Hayfields turnout workbench

[Siberian Snooper]

I have come up with a solution to that very dilemma with the work I'm doing.

 

It is called "stare at it for long enough, think about it and do nothing and eventually you lose interest and learn to play the violin."

 

It really works for ME. There again, if I had YOUR talent...

Building turnouts is not rocket science,if you know which end of a soldering iron is hot and you know how to use a file, you can become proficient at building them. Your first few will be ropey, but they won't get any better by playing the fiddle.

[hayfield]

Building turnouts is not rocket science,if you know which end of a soldering iron is hot and you know how to use a file, you can become proficient at building them. Your first few will be ropey, but they won't get any better by playing the fiddle.

Very true, though mostly now it's the solvent brush rather than soldering iron. Cut your teeth on those which will be hidden away in the fiddle yard and invest in gauges

 

I have a very good friend who built a P4 company turnout kit without any gauges and it works very well, especially as it was his first turnout, not to recommended though without gauges.

 

Have a good plan/template, then use it as a guide working with/to the gauge(s), the other thing is to think the build sequence through and keep checking it, and above all enjoy it. will up load a photo of my progress later

[hayfield]

 

Just starting to put the items together, will test them tomorrow

[Derekstuart]

I meant that if I had your track making talent I wouldn't learn to play the violin myself.

Talent, violin and me are words that definitely not go go together. 

 

Thanks. I've made quite a few already and they work quite well now. I'm moving from P4 to S4, which means the solder-less crossing is out the window, sadly. But I am as ever in awe of John's talent.

Building turnouts is not rocket science,if you know which end of a soldering iron is hot and you know how to use a file, you can become proficient at building them. Your first few will be ropey, but they won't get any better by playing the fiddle.

[hayfield]

 

Just showing the way I build the obtuse crossings, for 00 gauge I have soldered 2 of the crossing rails and under test it all works OK.

 

Because we have common crossings both sides of each crossing, with fixed wing rail gaps, you must be careful to maintain the back to back gauge through the crossing, this is where 00-sf check rail gauges are very useful. From experience this is the main cause of issues when building one of these crossings, next is the positioning of the tips of the Vee's. If these are correct it is relatively easy to do the rest

 

I am also fitting the straight switch rails at the same time, as aids being able to test the crossing during construction, couple of minor tweaks may be required but that might be just down to the way some chairs react to the solvent or gauges being a bit on the tight side

[hayfield]

 

Things like work and visit the the garage is getting in the way, the curved stock rail has been prepared as well as both remaining switch rails. Various chairs have been added to the existing rails, just a couple of crossing rails for the diamond and various check rails need forming

Edited November 25, 2016 by hayfield

[hayfield]

 

Nearly there with the crossing, just need to trim back the copperclad strips and then fit the remaining chairs. Its not dirty track just the reflection from the chairs. The chairs on the centre 2 timbers have not been glued in place yet, thats why they are out of line (as a reminder)

 

I am coming to the conclusion that for 00 and EM gauges it is possible to use the chairs functionally on diamond crossings when plastic sleepers are used, rather than solder everything up. The chairs do fit snugly on to the rails and hold everything in place, it might also be possible in P4 using the check rail chairs within the obtuse crossing, I still need to think on this one though

Edited November 30, 2016 by hayfield

[hayfield]

 

3 way on the bench, the timbers which are missing will be made from copperclad and will act as the tiebars, building to 16.2 mm gauge through the crossings, opening out to 16.5 mm at both ends to match RTR flexi track

 

 

The common crossings are being fabricated off plan (or rather on a separate mini plan). If building in copperclad I would start by fitting the furthest away common crossing, which in this case is the left hand exit. With this turnout I will start off fitting the first common crossing followed by the right hand one (which is attached ). One more wing rail to be fabricated and fitted

 

The extended wing rail on the right hand exit is only connected to the Vee at the tip, I will use cut down 0.8 mm check rail chairs (as I do with check rails and) fixing in place with a check rail gauge from the other common crossing. I have found that if a wing rail gauge is used on both sides of the crossing between two common crossings the back to back may end up a but tight, especially as one side has to be fitted with a wing rail gauge.

 

One thing I try and do is to think about how what I am doing now is going to affect something two or 3 stages along. To a certain degree this comes with experience, but for those starting out I would suggest writing out the build sequence, if only to get you thinking about which parts affect each other

 

You will also see I have marked out isolation cuts, the wiring is quite simple with the first two common crossings electrically connected to each other. If in doubt there are wiring diagrams on the C&L website

[hayfield]

 

Too many items got in the way yesterday, especially rebuilding part of this common crossing as somehow the tip of the first Vee moved when I reset a wing rail which I was unhappy with and only noticed after I had cut back the copperclad strips.

