A Nod To Brent - a friendly thread, filled with frivolity, cream teas and pasties. Longing for the happy days in the South Hams 1947.

[Oldddudders]

21 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

BTW if lot lot of 6 coaches at Trains Galore went for £240 hammer price plus the usual add on (20% the last time I bought there but that's a while back, so making £288 that wasn't bad price if they really were Larry Goddard jobs.  But were they by Larry?

My LG coaches all have his signature and a date on the underside. 

 

One of mine is a Maunsell TK with a fleet number that didn't exist. I wonder why?

[Captain Kernow]

1 hour ago, John Besley said:

Happy new year to all in Sarf Debon

 

Tiz loverly ma beauty 

Raining in Brent, though!

 

[The Stationmaster]

7 hours ago, Oldddudders said:

My LG coaches all have his signature and a date on the underside. 

 

One of mine is a Maunsell TK with a fleet number that didn't exist. I wonder why?

As I understand it from what Larry himself has said - and judging by what you say plus the one I own - Larry always signed and daited his work.

[gwrrob]

Interesting and food for thought that the highest polling GWR item was the Collett 0-4-2T 48xx/14xx tank. Higher than the Saint, County and Toplight coaches. It's not long since the Hatton's/DJM model was released to a mixed reception. Here's my 4870 doing the honours.

 

 

 

 

 

[Limpley Stoker]

If Hattons commission a new chassis for the DJM body it would be an open goal.……with an ash pan

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 2, 2023 by Limpley Stoker

[Captain Kernow]

24 minutes ago, gwrrob said:

Interesting and food for thought that the highest polling GWR item was the Collett 0-4-2T 48xx/14xx tank. Higher than the Saint, County and Toplight coaches. It's not long since the Hatton's/DJM model was released to a mixed reception.

I'm not at all surprised. It's one of the most appealing GWR and BR(W) prototypes and the polling result is an indictment of the appalling mechanism design foisted on the modelling world by DJ Models.

 

I'm sure a lot of people would be happy with the existing (superb) body and a new mechanism.

 

 

[gwrrob]

8 minutes ago, Captain Kernow said:

I'm not at all surprised. It's one of the most appealing GWR and BR(W) prototypes

 

Would you rather have one decent [14xx]than say a brand new pannier then @Captain Kernow😉 It wouldn't qualify for entry into the Captain's First Class Pannier Lounge.

Edited January 2, 2023 by gwrrob
detail.

[BWsTrains]

9 minutes ago, Captain Kernow said:

I'm sure a lot of people would be happy with the existing (superb) body and a new mechanism.

 

Funny,

 

I keep telling my Doctor just that!

 

 

[The Stationmaster]

51 minutes ago, Limpley Stoker said:

If Hattons commission a new chassis for the DJM body it would be an open goal.……with an ash pan

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It is beginning to turn into quite a while since I last suggested exactly that to Hattons.  Along with an alternative proposal also that if nothing else they could investigate the idea of issuing the body mouldings/parts as a kit in order to keep down manufacturing costs.  I understand (from elsewhere) that there seems to be no doubt that they own the tooling and that point is supported by the fact that the 14XX has not appeared under the EFE label along with tooling previously claimed to have been owned by DJM.

[MrWolf]

4 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

It is beginning to turn into quite a while since I last suggested exactly that to Hattons.  Along with an alternative proposal also that if nothing else they could investigate the idea of issuing the body mouldings/parts as a kit in order to keep down manufacturing costs.  I understand (from elsewhere) that there seems to be no doubt that they own the tooling and that point is supported by the fact that the 14XX has not appeared under the EFE label along with tooling previously claimed to have been owned by DJM.

 

Interesting, especially as there have been proven replacement chassis around since the first batch of Airfix 1466s' wore out back in the 80s.

[NHY 581]

There was, ash pan aside, nothing fundamentally wrong with the 14xx( et al) body but that chassis simply was not fit for purpose. 

