The Fall & Rise of the 60's ( was The End of the Tugs?)

[beast66606]

It was quite lucky (or not, depending on your point of view!) that 60085 was spare at Warrington this morning. The only other locos on hand were 40145 and 47815...

 

That would have been a sight, 40145 topping 59201 - and I bet Mr Wood would have been top of the volunteer drivers list

[46444]

Evening,

 

Saw 60071 'Ribblehead Viaduct' Wellingborough tonight on the Lindsey tanks.

 

Nameplates intact as well and a really good sight and sound.

 

Cheers.

 

Mark

 

 

[46444]

Evening again,

 

Been out with my new toy this afternoon.

 

Hanging around Wellingborough/Harrowden Junction for the Lindsey tank train and hoping a 60 would be on the front again. Well there was but it had failed so a Shed was in charge!

 

 

 

Not a good day for the Tug then?

[brian daniels]

Don't forget that a 59/2 is geared for 75mph so it won't have the same tractive effort as a 59/0.

[40044]

Some pics of 60085 and 60054 at Liverpool Docks today in this collection: http://stuarts-phots.fotopic.net/c1473014.html

[nat37670]

Some pics of 60085 and 60054 at Liverpool Docks today in this collection: http://stuarts-phots...t/c1473014.html

 

Love 60054 still in its well weathered Trainload Petroleum livery Nice.

[Guest Phil]

A GM locomotive awaiting material for 3 weeks? Surely not!

 

Depends if DBS wanted the courier airmail delivery option, or whether it was cheaper to have the surface mail tramp steamer option from the good ole U S of A

[Michael Delamar]

Some pics of 60085 and 60054 at Liverpool Docks today in this collection: http://stuarts-phots...t/c1473014.html

 

good to see a train on the branch to seaforth container terminal, is that a new/regular working?

 

Mike

[40044]

good to see a train on the branch to seaforth container terminal, is that a new/regular working?

 

Mike

 

Runs every Friday Mike. It arrives at about 0500 with the loaded train, the empties depart Seaforth any time between 1500 and 1600.

[newbryford]

 

 

Have heard of a couple of occasions where the 59 has struggled, seems a bit strange as they have superior pulling power?

 

Keep catching up with this thread every few days........

 

The 60's are slightly superior to a 59 when it comes to pulling - I guess they would be far better than a 59/2 with the higher top speed, thus lower tractive effort. There was some extensive comparison testing done with 59 and 60's in South Wales over Stormy Bank and the 60 came out on top. But as I've said before, the 59's were given some TLC and the 60's weren't!

 

Cheers,

Mick

 

 

Cheers,

Mick

[Grimleygrid]

Went to visit the in-laws at the weekend and got authorisation from HQ to go out Tug hunting, result!

Managed to get a photo of 60071 working the 6E41 Westerleigh to Lindsey empty bogie tanks at Badgeworth.

 

 

 

Cannot believe that this is my first photo of a 60 in 2010!

[46444]

Nice photo of 071. Saw her in Wellingborough last week on the Lindsey tanks.

 

Popped up to Toton yesterday pm. Couldn't believe my eyes. I'll let the fots do the talking:

 

 

 

 

 

60051 on shed hopefully to be repaired following it's failure on Friday (See my previous fot).

 

One consolation in this sea of faded 90's freight glory was DBS 37419.

[Simon_R]

I pass toton most weeks along the A52 and this scene has been developing gradually for the past few months. It looks like DBS are storing all of their potential disposal haulage at Toton now, including the failed 37419 and a few 08's. Sad to see them like that. Presumably they will shortly be offering them for sale 'as is' and with any luck one or more of the smaller TOC's will be brave enough to save a few from the gas axe. If you look at it from DBS's point that a whole chunk of cash just sitting there. I bet the scrap value alone would pay a few months worth of the lease on the 66 fleet.

[The Stationmaster]

Depends if DBS wanted the courier airmail delivery option, or whether it was cheaper to have the surface mail tramp steamer option from the good ole U S of A

 

SoundS like EMD's spare parts distribution has gone to pot.

 

The system they used to operate was that anything destined for the UK up to and including the size of a traction motor was despatched by air freight on the day they received the order. It was quite common for Merehead to fax an order for a part on one day and go up to Heathrow to collect it on the following day, technical queries were normally answered on the day they were received and ARC received a similar service (as did CIE so I was told by someone then working at ARC).

[Steadfast]

There is a 60 back in south Wales. 60096 worked the Robeston to Westerleigh this morning

cheers

 

jo

[beast66606]

And 60074 made a brief appearance on the Tunstead/Oakleighs

['CHARD]

SoundS like EMD's spare parts distribution has gone to pot.

 

The system they used to operate was that anything destined for the UK up to and including the size of a traction motor was despatched by air freight on the day they received the order. It was quite common for Merehead to fax an order for a part on one day and go up to Heathrow to collect it on the following day, technical queries were normally answered on the day they were received and ARC received a similar service (as did CIE so I was told by someone then working at ARC).

