this although with sound editing it shouldn't be hard?

 

In general I find all model steam sounds difficult because of the steady volume when a train passes, rather than rising and falling, but it's still very interesting. 

Edited March 16, 2014 by robmcg

[Ian Hargrave]

Saw my first at the Nottingham Show today.Very smooth runner.Shiny black finish does not impress.Will opt for the heavy weathered BR later version....the heavier the better to tone down the "Cherry Blossom" shoeshine.

Edited March 16, 2014 by Ian Hargrave

[GerryP]

I see Olivia's Trains has a sound file available for Loksound v4 decodes, listed from 7/3/2014. I am going tomorrow for other business, but will enquire

[250BOB]

Availability..............its been a few weeks now that the first two versions have been on sale.   Hattons still showing both released versions, 266201 and 266202, in stock.

 

So........how many of these first two versions have been made......and are they probably not the most popular versions.??

 

I did ask the question on a previous post.....but does anyone have any thoughts on how many each of all 12 versions are likely to be made.

 

I am going to wait until the heavily weathered versions are available before I take the plunge.

 

Bob

[Ian Hargrave]

Likewise.A decision reinforced by my first "sighting".See post 814 above.

[250BOB]

Likewise.A decision reinforced by my first "sighting".See post 814 above.

 

Yes, I did notice that Ian....and do share your thoughts .

 

I did think about a lightly weathered version, then having it more heavily professionally weathered by a friend who does weathering for me to a good standard.  Some very heavily weathered locos I have seen, are sometimes a bit over the top for my liking........I'm a bit undecided on this one.

 

Bob. 

[Tony_S]

...

 

I did think about a lightly weathered version, then having it more heavily professionally weathered by a friend who does weathering for me to a good standard.  Some very heavily weathered locos I have seen, are sometimes a bit over the top for my liking........I'm a bit undecided on this one.

 

Bob. 

I had the same thought! I ordered a lightly weathered one (now due May) and will add some extra weathering powders if I'm feeling artistic.

[Ian Hargrave]

Maybe the best way is to wait until they arrive at Hattons,take an online look and then decide? Has to be a well-researched decision when bending the plastic to that extreme,I think.Heljan's "heavy weathering" is,as yet,an unknown quantity.The "light" variety is underwhelming as seen on the LMS versions to date.

[Monjac]

I have ordered the heavily weathered version and eagerly await its arrival.

Throughout this thread, is it not great to note that there has been no criticism of Hattons.?  Any problems members have experienced have been  immediately  sorted out without question.  Hattons' service should be applauded .Perhaps we are taking this standard of service  for granted .? 

I live abroad but the speed of delivery , cost of postage and the level of service makes it feel as if Penny Lane is just round the corner. Keep up the good work.

But no delays please on my loco !!!

[robmcg]

Availability..............its been a few weeks now that the first two versions have been on sale.   Hattons still showing both released versions, 266201 and 266202, in stock.

 

So........how many of these first two versions have been made......and are they probably not the most popular versions.??

 

I did ask the question on a previous post.....but does anyone have any thoughts on how many each of all 12 versions are likely to be made.

 

I am going to wait until the heavily weathered versions are available before I take the plunge.

 

Bob

 

I have no idea of planned production volumes, a guess might be 1,000 per version, I doubt if there will be a shortage of revolving-bunker heavily weathered versions, but I wonder whether the price will remain at £199?

 

I would pre-order but don't know which number is most likely to appear first, or if they will all be released in one go. It would be galling to pre-order one and have others available, but I suppose I could pre-order the chosen number and style version and cancel if it wasn't available with others similar.

 

Equally I am about 50/50 on light/heavy weathering, same reasons as given here a couple of messages ago.

 

Also I applaud Hattons for their service, pricing and delivery of what looks like a marvellous model. 

I have just had a very indifferent e-purchase from TMC models  high postage cost £28  vs $12.50-£16.50 for same from Hattons , errors in process due I suspect to a new website system and tracking reference number somehow delayed until 'we pop up to collect our receipts for the week'... and no apology at all. To pay the extra postage, they described things thus; "You have paid £8.25 shipping on each order so far therefore we need to take a further payment of £5.75 on each order"... their website had charged £8.25 and processed it fine. I love the lack of apology and the phrase 'therefore we need to take a further payment'...   (my italics) , almost as if customers are nuisances...  there, I've had my vent.

 

So hats off to Hattons.

Edited March 18, 2014 by robmcg

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

On the subject of the planned volume of all the production runs; Hattons must have had some interesting calculations to make. Presumably making significantly more of the rotating bunker version, since these were much the more common through the service life as compared to the brief existence of most in the fixed bunker form. Two or three times as many perhaps? Maybe five tiimes? But surely not fifteen times as many? There aren't going to be that many folks who buy more than one of these monsters I suspect.