A classic example of someone trying to be too clever for their own good. 

 

I think a new chassis and these would sell very well indeed. There might well however be some work required on the body moulding as a revision on the internal weight ( which held the motor, separate to the chassis itself ?) would be required. 

 

 

So, perhaps better to rip it up and start again rather than trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. ( other ears are available )

 

Rob. 

[MrWolf]

I've not had the opportunity to inspect one of those chassis, but your mention of the combined weight and motor mount sounds too much like the old Airfix job, with the dodgy gearing buried deep inside.

[The Stationmaster]

11 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

There was, ash pan aside, nothing fundamentally wrong with the 14xx( et al) body but that chassis simply was not fit for purpose. 

A classic example of someone trying to be too clever for their own good. 

 

I think a new chassis and these would sell very well indeed. There might well however be some work required on the body moulding as a revision on the internal weight ( which held the motor, separate to the chassis itself ?) would be required. 

 

 

So, perhaps better to rip it up and start again rather than trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. ( other ears are available )

 

Rob. 

I think you're probably right Rob and it might well be why nothing has happened as Hattons have a couple of pretty clever chaps on their payroll and I'd be surprised of they haven't had a careful look at it.  But the basic body mouldings would probably still be ok?

[NHY 581]

1 minute ago, The Stationmaster said:

I think you're probably right Rob and it might well be why nothing has happened as Hattons have a couple of pretty clever chaps on their payroll and I'd be surprised of they haven't had a careful look at it.  But the basic body mouldings would probably still be ok?

 

Hi Mike. Well, I'm far from an expert on GWR locos but yes, the body itself seems pretty good and any improvement would be only in some very minor aspects of the detail.......if at all. 

I only have one example and it runs okayish...but it could be so very much better. 

 

Rob

 

 

[MrWolf]

It was a loco that I fancied buying new when they came out, but I heard too many stories of people having three or more before they got a good one.

 

Or even one that runs okayish! 

 

[BMacdermott]

Hello Mr Wolf and everyone

 

Not sure if the following may have a bearing (and I am not an 'electrical person')...

 

I use what were Kent Panel Controls handheld controllers - now sold under their own name by All Components.

 

I always have the feedback switched to minimum by the man who runs their repair service.

 

On one occasion, a controller came back from repair with the feedback inadvertently left 'full on'. My 14xx jumped all over the place! Changed over to the minimum feedback controllers...problem gone!

 

Brian

[NHY 581]

36 minutes ago, BMacdermott said:

Hello Mr Wolf and everyone

 

Not sure if the following may have a bearing (and I am not an 'electrical person')...

 

I use what were Kent Panel Controls handheld controllers - now sold under their own name by All Components.

 

I always have the feedback switched to minimum by the man who runs their repair service.

 

On one occasion, a controller came back from repair with the feedback inadvertently left 'full on'. My 14xx jumped all over the place! Changed over to the minimum feedback controllers...problem gone!

 

Brian

 

 

Hi Brian. 

 

The controller would have made no difference to what was a poorly executed, ill conceived, dogs dinner of a mechanism which was simply incapable of doing what it was seemingly designed to do. 

 

What is  remarkable is that Hattons went ahead and sold these to the paying public despite the issues with the chassis.  I recall speaking to Hattons ahead of returning my third example to be told that the fault lay with my layout and they had few if any returns. This was a good year after their release and it really was a lottery as to the quality of the loco you received. 

 

The fact that there have been no further batches of these quintessential GWR locos from Hattons seems to add weight to the theory that they were fundamentally flawed. 

 

Properly done, they would have been selling for years. 

 

Rob. 

Edited January 2, 2023 by NHY 581

[BMacdermott]

6 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

The controller would have made no difference to what was a poorly executed, ill conceived, dogs dinner of a mechanism which was simply incapable of doing what it was seemingly designed to do. 

