Wright writes.....

[Headstock]

10 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

In response to Tony's query about the Parkside Dundas Pipe wagon kit; it represents the BR pattern, but (AIUI) that was derived from a design built by/for the LMS and LNER, with the running gear of the owning company's type.

 

Some of the BR ones certainly ended up in departmental use on the WR and SR, generally branded as "Tunny", but that probably happened a bit later than LB's period.

 

Most engineering wagons in the fifties did tend to be pre-group/early grouping types withdrawn from traffic use on their home regions, though.

 

John

 

Just for clarification, the Parkside kits are not the Pipe wagons I was referring to on LB.

[bbishop]

45 minutes ago, swampy said:

I remember reading in an article on pooling wagons ( maybe an early MRJ Chris Crofts piece? ), where the author wrote that if you hesitate to put a GWR open with sheet bar and a coal load onto an LMS coal stage, you haven't understood the concept of wagon pooling. The photo illustrates this perfectly.    

The SR wagon is quite blurred but could be an example of D1380.  Bill

[Dunsignalling]

31 minutes ago, Headstock said:

 

Or the LNER vans built for the LMS, they are not fake wagons.

 

This is a fake wagon, complete with its Dean Churchward brake gear. Its a con.

 

https://www.aandhmodels.co.uk/33-857b-30t-bogie-bolster-wagon-lms-grey-59089-p.asp

Though it must also be borne in mind that the vans built for the LMS had unfitted 2-shoe Morton brakes rather than the LNER pattern 8-shoe AVB fitted to most built for their own use.

 

I'm currently making one using the body parts from the discontinued Parkside PC05 kit, albeit with the 1950s BR 4-shoe AVB upgrade. 

 

John

Edited December 22, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, drmditch said:

 

But what about the SR Vans built for the LMS, or the five-plank opens built by the SR (I think) to an LNER design?

 

(Can supply references if required, but only when house has warmed up!)

 

I do try to take care with my freight/goods/mineral stock, although I probably do have too high a proportion of NE labelled vehicles.

I am still surprised by the absence of a 'one-source' provision for LMS fitted vehicles. (That is pre-1948 vehicles, not those altered under BR)

Since I 'model' (in my own inadequate way) the NEA of the LNER in the 1940s, most of my mineral stock is properly labelled NE, but I do have a question about 16t steel wagons. I'll try to sort out a picture first.

 

Adding to the WW2 theme, the SR also built a batch of RCH 8-plank minerals, on steel underframes, some for themselves and some for the LNER.

 

I think Cambrian do (or have done) a kit for them.

 

John

[john new]

46 minutes ago, Headstock said:

 

Or the LNER vans built for the LMS, they are not fake wagons.

 

This is a fake wagon, complete with its Dean Churchward brake gear. Its a con.

 

https://www.aandhmodels.co.uk/33-857b-30t-bogie-bolster-wagon-lms-grey-59089-p.asp

But learning this is part of an individual’s modelling journey, I didn’t know that was a made up design falsely applied livery for example until seeing the above.

 

Our modelling journey is like the flow charts you see with Y or N branches. I started with a wind up Hornby tinplate O gauge, I quickly learnt there were passenger trains and goods trains and those had the brake van on the back. Even at 3 or 4 years old my subconscious meant (a) I noticed and (b) that it mattered. Similar progressions followed over the decades and similar Y & N decisions are being made as to does it matter if it is wrong - do I correct it?
 

Currently my position for running my shunting plank for private operation is anything goes it is the puzzle solving that matters (I.e first 8 wagons from the stock tray, pick a loco I like but may not be correct for the line etc.) but for any public viewings/photographs the mix will be as close to authentic as I can get.
 

As I learn more that fidelity will become more accurate.

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by john new
Corrected in line with a later post.

[Jesse Sim]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

It's not a 'what', it's a state of being.

 

It means inviolable - not to be violated, to be kept from infraction, profanation................

 

Isn't our language wonderful?

 

'See' you tomorrow.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Oh yes, it never ceases to violate my brain! 

[Headstock]

11 minutes ago, john new said:

But learning this is part of an individual’s modelling journey, I didn’t know that was a made up design for example until seeing the above.

