Bacup - Mills in the hills

[Anotheran]

...one idea is to use the templates that Shipley used for Leicester South, which were kept for future use. In case you haven't seen Leiecster, the backscene is basically a distant town scene made up of spraying different shades of grey using the templates so that the further back the buildings are, the lighter grey they are....

I'd never really noticed the back scene on Leicester South before (which I think is a compliment) but looking at some YouTube videos I see it's fantastic. Such a good idea. I think it would be a perfect way to compliment Bacup without taking away from the modelling at all. What's more, if the templates are available to you then trying it out isn't a huge layout in cost or time... but my gut tells me that you'll stick with it if the LS result is anything to go by.

 

Neil

Edited June 3, 2014 by Anotheran

[Black Sheep]

those are wonderful.....who makes them?

Had something similar on my 00 a number of years back. They were either P&D Marsh or Langley.

 

Kit comprised pedal car and Beano style go-kart with two boys.

Easy enough build

[Market65]

Hi, the weathering of the Crab looks good to me, I can't see the problem with the middle of the boiler. Good idea about those front steps, for I've done exactly the same dodge with my Crabs.

 

All the best,

 

Market65.

[Alister_G]

Jason, can I draw your attention to this video, which Holmesfeldian posted on my thread. It's a great collection of footage from all over the place.

 

In particular, at about 18 minutes in, there's some great shots of a North Lancashire town, with streets just like you've modelled.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5MJg26p23A

 

Not sure it's Bacup - but very similar.

 

Cheers mate,

 

Al.

[Jason T]

Cheers Al. In the office today and replying on my mobile but will take a look later.

[Arthur]

Michael Delamar posted a couple of stills from that bit around 18 minutes in, a while back. The view down the street with the large chimney base, and the view with the Black 5 running past the street end, in an attempt to get a location. Nobody could provide a definitive answer.

 

Behind the Black Five there looks to be a colliery spoil tip. If so, that would suggest somewhere more Central Lancs, the Wigan/Leigh areas. There were a few collieries in East Lancs but the balance of probability suggests further west.

[Donington Road]

PHEW!
I've just spent a week reading through the whole thread Jason.
What fanstasic modelling of the railway in the landscape, just the right balance of railway and scenery.  The superalatives have all been said so all I'll say is I'm gobsmacked at the detail and workmanship you have produced.  I think I need to go and lie down in the Lounge to recover, but before that I would just like to comment on the backscene issue.

I am not always in favour, Andy Y's b/w street scene with the photoshopped background is superb - your house beyond the railway bridge just gives so much depth to the scene.  If you were to physically attached that background as backscene to the edge of the boards then it would not look right at all IMO.  You would get shadows of buildings etc. cast onto it and it would always be in the same place relative to those buildings wherever you viewed it from in the room.  The only way I could see it working would be to have the backscene fixed to the walls of the room (and across the window) which would be well away from the back edge of the layout.  Viewing from the front would then give the impression of a more 3D effect where your buildings would seem to move against the backscene when looking from different viewpoints.  Problem is it would have to be 3 or 4 feet in height to accomondate sitting or standing views.

AndyP is a dab hand at backscenes, perhaps he could come round and paint your walls

[Jock67B]

Mick, I did something similar a few months back and like you, I was blown away by the workmanship and the speed at which Jason works - hard to believe that he does all that whilst keeping a full time job and maintaining a relationship at the same time!

When I typed 'Bacup' in the search box, the second heading was 'Bacup- Scenery, Transport and Structures in which Jason details his building methods and I have to say that it is well worth a scan through as he has some truly great ideas that I'm sure he wouldn't mind others using.

Kind regards,

Jock.

[Donington Road]

Mick, I did something similar a few months back and like you, I was blown away by the workmanship and the speed at which Jason works - hard to believe that he does all that whilst keeping a full time job and maintaining a relationship at the same time!

When I typed 'Bacup' in the search box, the second heading was 'Bacup- Scenery, Transport and Structures in which Jason details his building methods and I have to say that it is well worth a scan through as he has some truly great ideas that I'm sure he wouldn't mind others using.

Kind regards,

Jock.

Thanks for the link Jock

[LNER4479]

Bit late to the party Jason, as we went away for three weeks a few days before Andy visited with his camera. So just to say congrats on the shoot and, if what Andy has 'teased' us with so far is anything to go by, then I too can't wait to see it in print.

[unclebobkt]

I do indeed have a Hughes Crab; it's to all intents and purposes a L&Y loco even though it was built after the grouping.

 

       Sandside,

 

  Thank you for your reply.

  A rare pleasure to see one of Mr. Hughes idiosyncratic 'Crab.' locos.;  unfortunately Rugby being v. much ex-L&NWR. territory we didn't see all that many.

  With their relatively low BPs., (180.PSI., I recollect?), wch. favored lower boiler maint'ce. costs amongst other things,  Hughes had to have larger diameter cylinders in order to achieve a reasonable TE. - hence their being lifted up higher than is usual to clear the platforms.

  Our GWR. fans may remember that Churchward was not in favour of the cylinders' CLs. being different from those of the Coupled Wheels, (give or take a couple of inches.);  but even the GWR. with its  more generous loading Gauge did have to raise its cylinders slightly for some of its locos..  I remember seeing a photo. of the GWR's. visiting 'Castle.' to KX., this for the 1925. loco. exchanges,  being measured most carefully for Width Overall to ensure that was would be sufficient clearance to the platforms' edges.