 

Hello Rob

 

Well...I can fully assure you it did. All my other locos were fine because I tested everything thinking I had a serious layout fault. The 14xx was the only 'problem' loco.

 

I can't re-test as the controller has been repaired.

 

Brian

[Ian Hargrave]

Hattons have hit the sweet spot with their Genesis range,with more to come over the next couple of years,so maybe they have sufficient on their order books….and drain on capital outlay….to be interested in another run of the 14XX .

How many owners of the DJM world be prepared to revisit the model….apart from Cosa Nostra on RMWEB,ANTB etc….having bought first time around and like me and Robin maybe prepared to put up with its eccentricities ? I think we should seriously ask ourselves if there is still a market for it in the wider sense tbh.and perhaps that’s what’s holding Hattons back.

And talking of the Genesis range of “antiques” ,a better avenue of future development maybe to encourage them in the direction of a Metro Tank ? Only a thought…..

[Andy Keane]

12 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Hattons have hit the sweet spot with their Genesis range,with more to come over the next couple of years,so maybe they have sufficient on their order books….and drain on capital outlay….to be interested in another run of the 14XX .

How many owners of the DJM world be prepared to revisit the model….apart from Cosa Nostra on RMWEB,ANTB etc….having bought first time around and like me and Robin maybe prepared to put up with its eccentricities ? I think we should seriously ask ourselves if there is still a market for it in the wider sense tbh.and perhaps that’s what’s holding Hattons back.

And talking of the Genesis range of “antiques” ,a better avenue of future development maybe to encourage them in the direction of a Metro Tank ? Only a thought…..

Ian I have to agree. I have a Hattons 14XX which runs OK for me under DCC. I need a Metro though so am starting down the kit built route based on an old Wills body kit and the newer SE Finescast chassis. I would jump at a RTR Metro if a good one came along.

Andy

[NHY 581]

1 hour ago, BMacdermott said:

 

Hello Rob

 

Well...I can fully assure you it did. All my other locos were fine because I tested everything thinking I had a serious layout fault. The 14xx was the only 'problem' loco.

 

I can't re-test as the controller has been repaired.

 

Brian

 

Hi Brian, 

 

The total of four or five locos ( I forget now ) supplied by Hattons all had differing faults. Some would be hesistant or jerky on a straight run, another ran smoothly but would speed up or slow down by itself, another would slow when encountering pointwork or simply derail ( probably b2b issues ). Really disheartening. 

 

I tried them on a layout ( gaugemaster combi ) where everything else ran well. I also tried a straight run using my trusty AGW with the same results. 

 

They were simply defective. 

 

My current 14xx runs okay, better on DCC actually. It came DCC fitted but the decoder was incompatible with the loco. Swapping for a Bachmann/zimo decoder improved the running. 

I took a chance as it was cheap and for once it seemed to pay off. 

 

Rob. 

 

 

 

[TrevorP1]

1 hour ago, Ian Hargrave said:

And talking of the Genesis range of “antiques” ,a better avenue of future development maybe to encourage them in the direction of a Metro Tank ? Only a thought…..

 

Or an elderly pannier or saddle would surely create a foam fest on here... 😀

[NHY 581]

A Metro tank or a 517 would be rather jolly but a 850 saddle tank job would be nice. 

 

Rob.

[Captain Kernow]

1 hour ago, NHY 581 said:

The total of four or five locos ( I forget now ) supplied by Hattons all had differing faults. Some would be hesistant or jerky on a straight run, another ran smoothly but would speed up or slow down by itself, another would slow when encountering pointwork or simply derail ( probably b2b issues ). Really disheartening. 

 

I tried them on a layout ( gaugemaster combi ) where everything else ran well. I also tried a straight run using my trusty AGW with the same results. 

 

They were simply defective.

An abomination, more like!

 

[gwrrob]

24 minutes ago, Captain Kernow said:

An abomination, more like!

 

 

Stop sitting on the fence Tim.