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Hornby P2

Dick Turpin

By Dick Turpin,
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bluebottle

bluebottle

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Latest report on http://www.a1steam.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=697&Itemid=247 suggests that those who are stating they have never seen a P2 in the flesh may, in the fullness of time, have to retract that statement!

 

Phil

 

Being of the generation born during Thompson's lamentable lustrum, I missed seeing the P2s in either semi-streamlined or "Bugatti" styling; whether or not I'll see the class's reincarnation depends on the continuing efforts of the A1 Trust and my cardiologist. I hope too that the anticipated success of the A1 Trust will enhance the chances of the Doncaster P2 Trust's projected streamlined "Cock o' the North". The original 2001, with a front end like something out of "Star Trek", is my personal favourite; however, I do like the streamlined version, the Mikado wheel arrangement giving a much more balanced appearance than that of the A4s. Bring 'em both on!

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coachmann

coachmann

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I agree the original P2 looked well proportioned with its head held high. I think this was due to the parallel top boiler more than anything. The modified version with sloping top boiler ahead of the second ring allied to the A4 front end looked like what it was, an afterthought. Speaking with my other hat on, I painted a good many 'Cock 'O the North' models in the 1980s compared with very few A4 front end types. Maybe tastes have changed since then? Friend John Constantine was the only builder I knew who could build them from a certain kit without the boiler being oval!

Edited by coachmann
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gr.king

gr.king

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I'd better be careful about the way I put this, as I don't want to cause any offence or another squabble....

 

The phrase "without the boiler being oval" is a bit of an ambiguous one to use in this context. I assume the intended meaning is in respect of any incorrect ovality, since the cross section of the whole boiler casing on the original pair of P2s, and on all P2s aft of the dome position, should be an upright "oval" or "egg shape".

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gr.king

gr.king

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Widely renowned as dodgy to build. I e-Bayed my un-built "Springside Wessex Pro-Scale" kit when Hornby announced their model. I had planned to build it using profiled "bulkheads" inserted within the boiler to compel it to assume the correct shape. No regrets about ridding myself of that task.

 

I had also acquired a built-up example from an auction, as an interrim measure. It wasn't the best example I'd ever seen, but it certainly wasn't the worst Pro-Scale P2 I'd seen either. The ovality of its boiler was effectively the wrong way up, i.e. a full smooth curve over the top and drawn down towards an egg-shaped peak at the bottom, just like many others I'd seen. I presume that was the fault that you saw with many of them too - compounded in many cases by "wonky" bottom edges to the boiler wrapper! I shifted that one via eBay too as soon as Hornby revealed its hand.

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coachmann

coachmann

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Thanks for showing the video footage.....Those Sentinels, 'Duke of Gloucester', the GWR 'Star' and of course the 'Cock 'O the North' would fill the coffers of any manufacturer. Enough to pull Hornby out of the doldrums I should think if they can get them into the shops pre-Xmas.  

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locoholic

locoholic

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The Hornby P2 has benefitted Hornby already as, in anticipation, a rake of teak Hornby Gresley corridor coaches has mysteriously appeared in my collection even though that's not the era I usually model. After all, the P2 would look silly pulling maroon BR Mark 1s. And now that I've got the teak coaches, an apple green A3 and a blue A4 would be nice...

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Ian Hargrave

Ian Hargrave

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The Hornby P2 has benefitted Hornby already as, in anticipation, a rake of teak Hornby Gresley corridor coaches has mysteriously appeared in my collection even though that's not the era I usually model. After all, the P2 would look silly pulling maroon BR Mark 1s. And now that I've got the teak coaches, an apple green A3 and a blue A4 would be nice...

.......or even the LNER 'Sandringham'...or,for really mking a statement,B1 'Antelope' in wartime black,'When the boat comes in' would,of course, be an Ivatt C1....in any livery you like... Bachmann  525 A H Peppercorn also 'cuts the mustard'

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Btourer

Btourer

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Could anyone who has seen the model up close confirm that all of the cabside and the tenderside rails are seperately fitted or not?

 

If they are, I believe that this is where Hornby's Design Clever compromise should sit. It looks fantastic and there will be no carving off of moulded handrails spoiling the beautiful finish. I still am not impressed with Duke of Gloucester compared to the Britannia and Clan though, in my opinion, too much exposed piping for the compromise to look right.