 

Although we may yet hear of some enthusiastic completist whose layout loco yard collapsed when the 29th Garratt went on shed for the first time...

[robmcg]

Maybe the best way is to wait until they arrive at Hattons,take an online look and then decide? Has to be a well-researched decision when bending the plastic to that extreme,I think.Heljan's "heavy weathering" is,as yet,an unknown quantity.The "light" variety is underwhelming as seen on the LMS versions to date.

 

The lightly-weathered version can be made to look ok to my eyes with blackened handrails and a few other changes, as here done with my photo-editing... in same ways it's more attractive than heavily-weathered even if less prototypical.

 

I'm still going to buy a heavily-weathered BR version though...

 

Here is my LMS 'hope-for-the-future' on the Midland Main Line in 1931. Actually I know it was never meant to be an engine type for widespread use, but it sounds good...   and it was a pity it wasn't built with better bearings... and that Stanier didn't hesitate to build the 8F... 

 

Edited March 19, 2014 by robmcg

[Ian Hargrave]

But we don't yet know what the heavy weathered version looks like,do we ?

[Bernard Lamb]

But we don't yet know what the heavy weathered version looks like,do we ?

Don't suppose we ever will as it will be hidden under a layer of muck and grime.

Bernard

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

... it was a pity ... that Stanier didn't hesitate to build the 8F... 

Given that Stanier faced pretty significant opposition within the LMS from the vested interests that wanted to carry on doing poorly the dreadful Derby way, the Garratts must have looked like a gift from heaven. Because he had a proven circa 1900 design 2-8-0 in his pocket from his GWR experience, which he knew was fully equal to the Garratt in capability; when it came time to produce the new standard LMS heavy freight loco initial teething troubles on the LMS had been thrashed out, so the basics of the boiler and engine layout were known to be sound. Built it, and it worked. Compared to the Garratt it was all win: smaller first cost, better performance, availability, reliability. It was someone like E.S.Cox who later said that this was what finally stopped the mouths of the naysayers...

[GerryP]

I see Olivia's Trains has a sound file available for Loksound v4 decodes, listed from 7/3/2014. I am going tomorrow for other business, but will enquire

Been to Olivia's today, shop was nice and quiet. Asked about Garrett sound, no problem would I like to hear it on test track. The original sound files are from the Australian model (he said they were very difficult to upload). Sound - fantastic, open throttle a bit too quick to get out of synch slip then steady deep chuff. Lots of sounds to play with, simulated clickety clack over track joints as a background noise, rods clanking, brake squeal etc. Bought the chip there and then. He told me they had an arrangement with Hattons for any sound fitted enquiries to be handled by Olivia's. So they can supply them direct sound fitted. They had replaced the Heljan fitted speaker with a Loksound as the original is not that good. Instructions for fitting the chip and speaker are detailed step by step on Olivia's website under the new developments section. All in all a good day out, nice friendly, knowledgable people.

Also got my G2A sound chipped, lovely, wheezes like a good un.

 

On another thread, coming home on the train, between Shireoaks & Worksop, amongst all the lines of EWS coal hoppers is a long rake of faded National Power coal hoppers (HKA) which have stood there for over two years. What a waste of good assets.

 

GerryP

[Brian Hawkins]

Any chance of a video of your Garratt with Olivia's sound please Gerry 

[kwste]

A little play with color. Air gun, brush and powder.
The dust cover covered with a paper handkerchief.
Not yet finished. But she looks so already better.

 

 

Ari

[robmcg]

Given that Stanier faced pretty significant opposition within the LMS from the vested interests that wanted to carry on doing poorly the dreadful Derby way, the Garratts must have looked like a gift from heaven. Because he had a proven circa 1900 design 2-8-0 in his pocket from his GWR experience, which he knew was fully equal to the Garratt in capability; when it came time to produce the new standard LMS heavy freight loco initial teething troubles on the LMS had been thrashed out, so the basics of the boiler and engine layout were known to be sound. Built it, and it worked. Compared to the Garratt it was all win: smaller first cost, better performance, availability, reliability. It was someone like E.S.Cox who later said that this was what finally stopped the mouths of the naysayers...

Great though the 8F was, the Fowler Garratt could steam well and with better frames/bearings it could have been a better engine than it was, being rather specialised in intent... 800-1,500 ton trains of often old loose-coupled 4-wheelers on an up-down-up-down Midland track profile was always going to require a very challenging level of enginemanship, and even if had had its mechanical and design shortcomings fixed, it would always have had its rather large grate to keep during extended stops, as well as specialised servicing and crew roster expectations. As was often the case railwaymen got a job done in spite of indifferent tools... and the 8F did not require changes in water cranes, engine preparation times, ashpan coaling and other things which beset the Garratts.