 

There are no special chairs for 3 way and tandem turnouts, there are common components used throughout both switches and crossings, the common crossing parts for example, not to mention small, bridge and check rail chairs, these are all used where required. But there are situations where rails are too close together to use these standard items and a block chair is required. Some may just carve up an appropriate normal chair, if possible I like to use something closer to what I think should be there, though in reality the designers may well have come up with a different design solution

 

With the obtuse crossing and slip chair packs there are plenty of spare chairs so as you can see I was trying to find a suitable filler between the end of the first wing rail and the closer rail of the right hand exi

[hayfield]

 

All 3 common crossings now in place, I had to do the twin unit a second (or was it a third) time as it came apart when I put some chairs on, this time using 2 mm x 0.5 mm brass strip. First I stuck the central (top one in the photo)  common crossing, then attached the left (which is on the bottom right in the photo) hand common crossing. Once set the remaining common crossing was fixed in place

 

 

It is vital that the wing/check rails on the central exit are fitted using check rail gauges, if the back to back measurements between them are too wide stock may bind whilst going through. The long wing/check rail is only soldered into position in 3 places, to maintain the gauge I have used check rail chairs, with one outer part of the chair removed, fitting each side alternately. The 4 mm (0.8 mm) chairs are designed to hold two rails 0.8 mm apart under tension, when one part is cut off the inner block seems to spread enough to fill a 1 mm gap

[hayfield]

 

This rail acts as the datum line, set using gauges when opposite to crossings. Then by eye using the template as a guide. chairs added as the plan required with slide chairs being added once the chairs had set

 

In an earlier thread I stated that planning/looking forward to the next steps is vital with these turnouts, the x's above and below the lettering (these are the common crossing chair positions) are where the check rail chair positions on the stock rails (see below)

 

 

The lower stock rail is stuck into position opposite the crossings only, 00sf through the crossings and opened up to 16.5 at the ends. Check rails also being fitted

[hayfield]

 

All this talk about planning ahead and I have come across a slight problem, you can see that I have fitted the centre parts of the block chairs forming one of the centre switch rails, but next to them is a check rail

 

 

Here is the switch rail (which also has a switch rail) and clearly there should be chairs (a bridge chair then standard S1 chairs) after the block chairs. The simple solution is to trim the chairs on both check and switch rails to fit next to each other, and could be the last resort if necessary. I will try something different by using some chairs from an old slip sprue

 

The sprue's for the special chairs (slips, obtuse crossing and additional switch chairs) are quite wasteful, for example the slip set covers one side of a slip and has chairs for a 1-7 and a 1-8 crossing, the obtuse crossing also is for one side but covers 1-5,6,7&8 crossings and you end up using less than half of the chairs on the sprue. The additional switch sprue's cover one left and one right hand turnout, either for an A,B or C size. Some chairs are used in two or three alternatives other just for one and again plenty of spares left over

 

I normally find the switch spares the most useful, especially when doing non standard sizes, in this instance I will start off with some slip block chairs. The idea is that the check rail chairs (0.8 mm) have been set at the correct distance (1 mm apart appx) using a check rail gauge from the other rail. The outside part of the two chairs will be cut of , leaving the centre parts of the 4 check rail chairs maintaining the correct distance. I will then find (hopefully) 4 block chairs that will hold the switch and check rails in place.

 

As Baldric says I have a cunning plan !!

[hayfield]

 

Well had a play with which chairs fitted where, ending up with a mixture of block, small and bridge chairs 

 

 

I doubt if it is 100% prototypical, and I guess most will not notice, but to my mind looks far better than cut up chairs

 

 

The lower switch rail is formed but not stuck in place, as I am waiting for the other two switch rails and their chairs to check chair spacings, the plan is to fit the middle pair of switch rails first (I think), I will need to juggle the chair types to fit their positions . Still its slowly coming together

[hayfield]

 

All 4 switch blades are now built and temporally in position. Now waiting for the cast slide chairs to come from C&L as I have run out of them

 

 

Two remaining check rails have been fabricated and will be fitted and I will make the PCB timber tiebars later which will give the filler time to set.

 

I will remove the switch blades for the first switch (left hand side, as I need access to the two shorter switch blades to solder them to the PCB timber tiebar, once this is done I can fit the remaining chairs and fit the last two switch blades, but as they are allows me to test the unit whilst access is relatively easy

[Black Country Mon]

 

 

Hayfield thanks for the step by step guide it has inspired me to convert to EM gauge and build my own track.