 

Our modelling journey is like the flow charts you see with Y or N branches. I started with a wind up Hornby tinplate O gauge, I quickly learnt there were passenger trains and goods trains and those had the brake van on the back. Even at 3 or 4 years old my subconscious meant (a) I noticed and (b) that it mattered. Similar progressions followed over the decades and similar Y & N decisions are being made as to does it matter if it is wrong - do I correct it?
 

Currently I think my position for running my shunting plank for private operation is anything goes it is the puzzle solving that matters (I.e first 8 wagons from the stock tray, pick a loco I like but may not be correct for the line etc.) but for any public viewings/photographs the mix will be as close to authentic as I can get.
 

As I learn more that fidelity will become more accurate.

 

 

It's not a made up design, its a genuine GWR bogie bolster. Selling it as an LMS bogie bolster is the fake bit. About six months ago, I had a look through the wagon section of two of the big manufactures catalogues. I forget the exact figure now but between one half and two thirds of wagons in the catalogues were fake. most were fake liveries but there was still a high proportion of made up designs and mutated versions of real designs.

Edited December 22, 2021 by Headstock

[St Enodoc]

53 minutes ago, Iain.d said:

Well this is the completion of my last build for 2021, a Comet Coaches LMS D1810 Restaurant First in crimson and cream. It has taken longer than expected but that is tempered with having completed a few other bits and pieces that I wanted to do.

 

 

There’s nothing particularly special about it, but I am pleased with the way the tables, lamps, curtains and seats all seem to work together.

 

There are no diners - on the Somerset and Dorset in the early 1950s (which is where I hope to represent this carriage one day) Restaurant First were listed as being in a few summer Saturday Only services such as the 7.50am Bradford – Bournemouth, 10.30 Liverpool – Bournemouth and the 10.35 Manchester – Bournemouth. Most of these southbound services would likely have stopped serving lunch by the time they passed through Midsomer Norton in the mid to late afternoon, well, that’s my reasoning!

 

And here it is coupled to its attendant Third Open, a D1807 from a BSL/Phoenix kit. Both carriages have Stones Ventilators from etches by Rumney Models and are lined with Tamiya enamels. My lining is improving – thanks Geoff.

 

 

A request for assistance if I may? HMRS transfers are now very hard to get hold of and I only have enough 4mm ‘Ms’ for one more carriage – these are the running number letters from Sheet 14 BR steam era loco and coach insignia. Is there a modeller on this thread who would be willing to swap their ‘Ms’ for letters that I have loads of and they might need? I have plenty of ‘Es’, ‘Ws’, ‘Ss’ and ‘Sc’s’. In fact I have almost complete sheets of transfers less the ‘Ms’!! I’m happy to pay the postage costs to/from Australia. I have about another 6 LM region vehicles to do. Please PM me if you’re willing to help.

 

I will try, if time allows, to upload some different images of the things I have made in the last year, in the next few days, otherwise, I hope you all have a safe and happy Christmas.

 

Take care and kind regards,

 

Iain

PM sent.

[Richard_A]

2 hours ago, Iain.d said:

Well this is the completion of my last build for 2021, a Comet Coaches LMS D1810 Restaurant First in crimson and cream. It has taken longer than expected but that is tempered with having completed a few other bits and pieces that I wanted to do.

 

 

There’s nothing particularly special about it, but I am pleased with the way the tables, lamps, curtains and seats all seem to work together.

 

There are no diners - on the Somerset and Dorset in the early 1950s (which is where I hope to represent this carriage one day) Restaurant First were listed as being in a few summer Saturday Only services such as the 7.50am Bradford – Bournemouth, 10.30 Liverpool – Bournemouth and the 10.35 Manchester – Bournemouth. Most of these southbound services would likely have stopped serving lunch by the time they passed through Midsomer Norton in the mid to late afternoon, well, that’s my reasoning!

 

And here it is coupled to its attendant Third Open, a D1807 from a BSL/Phoenix kit. Both carriages have Stones Ventilators from etches by Rumney Models and are lined with Tamiya enamels. My lining is improving – thanks Geoff.

