rob D2 Posted January 26, 2015 Share Posted January 26, 2015 So you can't leave it obviously, My original post was not offensive - I'm not abusing you personally, my own opinion is that Lima is " xxxxxx". Unfortunately that didn't fit your view so you bit with your condescending comments , and kept on writing " xxxxx" . If someone said your choice of car was " xxxxxy" would you get all upset ? It's no big deal. Please don't call me ' m'lad' either - again a kind of condescending comment obviously. Like I said , good luck with the Lima. I was in the Lima collectors club 15 years ago, but the world has moved on for me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesndbs Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Can we stop already, came home and saw lots of nice shiney new messages but the is getting annoying Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Sorry mike, It's amazing how things get out of hand easily on forums.....back on topic Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesndbs Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 Sorry mike, It's amazing how things get out of hand easily on forums.....back on topic Thanks Rob, I think it's a case of people becoming very attached to their collection. So it's all down to a great passion for the hobby, which is a very good thing, but we really don't need to fall out over it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold pheaton Posted January 27, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 27, 2015 It is a howes resprayed Bachmann 37 with the correct roof from PH designs. The mazak issue can strike at any time the problem is as i said none of the manufacturers have come forward and said "ok people we screwed up" this is what we will do and why, this is what we wont do and why. Personally if in 10 years time i find my 31s crumbling apart then yes ill be annoyed but i wont lose any sleep over it......in a model a couple of months or a year old, thats a slightly different story. Normally this would cause people to vote with there wallet and switch to another manufacturer but by having there own market (no-one else makes a super detail 31 or 50) Hornby can simply say dont like it....tough your stuck with us! I think the whole metal chassis is a little over-hyped IMHO in locos yes it makes sense. but units....really! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted January 27, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 27, 2015 Good quality motor bogies offer very good performance. The motor bogie used by HAG was beautifully engineered and offered silky smooth powerful performance, but that was not a cheap unit. The motor bogie used by Hornby for their Railroad diesels offers very smooth performance and is certainly more than acceptable IMO. So I do not see this as a question of demanding centre mounted motors and cardan shafts to all axles (or A1A-A1A as on some models) but that concept does offer a means of driving a model with excellent performance which in my opinion is probably the optimum solution for diesels at this time. Mazak is not the only material you can use for the chassis but it offers an excellent balance of weight, ease of manufacture and cost which means that despite the known pitfalls of mazak rot it remains the first material of choice for almost all manufacturers. I think it is important to keep a sense of perspective, yes there are issues but it does not affect all models and the number affected is small. We are not seeing diecast producers rushing out to dump mazak despite the fact they have been aware of the problem for decades, they take a reasonable judgement that the number of affected models is very low and the advantages of the material make accepting this slight risk acceptable. I own probably 2000+ diecast models and the number affected by mazak rot is less than 5. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derekstuart Posted January 27, 2015 Share Posted January 27, 2015 So what Mike and JJB are really saying is "EACH TO THEIR OWN"?There's an idea... I wonder why I didn't think of it myself. I have said all along that I prefer my approach, but respect the viewpoints of others. But that, it seems, fell on deaf ears with others. Mike, I wish you the very best in getting your model back intact. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesndbs Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 Hi, as an update I phoned Hornby after the their facebook manager told me I'd hear soon. There was nothing to tell really other than my loco had been received and was being worked on. Now does that sound promising or not? I note that a new super detail 31 is on pre order from Hornby, so maybe new chassis will be available. It would be so good to get a positive outcome. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted February 1, 2015 Share Posted February 1, 2015 (edited) I think the point that needs to be made is.... When the lima stuff came out, like the 37 and 47 there was no such thing as a model railway can motor....so it was lima....or Hornby and both motors equally had issues, having said that I could run a full length lima HST with little issues but at the same time some of my 31s were quite literally terrible....but then this is like comparing a 64 plate ford fiesta with a ford fiesta mk1, the mk1 when it came out was very good for its market but now the 64 plate one is much better...... In what way 'better' though, they will both get you from A to B in reasonable comfort, they will be comparable on fuel economy (like for like) but the new one will cost 10 times more than a good 'old' one, is the new one 