RMweb Gold pheaton Posted January 5, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 5, 2015 TBH slipstream, your going to struggle with the Bachmann default sound esp with the factory default sound setup. ive pretty much got all of the described 37 sound setups and surprisingly the loudest is a pair of speakers in the tanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Ok managed to shrink image to < 1MB. Can I confirm the blu tack goes onto the back of the speaker housing or onto the chassis? Thanks. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 "Can I confirm the blu tack goes onto the back of the speaker housing or onto the chassis? Thanks" Your photo shows one of the later Bach 37's with a V4 Loksound ? the speaker being mounted on the roof. Earlier 37's with (V3.5's) had the speaker(poorly) mounted on the chassis, on these versions a small improvement could be made to the sound quality/volume by removing the Bach speaker mounting back plate and then using a ring of Black/Blue Tak etc fitted on the chassis recess with the wires moved to suit, and then pushing the speaker frame into it to form an air tight seal. As an alternative, you could try remove the speaker/fan fitting on the bodyshell roof, as well as any mounting spigots, and then sealing the front edges of the speaker to the body roof, using black/blue tack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Many thanks tractor. Funny as the instructions told me I had a 3.5 fitted and obviously all of the wrong CV settings. Could a bass-reflex speaker be fitted into the tanks to compliment the existing factory one? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold pheaton Posted January 6, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6, 2015 (edited) Hi Slipstream, theres nothing to stop you adding a speaker apart from space but be wary, you must wire the speakers up according to the maximum resistance you can place on the decoder see the diagram below Do not exceed 4 ohms on a V4 and 100ohms on a v3.5 doing so would lead to the pretty much instant destruction of the decoder. but also the more ohms placed on the decoder generally means a lower volume, so its a trade off between number of speakers, speaker location and speaker quality.... Personally if its volume you want than a pair of 4 ohms wired in parallel in the tanks are potentially your best bet, but if your thinking like me... "you dont go out and buy a top of the range hi-fi and make the speakers point at the floor....., but even i was impressed at the quality of sound....but for me overalll volume wins every time....the louder the better! Edited January 6, 2015 by pheaton Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Thank you very much Pheaton, you must of read my mind. That was my next question. So, I presume, as per your diagram, 2 X 8 Ohm speakers = 4 Ohms? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
legomanbiffo Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Sandy, Your speaker fit wasn't the one I had visualised so different advice applies. In this configuration the body of the loco is acting as the speaker enclosure. The success of such a configuration depends upon all of the sound radiating from the front of the cone going out through the radiator grille, and all of the sound raditing from the back of the cone staying inside the loco. Any leakage from the front of the cone into the loco body will defeat this, and Bachmann's speaker mount is inherently leaky. To fix this, remove the speaker and the plastic plate it's attached to. Apply Evo-Stik or Blu-Tac all around the plate (where it meets the roof) and refit. Block any remaining gaps you can see with more glue or Blu-Tac. The interface between roof and plate must be airtight. Then carefully apply a very thin bead of glue or very thinly rolled Blu-Tac around the speaker cone and refit to the plate. Don't apply so much that movement of the speaker cone is impeded. Again the interface between speaker and plate must be airtight. That's all there is to it. Louder, fuller sound for little or no expense. Bif Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Many thanks tractor. Funny as the instructions told me I had a 3.5 fitted and obviously all of the wrong CV settings. Could a bass-reflex speaker be fitted into the tanks to compliment the existing factory one Bachmann enclosed the earlier V3.5 instructions with some of the first Lok 4 fitted models - hence the miss-match and confusion ! etc. A Bass reflex could be fitted in the tanks, provided a Lok 4 is indeed fitted, then an ABC 8ohm large Bass reflex would give good results - but it needs some work to get it to fit properly. On it's own this will give a big increase in volume and better quality and growl !. A second 8ohm speaker could be used with it, wired in parallel if felt necessary, but NOT the original one, you could just replace the original with an 8 ohm version OR fit an 8ohm Bass Enhanced in the chassis recess once the wiring and the chassis has been slightly altered to get it to fit, the roof fan and speaker mounting assy would also have to be removed, to allow the body to fit back on. 2 X 23mm Loksound round speakers (well sealed) in the tanks also work well - volume wise - but they don't "growl" as well as a large Bass Reflex ;-) http://www.digitrains.co.uk/ecommerce/speakers/dss229-hi-bass-speaker-enclosed--wire-leads--rectangular--8ohm--1w--58x15x23mm.aspx http://www.dccsupplies.com/item-p-100790/bass-enhanced-8-ohm-speaker-20mm-x-40mm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 (edited) Hi Slipstream, theres nothing to stop you adding a speaker apart from space but be wary, you must wire the speakers up according to the maximum resistance you can place on the decoder see the diagram below Do not exceed 4 ohms on a V4 and 100ohms on a v3.5 doing so would lead to the pretty much instant destruction of the decoder. but also the more ohms placed on the decoder generally means a lower volume, so its a trade off between number of speakers, speaker location and speaker quality.... Personally if its volume you want than a pair of 4 ohms wired in parallel in the tanks are potentially your best bet, but if your thinking like me... "you dont go out and buy a top of the range hi-fi and make the speakers point at the floor....., but even i was impressed at the quality of sound....but for me overalll volume wins every time....the louder the better! Have to agree about expensive (hi-fi) speakers pointing at the floor ;-)) , but 2 x 4ohms in parallel would give a 2ohm load - don't think a Lok 4 would survive long ! they would have to be wired in series to give an 8 ohm load. 4 to 16ohms loads are permitted on the Lok 4 Edited January 6, 2015 by tractor_37260 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Understood Tractor, thanks. Thanks Lego, I will try that fix tomorrow and hopefully that may be all that is required to bring it up to a reasonable volume and sound quality. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold pheaton Posted January 6, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6, 2015 Sorry my bad Tractor is spot on...series.....but the diagram is correct on the left the amplifier would blow as the sum resistance would exceed that of the amplifier..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