 

This was definitely the basis of supply whilst Turner Diesel had sole management of the after-sales parts. Not sure that those aggressive guaranteed turn-rounds still apply now they're no longer in the frame.

[Grimleygrid]

Keep catching up with this thread every few days........

 

The 60's are slightly superior to a 59 when it comes to pulling - I guess they would be far better than a 59/2 with the higher top speed, thus lower tractive effort. There was some extensive comparison testing done with 59 and 60's in South Wales over Stormy Bank and the 60 came out on top. But as I've said before, the 59's were given some TLC and the 60's weren't!

 

Cheers,

Mick

 

 

Thanks Mick, I had heard that the 60s performed better on the Llanwern ores. As you say the 60s certainly have not been given much TLC!

 

I take it 60096 has gone down to Margam to work the Murco tanks, but what has happened to the 59 that was down there? Does anyone know?

 

So 009, 011 and 074 have or are nearly ready to return.

[Steadfast]

Indeed 60096 was on the Murcos yesterday. Hasn't run today, but is allox 0B47 (Westerleigh - Robeston) from Margam, so looks like it may well do tomorrow.

59205 was the first one to try the tanks, undergoing a fairly big exam (D, IIRC) at Merehead prior to use. It went back to Westbury after a week or so, and 59203 replaced it, lasting a week before several days of double sheds and now 60096 is back. I did rather hope that 59206 would make it onto the Murcos, as the red would look good with the red tanks, but a 60 is even better!

cheers

 

jo

[Shedmaster]

Hi all,

 

I'm gonna miss the 59/2's down south, especially 203'...........it was always getting regularly spanked down here, but came back from the fitters as good as new every time !!!

 

 

Dave

[Glorious NSE]

All the published data i've seen suggests the 59/2 are actually geared the same as 59/0 and 59/1 though, the top speed allowed being more to do with the extra suspension dampers making a higher speed safe rather than different gearing to making a higher speed more likely - published specs seem to put gearing and T/E at the same across all three 59 types?

http://www.therailwaycentre.com/New%20Loco%20Tech%20Data/Class59.html

 

I'd be interested to know if any of the info on that link is wrong, there seems to be precious little out there on any tech differences between the batches.

 

If they are the same it still begs the question of why they can't even handle a measly coal train in the North West.

[Michael Delamar]

hey Stu, I love your shot of one passing over the cemetery gate bridge in Anfield Liverpool.

 

http://stuarts-phots.fotopic.net/p64228572.html

 

Mike

[The Stationmaster]

All the published data i've seen suggests the 59/2 are actually geared the same as 59/0 and 59/1 though, the top speed allowed being more to do with the extra suspension dampers making a higher speed safe rather than different gearing to making a higher speed more likely - published specs seem to put gearing and T/E at the same across all three 59 types?

http://www.therailwaycentre.com/New%20Loco%20Tech%20Data/Class59.html

 

I'd be interested to know if any of the info on that link is wrong, there seems to be precious little out there on any tech differences between the batches.

 

If they are the same it still begs the question of why they can't even handle a measly coal train in the North West.

 

Did the 200 series have 'Super Creep'? It definitely sorts the men from the boys in low adhesion situations so I wonder if it wasn't included on the National Power locos?

 

One thing that does need to be borne in mind with Class 59s is that they can be very slow when moving high tonnage on steeper gradients. So I again wonder if someone is trying to be clever and feeding in more power, in an attempt to get more speed out of the loco, because they don't understand the driving technique?

[StaffsOatcake]

60009 is currently on the 6H06 Oakleigh Sidings (Northwich) - Tunstaed working.

 

As for 37419 things may be looking up. It was running at Crewe IEMD the other week and I understand has been transferred to Toytown pending Load bank testing and a possible return to traffic.

[Swindon 123]

Did the 200 series have 'Super Creep'? It definitely sorts the men from the boys in low adhesion situations so I wonder if it wasn't included on the National Power locos?

 

One thing that does need to be borne in mind with Class 59s is that they can be very slow when moving high tonnage on steeper gradients. So I again wonder if someone is trying to be clever and feeding in more power, in an attempt to get more speed out of the loco, because they don't understand the driving technique?

If the 59's are like the 66's there is no real driving technique. If its a heavy train on a steep gradient it doesn't matter where you put the power controller the loco feeds as much power as the computor will let it to the traction motors. The big problem on a 66 is that with a good dry rail they will cope alright, but if the rail is wet or greasy then the loco starts to cut power to all the traction motors. The 60's coped a lot better because the traction power to the traction motors stayed high with the traction current only being reduced to the one/s that where slipping. From personal experience a 66 is not a patch on a 60 in terms of shifting a heavy load up a steep gradient on indifferent rail.

 

Paul J.