10 times better than the old one and so worth 10 times more? If the old one breaks down you can fix it with a £10 tool set and a haynes manual*, the new one you need a degree in computer science, £300 of diagnostic equipment and a laptop just to find out which sensor is not playing, then the £10 tool set to change the sensor. Some might think that modern is 'better' but others of us prefer old and simple whether that be a car or a loco! Oh I did read the rest of your post to see that you were making the same (sort of) points. They each have their place but are not really comparable and for somebody to dismiss something as 'crappy' simple because it needs a bit of work to make into a good runner which they cant be bothered to do is downright rude! Oh I have had more problems with my 'modern/better' stuff than I have ever had with my old stuff and when the old stuff does play up it is normally easily fixed with minimal outlaw, unlike the 'new/better' stuff. My partners (newish, ECU controlled) car is currently stuck at work because the computer wont let the spark plugs work as one of the sensors is sending the wrong signal, a problem you dont really get with older (less refined) cars, with them if there is fuel going in and the coil/distributor are okay then it will start and run, just like my 21 year old daily driver does everyday. The new stuff will have more 'toys' on board but do we need the toys? * other manuals available. Edited February 1, 2015 by royaloak Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted February 1, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 1, 2015 Whilst I take the point about modern cars having toys that are there as much because the car manufacturers can make them as any real customer pull I think it is clear that a 64 plate Fiesta is vastly superior to a Mk.1 in pretty much every way. The engine will be more powerful, more efficient and have massively lower emissions. If you are unfortunate enough to have a crash a modern car will do a lot more to keep you safe than an old car. Active safety like ABS and traction/stability control do an awful lot to stop you having a crash in the first place. And some toys like air conditioning and memory card based infotainment are transformational in terms of journey comfort in my opinion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold pheaton Posted February 4, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 4, 2015 (edited) Touche royal oak Its -2 your late to book on....tell me would you rather fumble with a manual choke on your mk1 fiesta or would you rather the ECU sorts it for you? similarly would you rather scrape the windscreen or perhaps let the ford patented heated windscreen do the job for you? clearly you can appreciate a classic piece of machinery you and me are alike otherwise i wouldnt let 26043 commit emotional blackmail on me im not picking on the fiesta as such believe me as im sure your aware there are far more comical things to pick on in the motor industry (eg rover k series ) but ill level with you..... your a professional railwayman, and i tip my hat to you ..but in that unit on your avatar...youve had a day from hell would you like to get your tool kit out....or lift the magic switch that sits in front of your windscreen and as im sure your aware you cant do that in mk1 slammer Mk1 slammer = fiesta mk1 unless its a REP and then its an XR2i the unit in your avatar....ok hands up its not a 64 plate fiesta....but c'mon it's atleast a mk3 or at push mk4 Edited February 4, 2015 by pheaton Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesndbs Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Hi all, bit of an update. Had a letter from Hornby so was expecting the worse! However inside was a cheque refund the postage I'd used to send the 31 back to them. I thought it a bit odd so phoned up to ask. I could not get past the woman on the reception, but she said that was normal if the loco was in warranty! i said I thought it was not to which she said "I don't know then" So I asked about my loco. She could not say anything and just said it was 'in progress' and could take 28 days. I said could I please speak to someone who could tell me what was happening as it was a very precious item to me. I think this lady must have worked as a doctors receptionist because the was no way on earth i was going to get past her and this p'eed me off a lot. I note a new super detail 31 is out soon so just maybe I am going to be OK, for sure if they were just going to fob me off with £100 they would have done so by now? Does anyone know how to get past the receptionist and speak to someone who knows something? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted February 5, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2015 (edited) I take it you sent a cover note with the loco. Did you get a ref number before sending it as it ask you to do on the Hornby website. Or did you just send it? I sent a email for one a couple of weeks ago and have had no reply. So was wondering whether to phone Hornby or just send it back. With out the body and see what happens from there. Edited February 5, 2015 by farren Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesndbs Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 I take it you sent a cover note with the loco. Did you get a ref number before sending it as it ask you to do on the Hornby website. Or did you just send it? I sent a email for one a couple of weeks ago and have had no reply. So was wondering whether to phone Hornby or just send it back. With out the body and see what happens from there. Hi yes, got a number HC etc and