LNER Passenger Trains and Formations

[Willie Whizz]

I can only honestly say I’ve never heard of even one, let alone enough to make it a significant issue - but if you can provide examples and figures (Railway-related or otherwise) I’ll think about taking it seriously as an issue. 

[Pint of Adnams]

1 hour ago, Willie Whizz said:

I can only honestly say I’ve never heard of even one, let alone enough to make it a significant issue - but if you can provide examples and figures (Railway-related or otherwise) I’ll think about taking it seriously as an issue. 

 

[Willie Whizz]

Well, one 2013 complaint clearly then, anyway. But there is no information given on who made it and upon what grounds, and whether it was found to be justified. Unless, of course, you can enlighten us. 
 

The “suspension” seems to have been lifted after investigation pretty quickly, anyway, because further reviews were subsequently added, and indeed all the reviews the book received on Amazon.UK still showing seem to have been 4* or 5*, which suggests a broad level of public satisfaction. Like I said, not perfect, but until somebody builds that ‘better mousetrap’ and gets it on sale, it remains the best we have. 
 

Let us all therefore hope that the delay in publication of Volume 2 reflects even greater efforts on the part of the Authors (yes, there are two of them to bear the responsibility) to get things right; and that if criticism arises it is fair, based on fact, allows for the difficulty of interpreting information and pictures nearly a century old, and is not coloured by old personal animosities.  

Edited May 26, 2023 by Willie Whizz
Clarity

[Mark Hamlin]

Any sign of this yet, given we are in July now ?

[Pint of Adnams]

42 minutes ago, Mark Hamlin said:

Any sign of this yet, given we are in July now ?

I e-mailed Crecy earlier this week with the query using their contact form but have not yet had the courtesy of a reply.

[MarkC]

Just placed my order - thanks for the heads up

 

Mark

[Market65]

Oh dear. I have given Bill Hudson Books a call, and the situation is that the book has not actually been published as yet. Apparently the author has some kind of issue. More information will be coming at a future date.

 

Rob.

[Pint of Adnams]

3 hours ago, Market65 said:

Oh dear. I have given Bill Hudson Books a call, and the situation is that the book has not actually been published as yet. Apparently the author has some kind of issue. More information will be coming at a future date.

 

Rob.

Deja vu...

[Not Jeremy]

I don't know all of the "sub text" to this, and have no agenda, but offer the following in good faith:

 

I spoke to Crecy today, whilst ordering more of their books, and had a brief conversation which the very helpful and pleasant chap on the end of the phone, who seemed to me to have a good grasp of what was going on. He is the person who normally answers the telephone when I ring Crecy.

 

He said, of the above book, that it was indeed delayed, and I did not get the impression that he had or knew of any exact date for its publication. I didn't attempt to "drill down", but alluded to the time taken etc, at which point in the conversation he did say that they had received material for the book from the author and that it would be definitely going ahead.

 

I got the impression that this would be sooner rather than later, but have no way of knowing.

 

Speaking as a publisher myself, even with 100% accord, goodwill and plenty of good material, it can still take ages to get a book into print. There are a million and one things that can and do get in the way, and some books never make it.

 

So I think we should all cut the publisher and author(s) a bit of slack.

 

Simon

 

 

[Pint of Adnams]

1 hour ago, Not Jeremy said:

I don't know all of the "sub text" to this, and have no agenda, but offer the following in good faith:

 

I spoke to Crecy today, whilst ordering more of their books, and had a brief conversation which the very helpful and pleasant chap on the end of the phone, who seemed to me to have a good grasp of what was going on. He is the person who normally answers the telephone when I ring Crecy.

 

He said, of the above book, that it was indeed delayed, and I did not get the impression that he had or knew of any exact date for its publication. I didn't attempt to "drill down", but alluded to the time taken etc, at which point in the conversation he did say that they had received material for the book from the author and that it would be definitely going ahead.

 

I got the impression that this would be sooner rather than later, but have no way of knowing.

 

Speaking as a publisher myself, even with 100% accord, goodwill and plenty of good material, it can still take ages to get a book into print. There are a million and one things that can and do get in the way, and some books never make it.

 

So I think we should all cut the publisher and author(s) a bit of slack.

 

Simon

 

 

Save that it was first scheduled for publication in August 2018, withdrawn from lists by Crecy due to issues with one of the authors, I know because I had a face-to-face conversation with  the guy on the Crecy stand during Guildex that September - 5 years is a long time in prevarication.

[Willie Whizz]

The Crecy website remains unchanged as of five minutes ago, still saying publication in July. Mr Banks’ own website is as unhelpful as usual on this matter, not having been updated about it for several years(!). The gentleman from “Bill Hudson Books” mentioned earlier MAY have been quoting an old position rather than the current one, if there has been no very recent update issued by the publishers, but what Mr Banks’ “issue” might be - if indeed he has one beyond a fatal hesitancy to “publish and be damned” - remains unknown. 
 

All very frustrating; expecting that it would finally be out this month I have it on my family’s birthday present list, only to be denied yet again. So unless things get properly clarified soon I shall go back to my previous stance of “believe it when I see it”. 

[Pint of Adnams]

Bob Pearman (of Bob Pearman Books) posted on the GER Society e-Group yesterday that in a conversation with Crecy he was informed that the book is subject to further delays and unlikely to be published this year.

 

Should there now be a concerted request for the refund of payments for pre-orders placed with Crecy in good faith?

[Willie Whizz]

There should certainly be a concerted request for Crecy to update their own website and provide a better explanation!

