RMweb Premium melmerby Posted December 31, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) Hi all We seem to about to get an SR "Van B" in 00 gauge and we already have a "Van C" The question is was there a "Van A" and what is the ex-Triang bogie luggage van based on? Cheers Keith Edited December 31, 2011 by melmerby 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Not sure if there was a 'Van A' - the only other passenger brake van on the Southern was the Ferry Van, which is what it was called. The Triang vehicle is loosely based on the 'Gangwayed Bogie Luggage Van' of which there were 120 similar over 5 lots. Mike King's book on Southern Coaches is your best guide to all this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 The ex-Triang model closely resembles the GBLV, but a new 2012 model is believed to be from new tooling. My understanding is they're doing the Van B not the GBLV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted December 31, 2011 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 31, 2011 My understanding is they're doing the Van B not the GBLV The picture I have seen looks like a Van "B" as in Tatlows NPCS book Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Hi all We seem to about to get an SR "Van B" in 00 gauge Except we ain't supposed to know about it yet..................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBill Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Even though I don't know about it, I want one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Remember there's an SECR utility van fully restored on the KESR known as the Cavell Van. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 1, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 1, 2012 Remember there's an SECR utility van fully restored on the KESR known as the Cavell Van. Following 10800's hint earlier, Mike King's book quotes the 45 SECR Cavell Vans as the prototype for the SR Covcar - or CCT as it became in BR terminology. The confusing thing to the casual observer is that Southern built superficially similar vehicles, some with guard's brakes, some without. So the Covcar/CCT did not have that facility, while the Vans B & C did. The Triang-based model that is so derided for its inaccuracies - despite being unmistakable for any other vehicle, which is why it still sells - did not have a brake compartment, but did have corridor connectors, while the Bogie Van B that we are NOT talking about here had the brake but no gangway. Ratio do the Van B in 4mm, and it looks good, but has a superdetailing package that some of us struggle with, while Hornby's Van C has lots of lovely detail applied by nimble Oriental fingers, thankyou. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestburyJack Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Following 10800's hint earlier, Mike King's book quotes the 45 SECR Cavell Vans as the prototype for the SR Covcar - or CCT as it became in BR terminology. The confusing thing to the casual observer is that Southern built superficially similar vehicles, some with guard's brakes, some without. So the Covcar/CCT did not have that facility, while the Vans B & C did. The Triang-based model that is so derided for its inaccuracies - despite being unmistakable for any other vehicle, which is why it still sells - did not have a brake compartment, but did have corridor connectors, while the Bogie Van B that we are NOT talking about here had the brake but no gangway. Ratio do the Van B in 4mm, and it looks good, but has a superdetailing package that some of us struggle with, while Hornby's Van C has lots of lovely detail applied by nimble Oriental fingers, thankyou. Is the Covcar/CCT you mention the one modelled by Wrenn and now Dapol? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 1, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) Is the Covcar/CCT you mention the one modelled by Wrenn and now Dapol? Without owning one (I have a Parkside version on my overloaded workbench) I can't be dead certain, but am fairly sure, yes. Mike King records that the common SR luggage van - called PMV in BR parlance - was pretty much identical to the CCT in side elevation - but lacked the CCT's end doors. Again Parkside's version is half-built on my ...... Edited January 1, 2012 by Oldddudders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted January 1, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 1, 2012 Another good guide is 'Southern Railway Passenger Vans' by David Gould (Oakwood Press). It has some excellent drawings of all the principle types. The 'Cavell van' was in fact the prototype of all the Southern vans. It was also used to transport the remains of Captain Fryatt and the 'Unknown Warrior' in 1919/20. This and the first vans differed from the later vans in lacking the vents beneath the windows and IIRC even planking. Parkside do this version as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBill Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Talking of Hornby non-releases, a couple of the ex-SECR PMVs were fitted out with pull-push apparatus for the Brockenhurst--Bournemouth West service and were (I believe) the last pre-grouping passenger rated stock in service. We have the M7, all we need is a suitable pull-push two-car set... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 1, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 1, 2012 As these Van Bs do not officially exist (yet?) will I be able to buy one with non existent money? Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Talking of Hornby non-releases, a couple of the ex-SECR PMVs were fitted out with pull-push apparatus for the Brockenhurst--Bournemouth West service and were (I believe) the last pre-grouping passenger rated stock in service. We have the M7, all we need is a suitable pull-push two-car set... I assume you're not making predictions here . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted January 2, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2012 To try and summarise SR GBL (Gangwayed Bogie Luggage) - BR Cor-PMV (Corridor - Parcels / Miscellaneous Van)- Produced by Triang and since by Hornby SR Van B or Bogie Van B - Kit by Ratio and during RTR 2012 Hornby SR Van C - BR BY - Kit by Parkside and RTR Hornby SR Van U (Utility Van with end doors) - BR CCT (Covered Carriage Truck) - Kit by Parkside and RTR Wrenn SR Bogie Scenery Vans (Hi arc roof bogie version of Van U also called Elephant Vans) - BR GUV - Kit I think by Jedenco SR PLV (Passenger Luggage Van) - BR PMV (Parcels / Miscellaneous Van) - Kit by Parkside 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 The GBL, Van B, Van C and Scenery van were also all done by Roger Chivers as brass kits (and very good they are too). He may also have done CCT/PMV and Ferry Vans, I can't remember now - I haven't got them anyway. Certainly he did Queen Mary brake and ballast plough brake 'cos I've got them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted January 2, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 2, 2012 Didn't Marc models make a brass kit of the ferry van that was available through MR magazine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Seems they still make it http://marcmodels.co.uk/html/night_ferry.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffnut Thorston Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I have a few of the Trri-ang BLV. (As used for Sir Winston Churchill's funeral train. The man, not the Loco!) I like the M7 Push-pull set... LINK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 and presumably 2013 for the BR blue version - won't as good as my Ratio kits anyway - just like the BY wasn't - that's why I bought 2 !! I'm guessing that the "Elephant" van will be a Kernow limited edition as part of its on-going weedkilling train project ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Out of curiosity, I looked at the 'Forthcoming Releases' section of Hatton's site. I couldn't see any mention of a Bogie Brake Van; however, there were listings for a 'Gangwayed Luggage Van'. They were priced at £23, about the same as the Van C- does this mean that the old Triang van is being rolled out again? It's older than I am (well, almost..) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 Out of curiosity, I looked at the 'Forthcoming Releases' section of Hatton's site. I couldn't see any mention of a Bogie Brake Van; however, there were listings for a 'Gangwayed Luggage Van'. They were priced at £23, about the same as the Van C- does this mean that the old Triang van is being rolled out again? It's older than I am (well, almost..) The reasonable supposition elsewhere on RMWeb is that this is a Hattons typo - they mean non-gangwayed, as the Bogie Van B is. But £23 does sound alarm bells, especially as one of the other websites claims to have seen examples and describes them as superb. £23 does not buy that much quality in 2012, even at box-shifter prices! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted January 3, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2012 As Ian says this is a case of Hattons getting the description worng I can confirm that the Hornby announced new release is the Bogie B Van from completely new tooling and not either a simple re-release or retooling of the GBL Gangwayed Bogie Luggage Van. Images of the pre-production sample of the Hornby Bogie Van B can be seen on my blog here. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravenser Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Out of curiosity, I looked at the 'Forthcoming Releases' section of Hatton's site. I couldn't see any mention of a Bogie Brake Van; however, there were listings for a 'Gangwayed Luggage Van'. They were priced at £23, about the same as the Van C- does this mean that the old Triang van is being rolled out again? It's older than I am (well, almost..) There's a photo+ picture on the Hornby website where it's described as an Ex SR Luggage Van in the heading and bogie passenger brake. But the end is very obviously ungangwayed and it's obviously a Van B ( at least its very obvious if you've slowly been building the Ratio kit) I assume the photos are the Ratio kit - the coupling looks suspiciously like it , unless this release is very close indeed This is certainly not the Triang van , though I can see how Hattons got confused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravenser Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 As Ian says this is a case of Hattons getting the description worng I can confirm that the Hornby announced new release is the Bogie B Van from completely new tooling and not either a simple re-release or retooling of the GBL Gangwayed Bogie Luggage Van. Images of the pre-production sample of the Hornby Bogie Van B can be seen on my blog here. It looks quite exquisite and scores over the kit in 2 areas I can see - window grills are provided, and the brake pipe along the solebar is modelled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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