Hot pies - plus VAT

[Horsetan]

I remember when VAT was a brand of whisky.

 

....In the UK this shows up most with air tickets, where a £5 ticket can quickly become £80 - (Leeds to Krakow!] ....

 

Are you having your teeth done in Krakow as well?

[Geoff Endacott]

At Trainwest we give out discount vouchers for the following show. We don't put the vouchers in the guides to save VAT. Why? The guide is treated as a book and is therefore zero rated for VAT. We don't have to pay VAT when they are printed. Vouchers have a cash value and are therefore subject to VAT. We must therefore pay VAT on the printing cost of the vouchers. If we printed the vouchers in the guides, we would lose the zero rate and have to pay £150 VAT on the cost of printing them.

 

It certainly pays to know the VAT rules.

 

Geoff Endacott

[Old Gringo]

Oh dear, I sent Pete (Trisonic) a "Hot Pie Voucher" with his Christmas card, I didn't realise that the voucher would incur VAT - and now the hot pie will too!

 

I think I'd better go and fill my Jerry can with petrol, as I was told to do yesterday by one of the crisis management team.

[Kenton]

I was speaking to our local garage owner yesterday as I filled up both my 5 litre cans and usual car's tank weekly top-up from near empty to the brim. He was suggesting this "crisis" is not all about sensible precautions in advance of the tanker driver's union arranging another anti-government fight principally over pay. He is convinced that there are other issues behind this.

 

Many garages have quite large storage tanks built from the days of cheap fuels and reasonable profit margins. However many of these have been reaching their "life expired" point and will need to be replaced with more modern units with advanced "features" along with new pumps. This is a major capital outlay, especially for the "independent". This capital outlay cannot be justified on the meager margin that they make on fuel and is one of the reasons why garages with fuel forecourts are closing.

 

He also indicated that the restocking of fuel has now become so efficient that he can make a call during the day and be resupplied the next day and could even restock overnight if he could be bothered. Apparently this delay used to be anywhere between 3 days and a week. As the fuel sitting stock in his tanks has to be paid for on delivery, including tax, this is a massive amount of cash that is tied up in the business. So it has become the practice to manage this delivery - stock level - supply to a finer degree than in the past. So much so that any slight and atypical increase in demand causes them to temporarily run out.

 

He was convinced that the ulterior motive was to encourage garages to increase this stock level in advance of union troublemaking but also to generate a spike in taxation to help growth statistics.

 

He is almost as much a cynic as I am.

 

BTW the two jerry cans of fuel are so I can run my lawnmower to cut the grass that has started growing. It is an annual event. There was no queue at the garage either.

 

And am I the only one who has this dislike of motorists who only stop to add 5 litres of fuel to their tanks and then cry help when they run out or the engine goes bad due to all the crud in the bottom of tanks.

[trisonic]

Let's see, the South East (in particular) this Summer will have:

 

1. A Water Crisis (the Thames will split at the bottom again per Daily Mail, 1976)

2. A Fuel / Gas Crisis (probably to be blamed on John, hoarding)

3. A Hot Pie Crisis

 

All three of which seem to be peculiarly aimed at both travelling Model Railroads and Musicians.

 

What can an Ex-Pat do to help ameliorate the situation? The Red Cross will only fly in Fruit Pies (Apple, Blueberry or Cherry) from over here........do we need to set up a supply chain all the way from Australia?

 

What a conundrum.

 

Best, Pete.

[Tony_S]

One minister's comment about another one.

He didn't understand the size of a jerrycan.

mildly amused me.

[Baby Deltic]

I see Mr Osbourne was saying people should eat cold pies. Hopefully he will be made to eat humble pie at the next election.

[Ron Ron Ron]

The VAT on food items was the subject of much discussion on Radio 5 Live yesterday afternoon, with a dozen or so crazy anomalies being unearthed.

Apparently the hot pie and pasty issue comes down to the provision of a service.

It's the service that attracts the VAT.

Supplying a pie that's warmed or kept hot, is supplying a service. Serving it cold as delivered to the shop is not.

 

I can't remember all of the anomalies they brought up (and many were hilarious), but here a a couple.

 

Supply of dead mice (for feeding to reptiles). Sold loose, no VAT. Sold pre-packaged, add VAT (because pack ageing them is a service).

Supply of live day old chicks (for said reptiles), no VAT. Dead day old chicks, add VAT (killing them is a service).

 

 

.

[The Stationmaster]

Supply of dead mice (for feeding to reptiles). Sold loose, no VAT. Sold pre-packaged, add VAT (because pack ageing them is a service).