[Pint of Adnams]

I've just returned to Bank's own website and it seems that he has had no problem adding plenty of material that most likely is - or was? - intended for volume 2, together with further descriptions of the post-war coaching stock types and he has also found time to prepare recent reviews of the books of other authors!

[Not Jeremy]

Quote

Should there now be a concerted request for the refund of payments for pre-orders placed with Crecy in good faith?

 

Hang on a cotton picking moment, before this hare runs up the A1 and gets lost in the nether regions of the Lincolnshire Wolds, has anyone actually ever done such a thing?

 

If anyone actually has, then they could very easily ask Crecy for a refund, which I am absolutely sure they would receive just as soon as they asked for it.

 

Mike, you really do seem determined to pour as much scorn and derision into this thread as you are able.

 

I know Steve Banks not, but the person upon whom all this opprobrium will end up on top of is yourself and not Steve.

 

Do you know, I think I can almost feel a "Steve Banks is Innocent" movement coming on....

 

Of course, any actual factual information on the readiness or otherwise of this much anticipated book would be very welcome.

 

Simon

[micklner]

Very simple , withdraw the book from listing until it is actually ready for print.

 

Banks says it took 12 year to write on his webpage, and now a further 5 year since it was supposed to be printed. No idea why slack has to be granted after at least another 5 years of waiting . 

 

I have his  Volume One nothing particulary wonderfully different therin, that hasnt been covered before elsewhere or on his website. He has had to add corrections to that one since as well.

 

I would ask for deposits back. I wont have to worry about that personally.

[Willie Whizz]

Unless it has changed since I last looked at it in any detail, there used to be a facility for contacting Mr Banks via his website. That’s how I got in touch regarding a point arising from Volume 1, which he duly addressed on the website, and we corresponded for a short time afterwards on a related matter, but are no longer in touch. So it works, or at least it did a few years ago. Maybe someone should try that, and get an answer from the Horse’s Mouth!

[Pint of Adnams]

On 11/07/2023 at 13:21, Willie Whizz said:

Unless it has changed since I last looked at it in any detail, there used to be a facility for contacting Mr Banks via his website. That’s how I got in touch regarding a point arising from Volume 1, which he duly addressed on the website, and we corresponded for a short time afterwards on a related matter, but are no longer in touch. So it works, or at least it did a few years ago. Maybe someone should try that, and get an answer from the Horse’s Mouth!

Well go on then...!

[RichardT]

I’ve just been to check the status of my (fully paid for) pre-publication order for this book on hive.co.uk and they have changed the publication date on the listing from 1st July to 1st October 2023.
 

Now, this change is presumably based on information supplied by Crecy, but the Crecy website still says “available July 2023”.  It’s OK to talk about getting in touch with the author about what’s going on, but it would be good if the publisher, who is actually in charge of the production process, could make a definitive statement.

 

Richard 

Edited July 14, 2023 by RichardT
Missed a word

[Willie Whizz]

5 hours ago, Pint of Adnams said:

Well go on then...!

 

"No, no - after you, Claude!"

 

Actually, for personal reasons, I'd prefer not to at the moment.  But as so many others are champing at the bit, it's something anybody could do if they were so keen.

[iak]

This saga is as long as the fade out on Hey Jude...

Just an observation mind, the book appears when it appears 

[Pint of Adnams]

The Crecy webpage has now been amended to read Autumn 2023... LNER Passenger Train Formations Vol 2 (crecy.co.uk)

Edited July 27, 2023 by Pint of Adnams
Inserted hyperlink

[RichardLong]

On 25/05/2023 at 22:33, Willie Whizz said:
 

As regards the “puff” on that website: booksellers need to sell books, so whether the actual words were penned by Banks himself we cannot know, but if he didn’t do it someone else would and in similar terms. It’s called ‘advertising’ and a degree of “puff” is not merely normal, it’s expected, and to affect to be surprised by that seems, to me, in itself suggestive of an ‘agenda’. 

 

I have no knowledge of Mr Banks or his books but, speaking as an author, I can tell you that Crecy write their own blurbs (“puff”) and don’t ask the authors to do it, or at least that was the case four years ago.  Pen & Sword, for example, do ask the author to provide the blurb but, either way, a blurb is a piece of marketing and is obviously - and quite rightly - supposed to “sell” a book in a positive light.

 

And, yes, Crecy can be slow to update their website.  It happens.

[Pint of Adnams]

4 hours ago, RichardLong said:

I have no knowledge of Mr Banks or his books but, speaking as an author, I can tell you that Crecy write their own blurbs (“puff”) and don’t ask the authors to do it, or at least that was the case four years ago.  Pen & Sword, for example, do ask the author to provide the blurb but, either way, a blurb is a piece of marketing and is obviously - and quite rightly - supposed to “sell” a book in a positive light.

 

And, yes, Crecy can be slow to update their website.  It happens.

Compare the text of:

LNER Passenger Trains & Formations 1923-67: The Principal Services: Amazon.co.uk: S Banks, C Carter: 9780860936497: Books

with

LNER Passenger Trains and Formations - The principal services - Steve Banks (steve-banks.org)

 

For those familiar with his writings, 'plethora' and, elsewhere, 'major tour-de-force' (a tautology) are classic instances of Banks expressing his superiority in the English language. Other examples are scattered throughout his contributions to the text in the first volume, which renders them distinguishable from Clive Carter's and recognisable elsewhere.

[Willie Whizz]

Circumstantial evidence, I’m afraid. Could just as easily reflect a “blurb writer” picking-up on a few choice phrases and echoing them, as Mr Banks having written it directly. 

Trying hard to think why I would care anyway …