Bungus the Fogeyman Posted June 27, 2018 Share Posted June 27, 2018 Weren't double headed 04s used on traffic to Silksworth Colliery near Sunderland back in the day? Disgusting of Market Harborough Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted June 27, 2018 Share Posted June 27, 2018 Weren't double headed 04s used on traffic to Silksworth Colliery near Sunderland back in the day? Disgusting of Market Harborough No, multi fitted 03's were used on the Silksworth Branch. D2052+D2053 & D2071+D2074 being so fitted. They seemed to keep that pairing until the end of traffic on the branch. Paul J. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 No, multi fitted 03's were used on the Silksworth Branch. D2052+D2053 & D2071+D2074 being so fitted. They seemed to keep that pairing until the end of traffic on the branch. D2230 and D2232 "double headed" on the branch in late 1967. I say double headed as on the photographs I have showing this pairing, the in between cab area cannot be seen so can't say if jumpers were fitted. P Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) I have in my possession a couple of BR drawings (schematics) from the York drawing office dated 1966/67; relating to the fitting of multiple working apparatus to Cl.03 and Cl.04 locos. .The system was apparently air operated / pneumatic and involved some twelve jumper cables/hoses connecting the locos which would be coupled cab to cab ..This appears to be a similar arrangement to that used on some of the 'cut down' BPGV locos ..The drawings list the locos to which they refer, and is specific in their pairings, namely:-Cl.03 2052 & 2053, 2071 & 2074.Cl.04 2204 & 2248, 2230 & 2232, 2242 & 2244, 2260 & 2261, 2263 & 2264, 2265 & 2340, 2271 & 2272, . A Silksworth Branch train ( unfortunately with 03s in tandem ) is shown here;- https://goo.gl/images/tB1WYm Brian R Edited June 28, 2018 by br2975 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 28, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 28, 2018 Unusual to see 2204 in there as I believe that was from the earlier batch ,didn't they have smaller wheels? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) Unusual to see 2204 in there as I believe that was from the earlier batch ,didn't they have smaller wheels? Possibly D2240 ???? But then again maybe not. https://flic.kr/p/6Mk9F7 and then then perhaps the plot thickens with an undated view of 2204 with 2271 P Edited June 28, 2018 by Porcy Mane 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 D2230 and D2232 "double headed" on the branch in late 1967. I say double headed as on the photographs I have showing this pairing, the in between cab area cannot be seen so can't say if jumpers were fitted. P I stand corrected. I should have realised they could have got up there, as Gateshead had multi fitted D2230+D2232 on its books. Paul J. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) Unusual to see 2204 in there as I believe that was from the earlier batch ,didn't they have smaller wheels? Possibly D2240 ???? But then again maybe not. https://flic.kr/p/6Mk9F7 P I have a photo in my collection showing D2204 paired cab to cab with D2271, the usual multi working set up, at Bradford Hammerton Street in the late 60's, so it probably was, although how successful such a pairing would be with the different wheel sizes would be interesting to know? Paul J. Edited. Porcy Main now has the same photo in his post above. Edited June 28, 2018 by Swindon 123 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 The system was apparently air operated / pneumatic and involved some twelve jumper cables/hoses connecting the locos which would be coupled cab to cab There is a phot (I think on this forum) of the intercab plumbing. A quick google hasn't unearthed it. P Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 I have in my possession a couple of BR drawings (schematics) from the York drawing office dated 1966/67; relating to the fitting of multiple working apparatus to Cl.03 and Cl.04 locos. . The system was apparently air operated / pneumatic and involved some twelve jumper cables/hoses connecting the locos which would be coupled cab to cab .. This appears to be a similar arrangement to that used on some of the 'cut down' BPGV locos .. The drawings list the locos to which they refer, and is specific in their pairings, namely:- Cl.03 2052 & 2053, 2071 & 2074. Cl.04 2204 & 2248, 2230 & 2232, 2242 & 2244, 2260 & 2261, 2263 & 2264, 2265 & 2340, 2271 & 2272, . A Silksworth Branch train ( unfortunately with 03s in tandem ) is shown here;- https://goo.gl/images/tB1WYm Brian R The BP& GV locos had a slight difference as far as I can tell. The drawings you have, and sent me, show there being an electrical connection as well as the air lines, which used to indicate low oil pressure on the trailing loco, by utilising the 2nd low oil pressure light on the leading loco. I have not been able to trace such a mod on 03145, although it might have been removed in later overhauls. Air pipes connected the locos and operated the throttle, 5 gears, forward/reverse, DSD, forward and reverse sanders, main air. The main alteration compared to unmod 03's was that the throttle had to be converted from cable control to air control. We still have the multi-working gear fitted on 03145, and are waiting for the oportunity to multi it up with another of its kind, or even an 04, D2272 still exists, one day. Below is a photo showing under the desk of 03145, with all the extra air pipework, it is the unpainted plastic pipe weaving its way around the other pipework, required for the multi working. Paul J. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 There is a phot (I think on this forum) of the intercab plumbing. A quick google hasn't unearthed it. P I have one distant shot of it on my Flickr site, but here's the original in the flesh. Paul J. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 I have one distant shot of it on my Flickr site, but here's the original in the flesh. 03144-03151, JC slide..jpg Paul J. S'not the phot I was thinking about. That was a close up just showing the pipework but your pic is just as enlightening. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Unusual to see 2204 in there as I believe that was from the earlier batch ,didn't they have smaller wheels? I'll check the drawings later. . Brian R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted June 28, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 28, 2018 (edited) There is a phot (I think on this forum) of the intercab plumbing. A quick google hasn't unearthed it. P thread, with photos, here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/70818-multiple-working-fitted-cl03-cl04/ one links to Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/40011/6127593898 Edited June 28, 2018 by keefer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Unusual to see 2204 in there as I believe that was from the earlier batch ,didn't they have smaller wheels? Well, I agree D2204 would be an odd choice, compared to the rest of the conversions. . So, I've dug out the relevant BR drawings, and this is the result:- . Brian R 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 There are a couple of nice photos of D2052+D2053, mutied up in Blue livery in the sidings at Slksworth, and a side shot on Sunderland shed in the newish, "First Generation Eastern & North Eastern Region Diesels in colour" by Book Law. They are most probably the two in the photo in the link in br2975's post 29. (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/66882-class-04-shunters-in-action-br-blue/?p=3214261). There is also a colour photo in the same book a few pages later, of D2205 in Green with wasp stripes & yellow buffer beam, but with BR Double arrow logos on the cabside, at Newburn Jcn, September 1967, proving you have to be careful sometimes when looking at B&W photos. Paul J. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted June 28, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 28, 2018 Maybe, just maybe, D2204 was misindentified somewhere along the way to it's conversion in a similar fashion to the skinhead Brush 2 that ETH fitted in error? Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Tim Hall Posted June 28, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 28, 2018 Blurred photo of 03120/ 141/ 151? Taken from moving train at Llanelli, 7th Jan 84 clearly showing some gubbins.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 28, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 28, 2018 The BP& GV locos had a slight difference as far as I can tell. The drawings you have, and sent me, show there being an electrical connection as well as the air lines, which used to indicate low oil pressure on the trailing loco, by utilising the 2nd low oil pressure light on the leading loco. I have not been able to trace such a mod on 03145, although it might have been removed in later overhauls. Air pipes connected the locos and operated the throttle, 5 gears, forward/reverse, DSD, forward and reverse sanders, main air. The main alteration compared to unmod 03's was that the throttle had to be converted from cable control to air control. We still have the multi-working gear fitted on 03145, and are waiting for the oportunity to multi it up with another of its kind, or even an 04, D2272 still exists, one day. Below is a photo showing under the desk of 03145, with all the extra air pipework, it is the unpainted plastic pipe weaving its way around the other pipework, required for the multi working. 4- cab repaint finished. 2..jpg Paul J. Bloody pipes everywhere! Is that still air throttle Paul? I would imagine the throttle lever is lighter in operation than with a cable. A mate of mine owned 2063 and that had a very heavy throttle. He also had 2280 an 04 that was better as it had a linkage rather than a cable Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted June 28, 2018 Share Posted June 28, 2018 Bloody pipes everywhere! Is that still air throttle Paul? I would imagine the throttle lever is lighter in operation than with a cable. A mate of mine owned 2063 and that had a very heavy throttle. He also had 2280 an 04 that was better as it had a linkage rather than a cable Yes russ p, still has its air throttle, in fact all its multi working pipework is in place, except for a couple of plastic pipes that were split and we removed/blanked off. Can be a bit of a pain when you want to build up air quickly, as you need air to build the air up! Otherwise it is very light and responsive on the throttle. You can fine adjust it a little as there is an adjuster screw on the base of the air valve attached to the throttle, with which you can adjust the idle speed of the engine. I own D2302, but that has a cable throttle, which is a bit of a , but it needs to be looked at, and probably replaced with a new one. One more job for its upcoming overhaul! Paul J. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 28, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 28, 2018 Those W&M railbuses also have an air throttle and they can be slow to get air built up Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bungus the Fogeyman Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Looks like I've started something with the Silksworth thread. ...i believe from my research into the Wisbech and Upwell twins that the first 10 (2201-2210?) had smaller wheels.... Disgusting of Market Harborough Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jessy1692 Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 (edited) Blurred photo of 03120/ 141/ 151? Taken from moving train at Llanelli, 7th Jan 84 clearly showing some gubbins.... 1984 Jan 7th-14th (2).jpg Iv modelled a couple of York 04s with the pipes made of fishing wire bt havnt seen a clear pic of the back connections ever. Looks to me like the pipes are hung over the handrails and theres some connector box?? This looks to be the best iv seen. Both on sidelined at mo with rubbish split chassis. Edited July 1, 2018 by jessy1692 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swindon 123 Posted July 1, 2018 Share Posted July 1, 2018 Looks like I've started something with the Silksworth thread. ...i believe from my research into the Wisbech and Upwell twins that the first 10 (2201-2210?) had smaller wheels.... Disgusting of Market Harborough The listed different wheel dia's, from my varoius BR driver books. D2200-D2214, had 3'3" wheels. D2215-D2273, 3'6" wheels. D2274-D2340, 3'7" wheels. D2341 isn't listed, but i believe they were 3'6'', but this needs confirming. Paul J. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted July 1, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 1, 2018 I didn't realise there were three sizes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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