 

 

A request for assistance if I may? HMRS transfers are now very hard to get hold of and I only have enough 4mm ‘Ms’ for one more carriage – these are the running number letters from Sheet 14 BR steam era loco and coach insignia. Is there a modeller on this thread who would be willing to swap their ‘Ms’ for letters that I have loads of and they might need? I have plenty of ‘Es’, ‘Ws’, ‘Ss’ and ‘Sc’s’. In fact I have almost complete sheets of transfers less the ‘Ms’!! I’m happy to pay the postage costs to/from Australia. I have about another 6 LM region vehicles to do. Please PM me if you’re willing to help.

 

I will try, if time allows, to upload some different images of the things I have made in the last year, in the next few days, otherwise, I hope you all have a safe and happy Christmas.

 

Take care and kind regards,

 

Iain

That looks fantastic. 

[MJI]

A question about Comet carriage kits.

 

The bogies.

 

The instructions have no proper suggestions on how to fit.

 

I have been laminating plastic card on one vehicle to produce the correct height, but there must be a better way.

 

So far 2 floors have MJT with their design, one has plastic card spacers, two more to go.

[cctransuk]

19 minutes ago, MJI said:

A question about Comet carriage kits.

 

The bogies.

 

The instructions have no proper suggestions on how to fit.

 

I have been laminating plastic card on one vehicle to produce the correct height, but there must be a better way.

 

So far 2 floors have MJT with their design, one has plastic card spacers, two more to go.

 

I invariably use laminated plastic plus a small washer for one bogie; plus laminated plastic pads bearing on the bogie's bolster on the line of the wheels, for the other bogie.

 

This gives a three point arrangement, preventing the body from wobbling.

 

CJI.

[Tony Wright]

Quite an exciting day!

 

I had a ride over to Ian Wilson's in this..................

 

 

It's a McLaren something or other with 740 HP! 

 

My car is the same colour.

 

 

Getting in and out was fun. 

 

Fortunately, I'd worn by armoured trousers to counter the acceleration. 

 

A mate came over in it, bringing this with him............

 

 

Hornby's latest original W1 (as far as I know, I should have one to review in BRM). 

 

What an astonishing RTR model. 

 

I'd have liked to have given this a full run on LB, but those footsteps are way out of gauge and clouted the platform edges. 

 

However, this ran very well.

 

 

Seen yesterday, but what a difference the correct numberplate makes to the 'face' of this A3. Ian Wilson's numberplates are the perfect type. 

 

Thanks for a fun day, Ollie.

 

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Tony Wright
to add something

[Adam88]

On 18/12/2021 at 18:25, Kier Hardy said:

If you were a trainspotter back in the 1950s & 1960s at any location along the East Coast Main Line, no doubt your first consideration would be the number of the locomotive, and perhaps the consist of the rolling stock. It's possible you may have known some of the footplate crew, but generally they would have been anonymous. This post is all about Driver Charles Kirton who was held in high regard working the top link express trains, so I thought there wouldn't be a better place to share this bit of information about Driver Kirton than here in Wright Writes. No doubt if you were 'lineside' during this period, you might just have caught a glimpse of him.

 

I'd always known that my wife Sara's Grandfather was a train driver out of The Cross, but until the recent passing of my Mother in Law, and the subsequent clearing of her house and contents, a folder containing newspaper clippings and letters has just come to light, so I thought I'd share some of it with you.

 

Notes on Driver C Kirton dated June 1962

 

Driver Kirton pictured in charge of A3 locomotive 60067 Ladas – date and photographer unknown.

 

British Railways – Notice of Royal and Additional Trains, Thursday 8th June 1961. For further details and images, please see.........

http://www.emgauge70s.co.uk/proto_driver-kirton.html

 

60067 pictured ready to leave Kings Cross.

 

From the 'Great Northern Line News' (British Railways Eastern Region September 1962).

 

I hope this is of interest to some of you..... it certainly was to me. I might just have to get myself a model of Ladas and convert it to EM gauge, even if it is out of my usual era of interest.

