jonny777 Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 I hope that no one minds me taking this topic out of the David Ford thread What I would like to know, is this a unique livery and if so/not; which loco(s) carried it https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidwf2009/5537346883/in/set-72157626169910951 A Brush Type 2 in green with arrows under the cab and numbers behind the doors Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 There were several to receive this livery variant. The Transition Diesel Liveries group has a number of threads where it's been mentioned.... http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/138-transition-diesel-liveries/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonny777 Posted December 14, 2014 Author Share Posted December 14, 2014 There were several to receive this livery variant. The Transition Diesel Liveries group has a number of threads where it's been mentioned.... http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/138-transition-diesel-liveries/ Sorry, I must be a bit thick. I can't find any on that thread. Perhaps you can expand by giving me links to actual photos? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 Sorry, I must be a bit thick. I can't find any on that thread. Perhaps you can expand by giving me links to actual photos? In fact I've just been trying to find Brush Veteran's collection, linked to several times on there, but it's obviously moved. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 Oooh! That may WELL be unique! Here's the gallery - but you've hit the nail on the head - all the other green with double arrows locos have a single central arrow! https://www.flickr.com/photos/59835095@N02/sets/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonny777 Posted December 14, 2014 Author Share Posted December 14, 2014 In fact I've just been trying to find Brush Veteran's collection, linked to several times on there, but it's obviously moved. I think that you might be referring to this - https://www.flickr.com/photos/59835095@N02/sets/72157627773064944/page2/ but I can't find any on there. (Please note - I would not have asked this question if the answer was obvious). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 I get the distinct impression we were typing simultaneously. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
50A55B Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 There has been discussion about this variation before, unfortunately (and unhelpfully) I'm not sure it was on here. The conclusion at the time was that it appeared to be unique to this loco. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted December 14, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 14, 2014 There has been discussion about this variation before, unfortunately (and unhelpfully) I'm not sure it was on here. The conclusion at the time was that it appeared to be unique to this loco. So therefore we know it's number???? Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold DaveF Posted December 14, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 14, 2014 This is the thread you want: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69492-class-31-warning-panel/ The relevant post is #13 , which I am reproducing below. Sorry it is a "bit small". There is also a reference in A History of British Railways Diesel and Electric Locomotive Liveries, Malcolm Dyer, published by the Diesel and Electric Group in 1979 (no ISBN). It says that 5557 had black buffer beams, numbers behind the cab doors and logos on all cabsides. So this should be the one in the photo. Other Green locos: 5518, D5520, 5600, 5618, D5692, 5819, and 5828 received full yellow ends, medium logos and asymetric numbers. 5665 and 5685 received full ends, black bufferbeams and small logos. 5551 had full ends, asymetric numbers and black bufferbeams. 5518 received headcode boxes and a white roof for Royal Train duties. Of early blue ones: 5501, D5516, 5550, 5594, 5607 and D5658 had medium logos on each cabside and numbers behind the cab doors. 5526, 5670, 5859 had cabside numbers ans large logos in the totem position. When 5646 was renumbered as 31 408 had it's logos deleted at the driver's corners and replaced by numbers. 31258 had logos on all four cabsides. David Dates are not given. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted December 14, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 14, 2014 This one (D5561) is the same, or very nearly the same. http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p857901357/h309ec472#h309ec472 Here's D5557 for comparison http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p857901357/h26bd0408#h26bd0408 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted December 14, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 14, 2014 This ones very unusual got a small double arrow but no door grille http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p857901357/h3dffced9#h3dffced9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted December 14, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 14, 2014 This ones very unusual got a small double arrow but no door grille http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p857901357/h3dffced9#h3dffced9 There were a few more like that, D5595, D5610, D5677, D5685 and D5802 for instance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted December 14, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 14, 2014 This ones very unusual got a small double arrow but no door grille http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p857901357/h3dffced9#h3dffced9 There were a few more like that, D5595, D5610, D5677, D5685 and D5802 for instance. Hi Stovepipe In an earlier discussion about Brush 2s in green with BR arrows someone suggested that it was when they were fitted with their EE engines, a quick touch up and a new logo instead of a full repaint. It was also said that the Toffee Apples received their grilles in the engine room door when they swapped their engines. Which means D5513 is a bit odd that it has the new logo but appears to be a Mirrlees engined machine. It is a Stratford loco so the "arras" could have been applied locally having nothing to do with any re-engine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted December 16, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2014 Two earlier photos of D5557 and D5561, I suppose showing the liveries before re-engining Clive? http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p857901357/h2DD73462#h2dd73462 https://www.flickr.com/photos/tcs-pics/13248058105/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted December 16, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 16, 2014 Hi Stovepipe As I said in my post, somebody suggested that the arrows were applied when EE engines were fitted, I cannot confirm this. D5561 has not been re-engined as it clearly has Mirrlees exhaaust. D5557 looks like it has EE exhaust from the angle the photo has been taken (I may be wrong). What is needed is a list of re-engining dates with photos of the period, with correct dates on the captions. That is the only way to prove what is what. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
50A55B Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Apologies for misleading people by stating there was only one example of this (and failing to provide the number to boot...). I'm actually quite pleased another one has been identified as I quite fancy doing this variant but was agonising over it due to its seeming uniqueness. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorpion Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 5557 was a regular in my spotting days and easily identifiable, I'd been told that 5561 was like it as well but it was blue when I first saw it, thankyou for finding a picture of the mythical twin 5557 was never blue with that number, it went into the Plant as green 5557 and came out as blue 31 139 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonny777 Posted December 16, 2014 Author Share Posted December 16, 2014 Thanks to everyone for finding so much info on this livery variation, and especially the photos. I never realised that the combination of arrow sizes and number fonts could be so complex. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted December 16, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2014 Hi Stovepipe As I said in my post, somebody suggested that the arrows were applied when EE engines were fitted, I cannot confirm this. D5561 has not been re-engined as it clearly has Mirrlees exhaaust. D5557 looks like it has EE exhaust from the angle the photo has been taken (I may be wrong). What is needed is a list of re-engining dates with photos of the period, with correct dates on the captions. That is the only way to prove what is what. I may have this wrong, but I thought the Mirrlees exhaust ports were aligned along the length of the body, whereas the EE version were aligned across the width of the body - i.e. turned through 90 degrees. On the blow-up of D5561 I would say it has the exhaust ports in EE style. Here's a couple of shots of MIrrlees engined examples for comparison: https://www.flickr.com/photos/andersley_images/7278201818/in/pool-1691087@N24 https://www.flickr.com/photos/andersley_images/7278198460/in/pool-1691087@N24 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted December 16, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 16, 2014 I may have this wrong, but I thought the Mirrlees exhaust ports were aligned along the length of the body, whereas the EE version were aligned across the width of the body - i.e. turned through 90 degrees. On the blow-up of D5561 I would say it has the exhaust ports in EE style. Here's a couple of shots of MIrrlees engined examples for comparison: https://www.flickr.com/photos/andersley_images/7278201818/in/pool-1691087@N24 https://www.flickr.com/photos/andersley_images/7278198460/in/pool-1691087@N24 On a second butchers, whoops I was wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted December 16, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2014 No problem, glad we are seeing the same thing. I suppose that scotches the suggestion - non-standard arrows were applied after re-engining on both 5557 and 5561. There is frustratingly little information on the engine swap programme - I guess in the 1964-1969 period attention was focussed elsewhere.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted December 16, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2014 EE ports are across the body and mirlees in line Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.