 

First turnout above a LH B7.

 

The hardest part i find is getting the chairs onto the rail even with a tiny chamfer on the end, some just don't want to go and end up getting split (to be reused later and not chucked out). But apart from that and forgetting to add the set until i was halfway along fixing the curved stock rail. Managed it of sorts though. Just got the tie bars to add and some brass slide chairs with a copperclad sleeper. 

 

 

Dave

Edited June 4, 2017 by Black Country Mon

[hayfield]

Dave looks very good, are you using C&L of Exactoscale chairs? as the former has a bit of flash in the chairs owing to the age of the moulds. Wherever possible I use the Exactoscale products which seem to be easier to thread

 

If a chair breaks, just cut them in half and use every 3rd or 4th sleeper. You have to dress the ends of the rail quite a bit also keep the rail off the foot of the chair. Just a knack you get used to until a rogue chair appears

 

Every now and then I miss count, either I re-thread the rail or just cut the chair in half if using plastic timbers

 

Back to the house extension now

[Siberian Snooper]

I find that just putting a scalpel blade through the jaws first, will help before sliding the chair.

[Black Country Mon]

Dave looks very good, are you using C&L of Exactoscale chairs? as the former has a bit of flash in the chairs owing to the age of the moulds. Wherever possible I use the Exactoscale products which seem to be easier to thread

 

If a chair breaks, just cut them in half and use every 3rd or 4th sleeper. You have to dress the ends of the rail quite a bit also keep the rail off the foot of the chair. Just a knack you get used to until a rogue chair appears

 

Every now and then I miss count, either I re-thread the rail or just cut the chair in half if using plastic timbers

 

Back to the house extension now

 

 

Cheers for the kind comments, i've only used Exactoscale components so i'll try chamfering the rail a bit more, there is a definite technique to it.

 

Enjoy the building work.

[hayfield]

Speaking with Len Newman (the designer ) a few years ago, he was an advocate of making the rails a bit longer than needed and putting a long taper on one end of the rails, then cutting to length once all the chairs had been fitted. I find using both normal and needle files all that is needed

[hayfield]

Its been a long time since I have felt comfortable with my own work room space, We moved two years ago (last week was the anniversary) And January 2017 I started the preparation work for the house extension. By Christmas the house was habitable, with a few electrical items which needing finishing along with some woodworking still needing doing. 

 

I was hoping to unpack my railway items into the work/railway room after Christmas, but then suffered an illness where I had to stop doing everything physical until the problem was resolved ( a couple of dodgy veins) plus you get into a mind set and a bit of lethargy sets in. The NHS came up trumps and over the past 3 weeks I was allowed to do more as time went by. 

 

 

The start of sorting out the work bench with most of my tools and spares now unpacked, no doubt it will evolve over time but I have no excuses now other than get on with it. Still have a few boxes in the loft mostly rolling stock and scenic bits, which can be sorted out over time.

 

 

The nearly an outside slip is finished, just waiting a final test

 

 

As is the 3 way, once I am happy with these I have a couple of slips to build, the good news is I can swap the timbers on the one I have started to a new automated Templot template which will be far better than my own efforts

 

Another thing is I joined the local railway club and ended up on the 0 gauge section, I had room made available where I built a turnout and slip for them. And as I added to my own small 0 gauge items decided to build a turnout to make a test track for my newly obtained s/h kitbuilt locos

 

 

A small A5 as I want to check stocks agility

 

 

My feeble attempt to make some block chairs

 

 

 

[hayfield]

Forgot to upload the close up shots of the block rails

 

 

I must have a look again at Off the Rails at Shapeways, as the block chairs and other special chairs do look terrific in 7 mm scale,

 

For me used to C&L pricing the check chairs are not too bad if bought in bulk (£3.50 per set against £7 for a single unit),

 

Common crossing chairs also look very good but fall in to a more expensive price bracket of £8.20 a pair as only sold in smaller quantities

 

But the A switch chairs whilst looking simply divine, but at £10.50 a set of 24 chairs, where for me 12 out of the 24 chairs are duplications of what I have in the C&L range is pricey

 