 

I also eat my words regarding my skepticism of Hornby's choice of locomotive, it looks fantastic! I'm tempted to get one just for display even though it has nothing to do with the era I model.

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SRman

SRman

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I agree an apple green P2 hauling Mk.I's would look silly.................but BR green might look very attractive............... and of course one set of driving wheels less................plus a front bogie.... :smoke: 

 

Coach, I have disagreed with you on this one because, even though the P2s were rebuilt before nationalisation, there were still a few LNER green locomotives around still in green to haul BR mark 1s in crimson and cream. In my opinion, the colour combination didn't look too incongruous at all. I can see it as a plausible might-have-been for an LNER green P2, perhaps with "British Railways" emblazoned on its tender, hauling some blood and custard Mk 1s and some teak and blood/custard Gresley/Thompson stock.

 

Now, having thrown my hat in the ring for might-have-beens, what does anyone think of a P2 in BR express locomotive blue with white/black/white lining?? That would certainly look appropriate on BR mk 1s. I can picture it in my mind's eye ...   :)

 

Although, rereading your post, perhaps you were a bit tongue-in-cheek anyway ...  :D

Edited by SRman
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Guest 2750

Guest 2750

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Could anyone who has seen the model up close confirm that all of the cabside and the tenderside rails are seperately fitted or not?

 

If they are, I believe that this is where Hornby's Design Clever compromise should sit. It looks fantastic and there will be no carving off of moulded handrails spoiling the beautiful finish. I still am not impressed with Duke of Gloucester compared to the Britannia and Clan though, in my opinion, too much exposed piping for the compromise to look right.

 

I also eat my words regarding my skepticism of Hornby's choice of locomotive, it looks fantastic! I'm tempted to get one just for display even though it has nothing to do with the era I model.

 

Hello Colin.

I got the chance to see it up close yesterday, and the answer is yes they are moulded on the cab and tender. Unlike previous mouldings it was better than I though and isn't just a piece of raised moulding. It sort of is cut in around the back so you almost expect to see daylight around the back.

 

I discussed this with Graeme King (Gr King) and we both felt they were possibly more to scale than separate fittings and I'm not sure I'm going to bother replacing.

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davidw

davidw

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Hello Colin.

I got the chance to see it up close yesterday, and the answer is yes they are moulded on the cab and tender. Unlike previous mouldings it was better than I though and isn't just a piece of raised moulding. It sort of is cut in around the back so you almost expect to see daylight around the back.

 

I discussed this with Graeme King (Gr King) and we both felt they were possibly more to scale than separate fittings and I'm not sure I'm going to bother replacing.

 

Very interesting Tom. I can't help feeling that this is a step back.

 

I thought Simon K had stated that moulded handrails were not going to happen as part of design clever. Shame that such a compromise has occurred,  as the loco over all does look very good.  Perhaps I should wait to see one of the production models may produce a different reaction.

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Btourer

Btourer

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Hello Colin.

I got the chance to see it up close yesterday, and the answer is yes they are moulded on the cab and tender. Unlike previous mouldings it was better than I though and isn't just a piece of raised moulding. It sort of is cut in around the back so you almost expect to see daylight around the back.

 

I discussed this with Graeme King (Gr King) and we both felt they were possibly more to scale than separate fittings and I'm not sure I'm going to bother replacing.

Thank you Tom for the information. I am dissappointed that Hornby have made that decision. In the past few years Hornby have made some very fine handrail knobs, like the ones on the B1. They are close enough to scale for me and are more prototypically correct - the handrails on the prototype are not moulded on.

 

I agree with DavidW that this is a retrograde step however you look at it, and I can't help but feel that the market that will be looking for the premium model - scale modellers and collectors - have been compromised in order to save money on tooling costs so that they can mould the railroad version from the same moulds.

 

Following on from my point above, if the main difference between the premium and railroad versions is going to be the paint job and lining, but if you want to fit your own handrails you will have to get the exacto out and then repaint and re line what you spent some of the extra money on, then why would you buy the premium model over the railroad one which costs less?

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