RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Thanks very much for all your posts. I've now had chance to go through my copies of Stan Roberts exhaustive collection of photos, which I was very kindly given permission to use by the copyright holders, Peak Rail Association. Here's a few shots of the signals etc. First, an enlarged crop of the view from the end of the down platform: You can see that the Up home is visible, but the Down starter is out of view. This next shot is from the sidings by the cattle dock: If you click on the photo to enlarge it, you can just see the arm of the Down Starter, in the centre of the photo, which makes it clear that a driver on the down line would have to advance past the signal box, and nearly past the goods shed before it was visible. This is the Up Home: And here's the original Midland lower Quadrant combined Down Home and Up Starter, which remained in place until it was replaced by Upper Quadrant signals in 1966. And here's an interior shot of the signalbox. You can see, with reference to Shaun's earlier diagram, that 8, 9, and 10 (which are the Up Distant, Home and Starter) are pulled off, as are 13, 14 and 15, which are the Down Starter, Home and Distant, in order. So the box seems to be expecting a train in both directions. You can also see clearly that 11 and 12 are detonators, as AndyG said, marked with black and white chevrons denoting up and down lines. Incidently, Beast66606, I don't know if Iv'e asked this before, but do you know when the up distant (and Hassops starter) became a coloured signal? It doesn't really affect me, as it is well off scene for the layout, I'm just curious. I've got a bit more scenery to finish off (if I get any time this weekend) but then I'll make a start on the first MSE signal, for the Up Home. Thanks for looking, Al. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 If you click on the photo to enlarge it, you can just see the arm of the Down Starter, in the centre of the photo, which makes it clear that a driver on the down line would have to advance past the signal box, and nearly past the goods shed before it was visible. There is a suspicion of a post sticking out from the top of the arm, but it's not clear enough to be 100% And here's the original Midland lower Quadrant combined Down Home and Up Starter, which remained in place until it was replaced by Upper Quadrant signals in 1966. Just the arms were replaced by upper quadrants and the finial removed (!) rather than a new signal being provided - the finial may have gone post closure, possibly even to Stan ! (I was in the Merseyside MRS when Stan was there with Bakewell) I'm not sure when Hassop got the colour light - we have discussed it a few years back but the outcome was inconclusive. I'm sure I've seen a photo of it somewhere and if my memory is not playing tricks I would say it was an early 1950s signal - however I'm happy to change that view. The box may well be switched out in the photo, in 1952 (which was the opening hours of boxes which came to hand quickest) it was open Monday to Saturday 06:20 to 20:50 For info - Hassop was open continuously at this time (and was 1542 yards away) - Haddon on the other side was open 06:00 Monday - 05:50 Sunday (and was 1m 854 yards away) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 (edited) Chinley North Jn Up distant signals were replaced by colour lights sometime between June 1950 and June 1952. Maybe changes at Hassop fit into this same time frame? Edited April 17, 2015 by Peter Kazmierczak 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted April 17, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 17, 2015 Also was wondering about the color of the yellow discs as to whether or not they were yellow on black? Just as I suspected! Have never seen these modeled before. Al. Will you be attempting to model working signals? Regards Shaun. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Thanks Beast, Peter, some great info there. Hi Shaun, yes I will definitely give it a go. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgeT Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Evening Al, Signalling is another nightmare to get right, good fun tho, watching with interest, good luck... George 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 The box may well be switched out in the photo, in 1952 (which was the opening hours of boxes which came to hand quickest) it was open Monday to Saturday 06:20 to 20:50 For info - Hassop was open continuously at this time (and was 1542 yards away) - Haddon on the other side was open 06:00 Monday - 05:50 Sunday (and was 1m 854 yards away) Thanks Beast, so for the times when Bakewell and Haddon were shut, it would be one big block between Rowsley and Hassop, would it? How did they do that, would each box have an extra set of block equipment to talk direct, or was it electrically switched so that the existing block instruments and call up bell at Rowsley connected to Hassop instead of Haddon? Where was the next box going north after Hassop - Millers Dale or before that? Al. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Evening Al, Signalling is another nightmare to get right, good fun tho, watching with interest, good luck... George Hi George, yes, I'm digging deeper holes for myself I do find it fascinating though, especially since I know very little about it at the moment. Al PS I love that video you found of Peak Forest on Marcus' thread, Ive just watched all hour and a half of it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Thanks Beast, so for the times when Bakewell and Haddon were shut, it would be one big block between Rowsley and Hassop, would it? How did they do that, would each box have an extra set of block equipment to talk direct, or was it electrically switched so that the existing block instruments and call up bell at Rowsley connected to Hassop instead of Haddon? Where was the next box going north after Hassop - Millers Dale or before that? Al. Yes and switches - I have opening hours for several years, what year are you modelling again ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Block sections in 1960 Rowsley South Rowsley North Haddon Bakewell Hassop Monsall Dale Millers Dale - Lime Co's Sidings Station Junction Peak Forest Junction hth 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Yes and switches - I have opening hours for several years, what year are you modelling again ? To be honest, I wasn't going to tie it down to a specific year, as I want the flexibility to have some earlier BR steam stock as well as some early diesel, so between '56 and '62 or thereabouts. But I have the WTT from Summer '58 which I was going to try and run to at some point, so say then. Al 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgeT Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Hello Al, Yes its a cracking insight into what the peak forest was all about, the sound of those 37s and 31s blew me away.. George 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Block sections in 1960 Rowsley South Rowsley North Haddon Bakewell Hassop Monsall Dale Millers Dale - Lime Co's Sidings Station Junction Peak Forest Junction hth That's great, thanks very much. Al. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 Hello Al, Yes its a cracking insight into what the peak forest was all about, the sound of those 37s and 31s blew me away.. George What's amazing is some of those same locos are still shunting those sidings today! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 When I get chance I'll copy and post some of the opening hours for you - possibly Sunday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 17, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 When I get chance I'll copy and post some of the opening hours for you - possibly Sunday. That's brilliant Dave, thank you very much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted April 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 17, 2015 The term Switched out was often used for Signal Boxes closed part of the day. The Homes and Starters would be pulled off so drivers would know they could run through. When switching back in the signalman would have to check with the boxes either side to find out if anything was in the extended section. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Jason T Posted April 18, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 18, 2015 Just as I suspected! Have never seen these modeled before. post-17302-0-46493000-1429294944_thumb.jpg Al. Will you be attempting to model working signals? Regards Shaun. Jim S-W has modelled one to very good effect (goes without saying) on his new layout, Brettle Lane: http://modellersunited.freeforums.org/brettle-lane-well-maybe-t1010-50.html 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted April 18, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 18, 2015 Just as I suspected! Have never seen these modeled before. post-17302-0-46493000-1429294944_thumb.jpg Al. Will you be attempting to model working signals? Regards Shaun. Hummm. At first glance both the dods in that photo look the same, and my first instinct is that we are looking at the rear of the signals, and the horizontal bar is the back blinder of the signal. But that possibly be true as those signals are facing away from each other. The one on the right (20) should be the rear of the signal and the back blinder. I'm fairly certain that this is true. The one on the left (19) looks identicle to me. How can that be? Compare with this ground signal (which shows front and rear of a BR(M) dod (Similar to LMS version) http://forum.signalbox.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3699 (odd arm marking on the yellow disc) Could it be a either of the two shown in this thread: http://www.modelrailforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=29196 Confused of Littleport.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted April 18, 2015 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted April 18, 2015 (edited) Hi Andy, we've seen this photo before when I was talking about bullhead / flat bottom track, but it also shows that I think you're right, we're looking at the back of the two ground signals in the previous photo. Used with permission. Does that help? Al. Edited April 18, 2015 by acg_mr 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted April 18, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 18, 2015 It does, and shows the yellow on white disc on the right. But isn't it the wrong way round according to the diagram? And also it shows 20 disc as being a normal red disc... Questions! Andy G Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 18, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 18, 2015 It does, and shows the yellow on white disc on the right. But isn't it the wrong way round according to the diagram? And also it shows 20 disc as being a normal red disc... Questions! Andy G 16 to the left, 20 to the right 17s were removed before closure so 16 has been repositioned nearer to the crossover Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 18, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 18, 2015 October 1940 ufn 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 18, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 18, 2015 September 1949 ufn 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted April 18, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 18, 2015 September 1960 ufn 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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