have always used that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 (edited) Touche royal oak Its -2 your late to book on....tell me would you rather fumble with a manual choke on your mk1 fiesta or would you rather the ECU sorts it for you? similarly would you rather scrape the windscreen or perhaps let the ford patented heated windscreen do the job for you? clearly you can appreciate a classic piece of machinery you and me are alike otherwise i wouldnt let 26043 commit emotional blackmail on me im not picking on the fiesta as such believe me as im sure your aware there are far more comical things to pick on in the motor industry (eg rover k series ) but ill level with you..... your a professional railwayman, and i tip my hat to you ..but in that unit on your avatar...youve had a day from hell would you like to get your tool kit out....or lift the magic switch that sits in front of your windscreen and as im sure your aware you cant do that in mk1 slammer Mk1 slammer = fiesta mk1 unless its a REP and then its an XR2i the unit in your avatar....ok hands up its not a 64 plate fiesta....but c'mon it's atleast a mk3 or at push mk4 I am not saying "old is good, new is bad" and some of the new 'toys' are actually useful (I would give my kettle full of warm water for a heated screen this week) but the 'toy' would only clean the windscreen, my mark 1 kettle does all the windows , I havent scraped a car window in 20 years, the warm water trick does it for me. Gimmicks sell and we are where we are and there is no going back. Would a car with no toys, IE no central locking, no electric windows etc sell today? Yes but only about 4 a year, while the gimmick laden cars would sell by the thousands, its the modern way. Your post made me laugh (in a nice way) especially your reference to 26043 and my little train. Posts on forums tend to concentrate on one specific question and they dont give an overall image of a persons perspective, I like some toys on cars (electric windows, central locking etc) but feel that things are going a bit to far now (or I am getting older) and I dont need automatic wipers or lights, I can do those things myself. Anyway back on topic! What was the topic again? Edit- Hornby class 31 chassis destroying themselves. Edited February 6, 2015 by royaloak 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brittannia Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 Hello Mikesndbs Different departments deal with the returns and letters for vouchers, also the same if getting bodies etc back or purchasing a new loco. Very surprised if you get anything other than a £100 voucher even if a new 31 is due . Finally Hornby have a freepost address for returning the broken chassis and body Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Be patient Mike, I doubt the receptionist has anyone to put you through to - the service dept probably doesn't take calls as there all busy maybe ? Relax........... Mine took 10 months to return dos they had no chassis at that point.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derekstuart Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 10 months? To sort out a problem that is not of your making... and some people here have defended Hornby as if their life depended upon it. Mike, I would send a recorded delivery letter to them personally. You don't need to go in attack mode (that can come later IF needed) but a simple, but polite "what is going on" letter would be perfectly acceptable IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold pheaton Posted February 7, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 7, 2015 MIke, Hornby wont destroy stock to make a spare for you, i think you will find the chassis for replacements like yours are ordered speacially, its frustrating i know but Hornby normally come though! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Yes, that's the problem - it's batch production , so you have to wait until they are making the 31 chassis. And of course it needs to be compatible in terms of cowls etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaddeus Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 And of course it needs to be compatible in terms of cowls etc. I thought the buffer beam cowls were just stuck on? arent all the basic castings the same? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold pheaton Posted February 9, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 9, 2015 Only difference in the castings is between the sound equipped and non sound equipped models, the cowlings were just stuck on......but i suspect they will also have to supplied specially as well since i doubt the old ones come off the chassis at all in one piece. I think your find Hornby will produce a complete motorised chassis specifically for the returned models and then just discard the old ones. However a small number of sellers seem to be picking up a lot damaged chassis quite often on ebay and selling them as spare parts... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikesndbs Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Hi all. I have had Hornby social (chaps behind the facebook group) chase my case up for me and they have now said twice that customer care should be in touch and have said sorry for the delay. Thing is they have not been in touch. I've sent a further polite request for an update today. Making me feel a bit sick all this Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nile_Griffith Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 On the Mk1 or Mk "whatever it is now" Fiesta subject. Last year I actually managed to acquire my old Vauxhall Cavalier Sri (in white with the tin sun hatch!!!). Through the Vauxhall owners club. Now back in the day...... 1985. I had a grin so big you'd have got three "Wagon Wheels" in driving that car (nowadays you don't have to break into a smirk to get one "Wagon Wheel" in). Alloy wheels as standard, fuel injection, Recarro seats......... Did I mention it had fuel injection? Errrrmmm Recarro seats. Anyway it was in my opinion a pretty dandy car to go tooling around in and I loved it. So imagine my joy nearly thirty years later to find it available for sale and in "Excellent used condition". To be fair it's a mint example and according to my tame monkey wrench wielder, it's by far the best example he's seen, but it's cold and by cold I mean that grey damp cold that never really leaves it because the cars heating system is only really concerned with heating the air that flows six inches around the dashboard. Anything that lights up is woefully dim and driving at night anywhere other than well lit urban roads does add a certain frisson of trepidation as to what might be a little bit further ahead. Thirty years ago the cars brakes made it feel like it stopped on a sixpence. Nowadays by comparison, it feels like it could just about stop on the Greek national debt!! Everything feels a little bit............... disconnected. I turn the steering wheel and the car turns accordingly, but somehow the steering wheel doesn't quite feel like it's the one making all the decisions. Ignition is OK but you get the impression that your rousing a committee of somewhat un-colabrative parts from a deep slumber and one of these days the vice chairman of that committee is going to say "sod it! I'm having a lie in". The windscreen wipers are there, but somehow they are not. Doors close with a definite "donk" that after driving todays cars makes you wonder for the first couple of miles of your trip whether you should invest some time investigating hinges and catches. And that dashboard???? Every so often it launches into the sort of manic squeak that might have inspired that violin part from the music for the film "Psycho". In fact the cars trim in general all feels a bit....... Well like it was bodged together in some sweat shop in the far east. Wind noise??? At 30 mph??? And here is the final point. Driving at 80 mph feels a bit like Chuck Jaeger approaching the ragged edge of possibilities. I used to drive this thing when circumstances prevailed (and of course completely and utterly within the contains of the law) up at the ton. Not any more!!! By comparison to my nice but rather soulless Audi A4. My thirty year old Vauxhall hot hatch positively screams at you the folly of your decision to travel at speeds faster than the bloke with the red flag walking in front of you can attain. I quite like the fact that central locking doesn't mean I have to contort myself around front seats so as to let rear passengers into the car. My electric windows mean that when I have to talk to someone kerb side I don't have to release my seatbelt and wrestle myself across to the other side of the car to wind the window down. I rather enjoy the fact starting my modern diesel on a cold morning requires noting but a push of the smart key to start the comfortable thrum of a quiet diesel engine that will allow me 60 mpg (under the right circumstances). I enjoy the pleasure of being able to drive at motorway speeds and not have to divert my attention away from what is ahead by worrying about what it is that sounds like its about to fall of or drop out. I like my ABS which on more than one occasion has saved me a couple of quid in body shop bills and I'm also rather smitten by my traction control, which last year prevented me one wintery night (and it was quite an interesting experience when it kicked in) from being parked alongside the hard shoulder of the M1 like quite a few others. My Cavalier Sri is for blissful Sunday afternoons and personal indulgence of memories and days gone by. At the time it was a great car and a whole lot better than my old mans Morris Minor. But today it itself is the Morris Minor to my Audi A4. And yes it's true. The motor manufacturers will continue to add this and that, in a continuous attempt to get us to open our wallets and contribute to their profits. So just so long as I am profiting in some way, by my continued purchase of their product and that doesn't necessarily mean financially..... You know what.... I don't mind too much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derekstuart Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 No offence, but I didn't read all that. 1984 Cavalier heating worked very well, ISTR. Perhaps checking the demister matrix isn't blocked with 30 years of mouldy leaves? As for the instrument illumination- if you can't see a 1984 dashboard properly at night, well you know the advert for Specsavers. Brakes: sorry chum, but the most common reasons for cars of that era having poor brakes is aged components- usually the seals in the master cylinder or the brake servo. A 1984 car is less sophisticated than a 2015 version, quite clearly. But these feigned indignation "and the way we peasants used to suffer" in the 1980's is a load of trot. I have a number of cars of various ages, makes and spec- from an elderly Rover to a early 90s Cavalier, via a few French imports to a 10 year old Jag and a 2 year old Jag. Clearly a 2013 XK is going to be a nicer drive than a 1990 Cavalier, but I do not recognise your description of them as effectively death traps on wheels. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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