RMweb Premium Downer Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 6, 2014 It seems that this will be with us soon. Having searched for, and failed to find, any pictures of late 50s electrification engineering trains, I'm wondering if anyone can shed some light on how they were made up. One of these BGs or more? And what else? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 It seems that this will be with us soon. Having searched for, and failed to find, any pictures of late 50s electrification engineering trains, I'm wondering if anyone can shed some light on how they were made up. One of these BGs or more? And what else? As far as I am aware,they were gone by the start of 25kv electrification.,which was,I think,the Styal line circa 1958.Trials on that were first conducted with the converted ex-WR gas turbine 18100. The BG was an ex-Midland line loco&worked mainly Toton,Hasland,Cricklewood,Saltley etc. For those of you unable to decipher this,read below.A case of mistaken BG identity. (Edit) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 The answer would appear to be a pair of such vehicles running behind E2001. I guess there were probably plenty of other test trains once the AL1s-5s started to be delivered but a pair makes a good starting point. https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6216/6427450295_a5f828992d_b.jpg https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5503/9330320722_36315ec401_b.jpg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 As far as I am aware,they were gone by the start of 25kv electrification.,which was,I think,the Styal line circa 1958.Trials on that were first conducted with the converted ex-WR gas turbine 18100. The BG was an ex-Midland line loco&worked mainly Toton,Hasland,Cricklewood,Saltley etc. Sorry....please explain to me what it is you can't understand and I'll attempt an explanation if I can. ah,thanks Karhedron I one see the light of day...meaning they were used as test weight etc.OK. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 Quite a bit of old stock appeared Sorry....please explain to me what it is you can't understand and I'll attempt an explanation if I can. I tought the topis is about an LMS BG as pictured in Kahedron's post. Your answer seems to be about a Beyer Garratt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 The answer would appear to be a pair of such vehicles running behind E2001. I guess there were probably plenty of other test trains once the AL1s-5s started to be delivered but a pair makes a good starting point. https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6216/6427450295_a5f828992d_b.jpg https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5503/9330320722_36315ec401_b.jpg There was quite a lot of stock kept at East Didsbury for driver training with E2001. The Engineers trains were usually heavily modified 1920s vehicles at that time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 Quite a bit of old stock appeared I tought the topis is about an LMS BG as pictured in Kahedron's post. Your answer seems to be about a Beyer Garratt. Thank you.I have just made the worst 'double take in history' .Sorry. Conditioned by BG which has been prominent on this forum recently and forgetting that it also has another meaning !! Apologies again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 The conversion order was for a pair of ex-LMS BG vehicles, DM 395665 and DM 395666 so only 1 digit to renumber if you want to be accurate. There were other vehicles converted for electrification around the same time and these were DM 395608, DM 395223 and DM 53552. However I have not been able to find any details of what these vehicles were or if they would have run in trains with the BGs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 Quite a lot on LMR Departmentals here http://lmsca.org.uk/lms-coaches/br-departmental-coach-list/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Downer Posted November 6, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted November 6, 2014 Sorry guys - I should have made it clear that I was using BG as the carriage code rather than as an appreviation for the Garratts. Great pics, Karhedron! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 Sorry guys - I should have made it clear that I was using BG as the carriage code rather than as an appreviation for the Garratts. Great pics, Karhedron! My fault.I should have realised it was on the Bachmann thread.Just had a hilarious vision of E 2001 hauling a pair of dead Beyer Garratts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Cocks Junction Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 From "Britain's New Railway" by O.S. Nock, make up of "work trains for erecting supports for overhead line equipment": Earth Boring Train - 8F 2-8-0, brake van, auger borer unit (on bogie well wagon), Equipment wagon (boring heads on flat truck), brake van. Concreting Train - 8F 2-8-0, brake van, cement hopper, water carrier (tank wagon), generator van, main concreting unit (bogie vehicle), 2 x sand & gravel hoppers (bogie vehicles), office & mess coach (ex LMS bogie), brake van Steelwork Train - 8F 2-8-0, brake van, 3 x steel carrying vehicles (bogie flats with 2 x match truck between), 4, 8 1/2, or 12 ton diesel electric crane with 2 match trucks, brake van. I'm afraid this doesn't throw much light on the Electrification BG however. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Some interesting footage here from the electrification to Glasgow in the mid 70s. No sign of the BGs unfortunately. The electrification train looks to be made up of very old EMU stock. I can't be sure but it might be old Merseyside EMU stock. It probably gives an idea of what would be required though. You would need a BG or 2 and probably also some flat wagons with big reels of cable on them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 6, 2014 Some interesting footage here from the electrification to Glasgow in the mid 70s. No sign of the BGs unfortunately. The electrification train looks to be made up of very old EMU stock. I can't be sure but it might be old Merseyside EMU stock. It probably gives an idea of what would be required though. You would need a BG or 2 and probably also some flat wagons with big reels of cable on them. Hi Karhedron What a wonderful film, so is part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dg8G4ncRpYQ The coaches are ex LMS period 1 vehicles, most had been heavily re-clad with steel sheeting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted November 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2014 Great pics, Karhedron! Agreed, couple of amazing pics, if i remember right from an old discussion those pics are on the the old GC line between ashendon jn and grendon underwood? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Paul Bartlett has photos of many of the OHL electrification stock amongst his LMR departmental list Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrel Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 The answer would appear to be a pair of such vehicles running behind E2001. I guess there were probably plenty of other test trains once the AL1s-5s started to be delivered but a pair makes a good starting point. https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6216/6427450295_a5f828992d_b.jpg https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5503/9330320722_36315ec401_b.jpg What exactly were they testing in that photo? There doesn't appear to be any overhead wires or masts. I know the same loco was used when testing the Glasgow suburban network. Though strangely the two photos I have seen of it at Coatbridge Sunnyside junction, on one side of the loco there is a set of buffers and at the other end the track has been lifted. Leaving the loco marooned. My understanding was the loco was used as a load bank can anyone confirm? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 There was quite a lot of stock kept at East Didsbury for driver training with E2001. The Engineers trains were usually heavily modified 1920s vehicles at that time. This is not running anywhere. If you look closely at the second photo there's a sleeper onto of the rails. So this train is parked in a siding. The two BGs are from D.1715 lot 292 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted November 7, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2014 This is not running anywhere. If you look closely at the second photo there's a sleeper onto of the rails. So this train is parked in a siding. The two BGs are from D.1715 lot 292 As i put above im sure its sat on the old gc mainline at grendon underwood which at the time was a siding as such, i believe they refered to it as 'the long siding' right up until it was lifted in the 80s/early 90s? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted November 7, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2014 This is not running anywhere. If you look closely at the second photo there's a sleeper onto of the rails. So this train is parked in a siding. The two BGs are from D.1715 lot 292 The linked photos of E2001 were 1970, long after its use ended. East Didsbury was around 1959 and at that time it was numbered E1000. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 7, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2014 The linked photos of E2001 were 1970, long after its use ended. East Didsbury was around 1959 and at that time it was numbered E1000. The picture can be found on Flickr and Jim has in fact already hit on the location - more or less - as notwithstanding the caption under the linked picture, and assuming the location is correctly stated, it is on the remains of the line between Ashendon Jcn and Grendon Underwood, the last surviving stub of which ran as a single line worked as a siding from Grendon underwood to Akeman St where there was a rail served fertilser depot. I'm reasonably sure that probably the last train to run over it was an Inspection Special we organised c1993/3 - and by then the line was in a very sorry state with an extremely verdant lineside. https://www.flickr.com/photos/12a_kingmoor_klickr/6427450295/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 The coaches are ex LMS period 1 vehicles, most had been heavily re-clad with steel sheeting. They were in fact all-steel coaches ordered by the LMS to assist the steel industry during the late 1920's, the BG's also. Things to look out for are heavily riveted sides, ends and roof and becasue they were self-supporting, they had no trussrods. Battery boxes were suspended from the floor. They were far stronger built than contemporary wooden stock, in fact some were given flat roofs for men to work on the overhead. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Another caption for the E2001 shot from the website The locomotive is E2001, the former Metro-Vic gas turbine 18100 converted to an AC electric for test or training purposes. The photo is undated. The location written on the slide mount (by the now-deceased photographer, it seems) is Akeman Street.Akeman Street was on the Great Central link from Ashendon Junction (where the GW & GC Joint Line split) to Grendon Underwood Junction, where the Great Central Main Line was joined.If the location given is genuine, what was E2001 doing there? Mike Wiltshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 'Cos that where the driver's fancy woman lived? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 10, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 10, 2014 Another caption for the E2001 shot from the website The locomotive is E2001, the former Metro-Vic gas turbine 18100 converted to an AC electric for test or training purposes. The photo is undated. The location written on the slide mount (by the now-deceased photographer, it seems) is Akeman Street. Akeman Street was on the Great Central link from Ashendon Junction (where the GW & GC Joint Line split) to Grendon Underwood Junction, where the Great Central Main Line was joined. If the location given is genuine, what was E2001 doing there? Mike Wiltshire Probably exactly what the photographer who took the picture said - it does look as if the rearmost vehicle has something rather like an anemometer on a pole above it. That of course raises the supplementary question of why someone should want to measure wind velocity just there and why 18100/E2001 was attached to the coaches? But then when we went along there with the Inspection Special just over 20 years ago the only reason we did so was because the line was there. Maybe somebody else had done exactly the same years earlier and thought just to get folk asking questions in the future we'll tow that loco along as well; stranger things than that have happened on the railway over the years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.