 

Seasons greetings to one and all. Best wishes, Kier

 

 

What a fascinating post.  I am most surprised that it hasn't started one of those digressions which make RMWeb so interesting, especially as so many people appear to have read it.  Wright Writes was not going to be diverted!  The men who made our railways work often live in the shadows.  How interesting to have these links with Gerry Fiennes and RHN (Dick) Hardy.  I shall have to delve into my book collection to see if Charles Kirton features.

[MJI]

3 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

I invariably use laminated plastic plus a small washer for one bogie; plus laminated plastic pads bearing on the bogie's bolster on the line of the wheels, for the other bogie.

 

This gives a three point arrangement, preventing the body from wobbling.

 

CJI.

Great not too different to me then

[MJI]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Quite an exciting day!

 

I had a ride over to Ian Wilson's in this..................

 

 

It's a McLaren something or other with 740 HP! 

 

My car is the same colour.

 

 

Getting in and out was fun. 

 

Fortunately, I'd worn by armoured trousers to counter the acceleration. 

 

A mate came over in it, bringing this with him............

 

 

Hornby's latest original W1 (as far as I know, I should have one to review in BRM). 

 

What an astonishing RTR model. 

 

I'd have liked to have given this a full run on LB, but those footsteps are way out of gauge and clouted the platform edges. 

 

However, this ran very well.

 

 

Seen yesterday, but what a difference the correct numberplate makes to the 'face' of this A3. Ian Wilson's numberplates are the perfect type. 

 

Thanks for a fun day, Ollie.

 

 

 

We need the story behind your McLaren trip

[grob1234]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Quite an exciting day!

 

I had a ride over to Ian Wilson's in this..................

 

 

It's a McLaren something or other with 740 HP! 

 

My car is the same colour.

 

 

Getting in and out was fun. 

 

Fortunately, I'd worn by armoured trousers to counter the acceleration. 

 

A mate came over in it, bringing this with him............

 

 

Hornby's latest original W1 (as far as I know, I should have one to review in BRM). 

 

What an astonishing RTR model. 

 

I'd have liked to have given this a full run on LB, but those footsteps are way out of gauge and clouted the platform edges. 

 

However, this ran very well.

 

 

Seen yesterday, but what a difference the correct numberplate makes to the 'face' of this A3. Ian Wilson's numberplates are the perfect type. 

 

Thanks for a fun day, Ollie.

 

 

 

I'm sure you never went over 50 in the McLaren.... 

[Tony Wright]

6 minutes ago, MJI said:

 

We need the story behind your McLaren trip

Corby Glen is about six miles away.

 

We got there very fast, and returned just as quickly. The lanes don't really allow too much breaking of the speed limit, though we reached that limit in moments. 

 

I've not been in a car which accelerates so fast since the last time I rode in, err, another McLaren!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[polybear]

3 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

 

 

Hornby's latest original W1 (as far as I know, I should have one to review in BRM). 

 

What an astonishing RTR model. 

 

 

Sadly so many of them have been arriving damaged - many at the dealers and even more when sent thru' the post (there's a Hornby "Hush Hush" thread which makes for sad reading); the smoke deflectors are the favourite area for damage (breaking off), as well as the Tender and drawbar areas.  I was one of the fortunate ones who somehow managed to receive an undamaged example thru' the post - and yes, it is a beautiful loco.  The steps and the strange pony truck arrangement (flangeless wheels that aren't in contact with the rails) are not Hornby's finest hour though, along with the packaging.

[Jesse Sim]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Corby Glen is about six miles away.

 

We got there very fast, and returned just as quickly. The lanes don't really allow too much breaking of the speed limit, though we reached that limit in moments. 

 

I've not been in a car which accelerates so fast since the last time I rode in, err, another McLaren!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Next time your over you can borrow some leathers and a hop on the back of the bike with me 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Jesse Sim

[Bucoops]

On 18/12/2021 at 18:25, Kier Hardy said:

I hope this is of interest to some of you..... it certainly was to me. I might just have to get myself a model of Ladas and convert it to EM gauge, even if it is out of my usual era of interest.

 

Seasons greetings to one and all. Best wishes, Kier

 

 

Thank you @Adam88 for quoting Kier Hardy's post - somehow I had missed it.