  The GC., being designed from the start with the continental loading gauge in mind,  was not bedevilled with such problems.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[coachmann]

A Stockport based engine used to come on Lees shed every day, usually a Fowler 'Crab Tank' 2-6-4T. One day it was a Crab 2-6-0. While sat on the tiny "bar stool" I was imagining what it must be like rattling down the mainline with an open space behind me (the tender was much narrower). An elderly driver climbed aboard and sat on the opposite stool and exclaimed, "Damned engines". That was all he said so I buggered off!

Edited June 15, 2014 by coachmann

[LMS2968]

There's just no pleasing some people!

[unclebobkt]

 One day it was a Crab 2-6-0. While sat on the tiny "bar stool" I was imagining what it must be like rattling down the mainline with an open space behind me (the tender was much narrower). An elderly driver climbed aboard and sat on the opposite stool and exclaimed, "Damned engines". That was all he said so I buggered off!

 

 -- Narrower tender thanks to Fowler's & to Derby's efforts,  I believe?

[coachmann]

There's just no pleasing some people!

There was something on the "Midland" engines that LNWR men just did not like. It may have been the live steam injector but I have forgotten at this distance in time. On the other side of the coin, there was plenty the Midland footplate men and other railways did not like about the LNWR 0-8-0....It scared them!

[Class O]

There was something on the "Midland" engines that LNWR men just did not like. It may have been the live steam injector but I have forgotten at this distance in time. On the other side of the coin, there was plenty the Midland footplate men and other railways did not like about the LNWR 0-8-0....It scared them!

My dad told me just after nationalisation some LMS men came to see how to improve the mineral workings, a Q6 passed them on a southbound coal working, full forward gear and wide open regulator (they worked a bonus scheme around here), This frightened the LMS men who thought the driver had gone mad, saying he would break the engine, They left shaking their heads. I remember seeing coal workings in the 60s they did not hang about......

[Jaz]

I do indeed have a Hughes Crab; it's to all intents and purposes a L&Y loco even though it was built after the grouping. Mine has been renumbered to 42719 (a Bury allocated one, I believe) which although only one digit different from the as-suplied number, had all the numbers replaced so that there would be no differences in numeral sizing, colouring, etc. Weathered by me, could do with looking at again as I am not overly happy with the middle section of the boiler.

I also changed where the front steps attach so that they wouldn't catch the pony truck wheels when going through crossovers; they are about 1mm further out than they should be.

 

 

The backscene 'issue' is ongoing, chatted with Andy Y and Paul about it at the weekend (and Chris-GNR the weekend before) and one idea is to use the templates that Shipley used for Leicester South, which were kept for future use. In case you haven't seen Leiecster, the backscene is basically a distant town scene made up of spraying different shades of grey using the templates so that the further back the buildings are, the lighter grey they are.  Combine that with the hills behind them and you get a hazy scene with no real building details (which can kill a backscene if not done right - in my opinion).

 

Weekend with BCB was great too, always nice to meet up with old mates and make new ones

there's not many blokes willing to admit to have crabs.....very brave of you....

[coachmann]

there's not many blokes willing to admit to have crabs.......

Even less with pop it valves....

Edited June 18, 2014 by coachmann

[Clive Mortimore]

 -- Narrower tender thanks to Fowler's & to Derby's efforts,  I believe?

Or was it the L&YR cab on a Crab was too wide :scratchhead:

[LMS2968]

When the Horwich Crabs were being designed, George Hughes ordered a suitable tender, based on the later ones attached to the Dreadnoughts, to go with them. Needless to say, these would have matched the width of the cab. Henry Fowler, on taking the CME's position late in the engines' design process, ordered that they be paired with the LMS Standard 3,500 gallon type, derived from the Midland article.

 

The Horwich and Stanier Crabs often receive criticism for the mismatch between their cab sidesheets and tender sides, but they weren't alone. When built, the Royal Scots also got this tender, as did the early Jubilees (some of which had them very late on), although some of the 5Xs managed to dump them on to 8Fs, which therefore also share the ignominy.

Edited June 18, 2014 by LMS2968

[Jaz]

Jason

I often notice little gems on your layout, but as your thread is so big searching for when you originally added them would be exhaustive. Do you have an index or guide anywhere on the thread?

[Jason T]

There's no index, even though I have suggested it to other people. One of the reasons for this is that I have a habit of jumping from one task to another so it would be all over the place and would probably take longer to put together than it took to build the layout

 

As an example, a couple of weeks ago I was building the Phoenix LMS Push Pull coach and it progressed quite well but due to lack of time in the past week and spurred on by the efforts of others, I've been weathering wagons instead.

 

Now weathering wagons shouldn't take long and doesn't have to, but I've been looking at photos on Paul Bartlett's site and trying to match the look of real wagons. What this means is that a wash of dirty thinners is a total and utter no-no because let's be honest, it ends up looking like a wash of dirty thinners. What I wanted to capture was the pitted, peeling look that these wagons seem to be covered with and as such, a cocktail stick has been the main weapon in the armory, with dry brushing and cotton buds also being used. The grain wagon has had a wash of dirty thinners, but only after the whole wagon was coated in grimy paint, with this then being all but removed with the thinners and cotton buds. There is a long way to go with the grain wagon, and most of the ones in the photos need the underframes doing too.

 

 

 

The rust colour is a mix of Humbrol Matt Black and Railmatch Sleeper Grime, with the mix being more black than brown.

[Sasquatch]

The hoppers are looking good Jason mate!

Agree about the wash with dirty thinners. When Using paint it just looks like a dirty wash, however have you tried using weathering powders in the thinners? All weathering using dry powders is done over a shallow box and all that falls in is then used to good effect as wash mix!!

[Jason T]

Not tried that Shaun, but will give it a go

[Sasquatch]

Have just finished one! so posted it on my Goathland thread!!