Supply of live day old chicks (for said reptiles), no VAT. Dead day old chicks, add VAT (killing them is a service).

 

Don't (live) day old chicks come in boxes any more - they always used to (or the ones I ever came across did)?

[Guest stuartp]

Don't (live) day old chicks come in boxes any more - they always used to (or the ones I ever came across did)?

 

My boss once accidentally turned a box of Red Star day old chicks into dead ones by leaving a pack of dry ice pellets on top of them in the parcels office. I don't think the consignee saw it a a service.

[Guest Natalie Graham]

Try selling seeds. Flower seeds are VAT rated while vegetable seeds are zero rated. Simple enough. Except... some flowers are edible, such as nasturtiums which some people use in salads, so they are zero rated too. Great fun keeping track of that.

[Baby Deltic]

Don't (live) day old chicks come in boxes any more - they always used to (or the ones I ever came across did)?

 

Yes. They have KFC on the side. I think they come in bargain buckets too.

[Horsetan]

Has anyone informed Sweeney Todd and Mrs. Lovett of this change in the VAT rules?

[Guest Natalie Graham]

Yes. They have KFC on the side. I think they come in bargain buckets too.

 

Does serving food in a bucket count as a service?

[Horsetan]

Does serving food in a bucket count as a service?

 

Depends if you're putting pearls before swine.

[Ron Ron Ron]

Biscuits....

Choc Chip cookies (biscuits containing small pieces of chocolate chips/lumps) are zero rated.

Chocolate Digestives (biscuits coated with a layer of chocolate) attract VAT ('cos the chocolate has been added after the biscuit has been baked).

 

 

.

[Ron Ron Ron]

Eating Lovely Hot Pasties.

 

...or is that Lovely's eating Hot Pasties?

...or Hot Lovely's eating Pasties?

 

 

 

[Horsetan]

Eating Lovely Hot Pasties.

 

...or is that Lovely's eating Hot Pasties?

...or Hot Lovely's eating Pasties?

 

To misquote the Cadbury's Creme Egg advert:

 

"How do you...eat yours?"

[iak]

Biscuits....

Choc Chip cookies (biscuits containing small pieces of chocolate chips/lumps) are zero rated.

Chocolate Digestives (biscuits coated with a layer of chocolate) attract VAT ('cos the chocolate has been added after the biscuit has been baked).

 

Oh the joys of British bureaucracy.....

[trisonic]

To misquote the Cadbury's Creme Egg advert:

 

"How do you...eat yours?"

 

I'd better not go down that route...

 

Best, Pete.

[Unicorn1]

The forserty commision (or someone similar VAT Registerd) cuts down trees, they sell the wood to a processing plant and charge VAT.

The processing plant claims the VAT back, turns the wood into pulp and sells to a paper mill - charging VAT.

The paper mill claims the VAT back, and turns the pulp into paper, and sells the paper to a manufacturer, charging VAT.

The manufacture claims the VAT back, turns the paper into bags and sells them to a wholesaler, charging VAT.

The wholesaler claims the VAT back, and sells the bags to a retailer, charging VAT.

 

you've guessed it

The retailer gives the bag away!

 

Les

[Kenton]

That is what keeps the bean counters and the bureaucrats in jobs and businesses wasting production time on red tape, would you want to see them all turned out on the street and having to work for a living?

 

For every VAT rule there are disputes and the only winners at budgets are those who unravel and advise on the changes in tax law. (Oh, and the faceless ones in the treasury who dream it all up to give them some sense of importance)

[iak]

That is what keeps the bean counters and the bureaucrats in jobs and businesses wasting production time on red tape, would you want to see them all turned out on the street and having to work for a living?

 

 

Yes........!

 

[lmsforever]

Osbourne must be desperate for money to do this but as usual in the rarified world of the treasury they cant understand the real world ,tried to fill up tonight but lots of idiots causing traffic jams (I am nearly empty) what a country .Bet he will never raise tax on caviar!!!

[Kenton]

Osbourne must be desperate for money to do this but as usual in the rarified world of the treasury they cant understand the real world ,tried to fill up tonight but lots of idiots causing traffic jams (I am nearly empty) what a country .Bet he will never raise tax on caviar!!!

 

Sure he is desperate enough to raise money, he has to as he famously wasn't left any by the overspent previous government.

 

but nasty politics aside ...

 

he is simply closing a tax loophole along with many others. VAT has always been there on heated food but some smart legal brains managed to get cooling pies labelled as cold. Now if the pies are above ambient they are included.

 

Oh, and do remember that the treasury is apolitic (the swcivil service) - it simply comes up with suggestions for the party in power, it is then up to the ministers to make an issue of it.