 

What a lovely find - clearly a man proud of a job done well. I enjoyed reading all the articles and letters.

[Ollie K]

4 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Quite an exciting day!

 

I had a ride over to Ian Wilson's in this..................

 

 

It's a McLaren something or other with 740 HP! 

 

My car is the same colour.

 

 

Getting in and out was fun. 

 

Fortunately, I'd worn by armoured trousers to counter the acceleration. 

 

A mate came over in it, bringing this with him............

 

 

Hornby's latest original W1 (as far as I know, I should have one to review in BRM). 

 

What an astonishing RTR model. 

 

I'd have liked to have given this a full run on LB, but those footsteps are way out of gauge and clouted the platform edges. 

 

However, this ran very well.

 

 

Seen yesterday, but what a difference the correct numberplate makes to the 'face' of this A3. Ian Wilson's numberplates are the perfect type. 

 

Thanks for a fun day, Ollie.

 

 

 My pleasure.

 

For the curious, my job involves borrowing cars from manufacturers. Sometimes the cars are sensible, sometimes they are interesting, and sometimes they have about seven hundred more horsepower than is strictly deployable in the December Lincolnshire countryside. 

But these cars need to be shared, and props to Tony for being a very good passenger.

 

The debate over the W1 will surely continue. A hugely imposing model of a fascinating prototype - one which I considered a must-have as a strictly LNER fanatic - but the cop-out trailing truck seems inferior to the kit-built offerings which can apparently negotiate second radius curves, and odd that such out of gauge steps are pre-fitted when many previous Hornby Pacifics included them in the detail bag, only to be fitted on appropriate layouts (like the drain cocks). 
 

Thanks to Tony and Mo (and Ian) for a very enjoyable day. 

[polybear]

7 hours ago, OliverBytham said:

........and props to Tony for being a very good passenger.

 

 

So Tony didn't chuck up all over the leather interior then? 

[Michael Edge]

7 hours ago, OliverBytham said:

 

 

The debate over the W1 will surely continue. A hugely imposing model of a fascinating prototype - one which I considered a must-have as a strictly LNER fanatic - but the cop-out trailing truck seems inferior to the kit-built offerings which can apparently negotiate second radius curves, and odd that such out of gauge steps are pre-fitted when many previous Hornby Pacifics included them in the detail bag, only to be fitted on appropriate layouts (like the drain cocks). 

 

Having built a few models of 10000 over the years I'm not surprised that Hornby's steps are out of gauge, it's extremely difficult to fit them at the correct width and still get the motion to run safely behind them. The "trailing truck" isn't easy either being made up of a standard Cartazzi axlebox arrangement (which Hornby can't do anyway) and a separate Bissell (pony) truck following it. The last one of these I built in O gauge had two overlapping internal pony trucks here to give the correct pivot radius.

[Tony Wright]

It seems universally acknowledged now that the Hornby W1's steps are way out of gauge. Having mentioned it on the appropriate thread, all correspondents have reported the same.

 

I'll put the same pictures on here.

 

 

The only original W1 I've run on LB previously was this SEF kit-built one (builder unknown). Since it has no steps, clearance issues didn't arise.

 

 

This is a South Eastern Finecast W1 running on The Gresley Beat, complete with steps. 

 

The 'Beat has no platforms, but these steps don't seem to be too far out.

 

 

[Dylan Sanderson]

9 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

It seems universally acknowledged now that the Hornby W1's steps are way out of gauge. Having mentioned it on the appropriate thread, all correspondents have reported the same.

 

I'll put the same pictures on here.

 

 

The only original W1 I've run on LB previously was this SEF kit-built one (builder unknown). Since it has no steps, clearance issues didn't arise.

 

 

This is a South Eastern Finecast W1 running on The Gresley Beat, complete with steps. 

 

The 'Beat has no platforms, but these steps don't seem to be too far out.

 

 

Are the steps ‘correctly’ out of gauge? My Hush Hush was relegated to running around my friends fiddleyard loop, clear of any platforms or other inconsiderate lineside details!

 

Safe to say, Hush-Hush will be my gauging loco when I get started on Deerness…