charliepetty Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 On the chassis there are stacks of wires running over the recess. Is this where the blu tak goes? If you tidy up the wires, seperating them into single wires across the hole, a low profile 20X40 Chamber will fit in and make more nouce that the 23mm one. I know as I have just done it with a legomanbiffo West Highland 37 & free low profile chamber. Charlie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Thanks Charlie. Can these chambers be purchased? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Is it this one? Do I need both or just the chamber? http://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/shop/dcc_digital_loco_sounds/esu_decoder_testers_programmers_dcc_systems_high_quality_minature_speakers/new_v4_compatable_esu50334pc_20mm_x_40mm_x_9mm_4_ohm_1_2w_with_low_profile_plastic_sound_chamber_suits_most_bachmann_21pin_fitted_models_.php Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
legomanbiffo Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 That low-profile chamber is more suited to the other type of Bachmann speaker fit. You shouldn't need it here - try the glue / Blu-Tac first. Bif 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Will do Biff. Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Well I completed the task this morning as per Biff's instructions and Wow, what a bloody difference it makes. Much louder and clearer than before. Thanks for everyone's input on this thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Well I completed the task this morning as per Biff's instructions and Wow, what a bloody difference it makes. Much louder and clearer than before. Thanks for everyone's input on this thread. Good to hear you finally got a result your happy with - but for an even bigger improvement, consider getting the standard Bachmann sound reblown with Biff's latest WH 37 files - far superior in all respects. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRman Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 (edited) Not a class 37, but a belated photo to show what we mean by using Blu-Tack (or similar) to create an enclosure under a speaker. This one is a class 25 chassis belonging to P.C.M. that we use to transfer sounds onto LokSound decoders (it currently has class 47/4 sounds installed!).As you can see, I have simply piled 'sausages' of Blu-Tack around the edges to form a complete air chamber between the speaker edges and the chassis block.While this works for many of Bachmanns older sound locomotives, I wasn't aware of the latest trend to attach the speaker inside the body shell under the fan, as illustrated earlier in the thread. Still, I hope this clarifies what I, and others here, have been referring to.Note that those blobs in the corners are sealing up the screw holes in the metal surrounds. The enclosure must be air-tight for the best effect. Edited January 8, 2015 by SRman 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipstream Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 You read my mind, too, Tractor as I sent it off to Biff this afternoon. He will get it tomorrow. Can't wait. And thank you SR man. That's exactly what I did and what a difference it makes. So good actually that the sound now demands a re-blow. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ColinK Posted January 8, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 8, 2015 Not a class 37, but a belated photo to show what we mean by using Blu-Tack (or similar) to create an enclosure under a speaker. This one is a class 25 chassis belonging to P.C.M. that we use to transfer sounds onto LokSound decoders (it currently has class 47/4 sounds installed!).As you can see, I have simply piled 'sausages' of Blu-Tack around the edges to form a complete air chamber between the speaker edges and the chassis block.While this works for many of Bachmanns older sound locomotives, I wasn't aware of the latest trend to attach the speaker inside the body shell under the fan, as illustrated earlier in the thread. Still, I hope this clarifies what I, and others here, have been referring to.Note that those blobs in the corners are sealing up the screw holes in the metal surrounds. The enclosure must be air-tight for the best effect. Many thanks for posting the photo, that is a great help to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
class"66" Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I do the above but also use "electrical tape" to make surround round the outer part of the speaker... This realy throughs the sound up into the fan grill... cheers neil.. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tarifa Posted January 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 17, 2015 Why not use the tanks as the sound box and create a base reflex speaker at the same time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassey jones Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 You can use the fuel tanks as a sound chamber, it would work as long as it is a sealed unit and nothing escapes up into the motor area. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tarifa Posted January 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 17, 2015 Casssey, Providing the speaker is properly sealed to the base of the tanks the arrangement works and sounds fine. I have two 37's, one is sealed making a chamber of the tanks and the second is not, this is an experiment to test the tortured path method. It also sounds good. The photo shows styrene strips in the tank to fit the cover on, it can be glued in place or black taced to seal the cover. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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