I am not having a go at the designer, who in my opinion rightly deserves rewarding for some simply stunning work, no doubt having put hours into designing these items (and I guess earns little from it), Its the cost of this process as charged by Shapeways at the moment that I am not used to. Just looking at if I ordered a sample pack of each the combined cost would be £7 + £4.10 + £10.50 = £21.60 added to the existing costs of the C&L components, For me still a bit expensive, but at some time I will have to bite the bullet. I would not mind so much it if I felt a decent slice of the cost went to the designer, I repeat not having a go at the designer just the costs of this system at the moment

[hayfield]

 

In between other chores the slip has progressed, first the 2 common crossings are fitted

 

 

Then the 2 stock rails fitting a piece of 0.5 mm copperclad across the centre timber, to maintain the gauge (this will be cut back to the rail sides at the end)

 

 

Next up are the outer slip rails along with 4 more smaller pieces of copperclad strip, these will hold the obtuse crossings (diamond) in place

 

The crossing rails are easy to make with the EMGS common crossing filing jig, its just a case of cutting them to size then soldering up to the copperclad strip using gauges

 

Tested as I went along with a wagon, then with a loco under power

 

Next up is to start fitting some slide and slip chairs

[hayfield]

 

The first of the 2 centre switch rails have been fitted after I have added some chair detail

 

 

Whilst I am waiting for chairs to set I have started a copperclad turnout in EM gauge

Steel rule is an easy way of keeping the timbers in line

I have also made the isolation cuts, after marking the cuts out with a pen I remove one at a time and a few passes with a junior hacksaw breaks the copper foil without digging into the glass fibre, also checked each cut with a multi meter for shorts

 

Its so much easier and neater to do the isolation cuts before any rails get in the way, also if you fill the gaps at this point its so easy to sand the filler flat making the break invisible once painted. Also much easier to find shorts if you have failed to gap the timbers properly. OK it takes a bit longer, but its not a race also can save time looking for faults once built

 

I must own up to wincing every now and then when I see some of the butchery slitting discs have made to some turnouts

[hayfield]

 

Spent mot of the day either recovering from the previous day back at work and furniture hunting, rather than risk half finishing the slip, I just did a couple of things on the copperclad turnout

 

As its being built using code 82 flatbottom I filed back the foot on the stock rails to accept the check rails, and before fitting the curved stock rail I put the set (bend in the rail) on the curved stock rail, something many novice builders are either unaware of or just plain forget to do, then wonder why the turnout is not working properly. then gently curved the stock rail to match the plan.

 

If you are new to track building do use decent plans, they are so widely available and with Templot so easy to design and make. Why do people who have no knowledge of turnout design principals and of scale/gauge standards ever attempt to draw there own, let alone encourage others to do so is beyond me. Templot now is so easy to make plans of turnouts to any size and radii to fit most if not all designs just with a few clicks of a mouse, even with slips and 3 ways. And before you even cut a timber just take a couple of mins to look closely at it, where the bends ar as well as curves. Write on the plan with a few notes for reminders, I still do this, have some coloured pens or highlighters

 

Off soap box, next I fabricated a wing rail and switch rail

 

 

What a good buy from Lidl a few weeks back, £30 and a godsend with the 7 mm rail also made like a bit easier with the flatbottom.

[hayfield]

The past 2 days have been very unproductive, yesterday recovering after 2 days at work ( surprising how 10 weeks rest affects ones stamina) And today a rehab session for 2 hours, still I am able to most things, just need to get organised

 

 

The slip whilst still needing check rails, seems to work OK but worried how stiff the tiebars will be with 4 switch blades attached to each of them, I am being cautious incase I have to hinge the centre blades

 

 

The copperclad turnout is finished and ready for testing

 

If you remember I built a 7 mm turnout and I have been hankering after getting a bit more detail to them, I think I have mentioned Off the Rails on Shapeways, well I have bit the bullet and ordered one set of A  switch chairs

https://www.shapeways.com/product/2KB5YVZS2/a-switch-chairs?optionId=65004874

and 2 pairs of check rail chairs

https://www.shapeways.com/product/XWPQ5YRKA/check-rail-chairs-1-75mm-twin-pack?optionId=3523365

 

If I feel its worth £10 for a pair of Modelu loco crew I guess its worth at least trying these as the extra detail may be worth paying for. I guess I should have at least bought some A (slab and bracket) common crossing chairs. Or the Common crossing chairs

https://www.shapeways.com/product/HGR34RQ7K/1-in-6-common-crossing-chairs?optionId=42401893

But these are designed for Scale Seven so will only be cosmetic, so the dodge of using a slab and bracket chair for the A position and just rely on standard chairs being cut up may be a better choice

 

I have left links for the Shapeway chairs as I do not know if I can post photos off their site, otherwise I will take photos once they arrive