well filled baps The Sheep Chronicles. The adventures of a Sheep, the Works Forecat and the Works Apprentice, George.

[Gilbert]

2 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

A bit of track nailed to a self

I see.....

 

[NHY 581]

Ahem.......sorted. 

[NHY 581]

Morning all. 

 

The beauty of a Cameo layout project. 

 

A spot of al fresco modelling this morning. Last of the  DAS added to the river bank. 

 

 

 

Once dry and sanded, the track etc  will have a coat or two of dark earth.

 

Rob. 

 

[NHY 581]

And this is the current state of play. 

 

 

The next job was to have been painting sleepers and chairs...............

 

 

[NHY 581]

BUT............

[woodenhead]

8 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

BUT............

You've realised N gauge is the future... 😄

[F-UnitMad]

1 minute ago, woodenhead said:

You've realised N O gauge is the future... 😄

Fixed that for you. 👌

[woodenhead]

2 minutes ago, F-UnitMad said:

Fixed that for you. 👌

But neither of us proffered TT 😄

[F-UnitMad]

14 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

But neither of us proffered TT 😄

Clearly we are not the target market... 🤔

[NHY 581]

5 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

BUT............

 

And here's the but...........

 

The shelf used as a board is 38mm deep as opposed to the 50mm IKEA table tops of past layouts, a change imposed when the originals were discontinued. 

I noticed this afternoon that there appeared to be a slight bow and a check revealed that this was in fact the case. In fact, more than a slight bow. The 'board' has warped giving a deflection of about 5mm on each end. 

 

This is the current state of play........

 

 

Removing the books from one end and allowing the board to spring up illustrates the problem. 

 

 

 

A pity as adding a bit of colour provides an insight into how it will look. 

 

 

 

I can bring it back true by adding a bit of strategically placed weight.....

 

 

So I'm going to try a bit of bracing whilst the weight is on. At this late stage it's all I can do as I have no time to start again..

 

Rob

 

 

 

[Gilbert]

What a complete b****r....just when you are least expecting it or need it

Along with any subterranean bracing - would a substantial backscene help stabilise matters?

C

[NHY 581]

10 minutes ago, Gilbert said:

What a complete b****r....just when you are least expecting it or need it

Along with any subterranean bracing - would a substantial backscene help stabilise matters?

C

 

Hi Chris, 

 

Possibly. I've no idea how this has come about. The shelf has a 9mm MDF top, glued and screwed as per Ewe. The mdf was primed both sides to avoid any moisture getting in. 

 

The backscene thing, in conjunction with a frontispiece on the borad itself might do it. 

 

I can but try. 

 

Rob

[MrWolf]

A name board on the front, say 100-150mm deep of 9mm furniture ply would hold the front, back scene and end boards of 6mm and the light bar should take care of the rest, as well as protecting the layout, it could give you a space beneath the layout of around 100mm deep to hide assorted gubbins too.

[Winslow Boy]

I wonder if routing out a grove on the underside would help?

 

You could try wetting it prior to putting the weight on.

[Donw]

I would put diagonal braces underneath these will stop twisting etc

 

 

These boards are 4mm ply with 20x12mm edge timber and 20x20 timber braces halve joint in the middle no need for precision no more nails or something will fill any gaps

you may need bigger sections to hold thicker ply flat.

Don

[vaughan45]

Unfortunately some Ikea shelves appear more prone to a degree of warping than the table tops. I found this out on my current cameo which uses an Ikea shelf, where after I had screwed & glued a painted plywood board to the top and laid some of the trackwork, I noticed the centre of the board had bowed upwards by approx. 5mm.

 

In an attempt to overcome this, I made four cuts through the shelf's bottom layer at equal distances either side of the high point and clamped it to a table using sash clamps. When the board was removed after a few days the bowing had reduced to 2mm, which I deemed to be acceptable and the cuts were filled with waterproof PVA in an attempt to re-introduce some strength.  I have since beefed up the layout facia material to help stability. So far operation of locos and rolling stock does not appear problematic and buildings have been designed to ensure they are horizontal.

 

Hope this may help.

Vaughan

 

Edited May 18 by vaughan45
Clarity

[NHY 581]

Morning all, and thank you for your thoughts. 

 

This project is certainly proving to be a bit of a challenge, at times, a classic one step forward, two steps back.

 

Today should have seen a start on the ballasting as the track weathering, not as involved as other layouts, wouldn't have been far off finished. 

 

But before I do anything else, I need to sort out this issue first. 

 

Rob

 

 

[Izzy]

Could it be that the layer of DAS has pulled the MDF top surface tighter? Does it/could it shrink on drying out if there is nothing to restrain it? I’ve had similar issues with single layer mountboard where applying glue to just one side has caused it to curl. That is has been pinned/screwed to battens makes it seem unlikely but you just never know with these kind of problems. Here’s hoping you can overcome it. 
 

Bob

[GMKAT7]

Good morning folks,

 

On the 'big railway' we were taught to always put a balancing layer on the rear face of any melamine covered partitions or shelves, so that the facing didn't warp the partition/shelf.

 

Even though the partitions were often 38mm thick (1.5" in old money)!

 

Cheers, Nigel.

[NHY 581]

11 minutes ago, Izzy said:

Could it be that the layer of DAS has pulled the MDF top surface tighter? Does it/could it shrink on drying out if there is nothing to restrain it? I’ve had similar issues with single layer mountboard where applying glue to just one side has caused it to curl. That is has been pinned/screwed to battens makes it seem unlikely but you just never know with these kind of problems. Here’s hoping you can overcome it. 
 

Bob

 

 

Hi Bob, 

 

This was suggested by @MrWolf off piste. I've used DAS on all bar one of my previous layouts without ill effect. This is the second time I've used a glued and screwed MDF top skin with DAS applied on top of that, Ewe being the first and did so without ill effect......BUT......

 

The difference between these two layouts is the depth of the shelf used, 38mm on this and 50mm on all other layouts. In addition, this board is some 6+ins longer. Perhaps it is these two factors which when combined has caused the issue. 

 

After coming back from Bracknell, I did say I felt a reset was needed. If I was in any doubt of this and I wasn't, this episode has now confirmed that this is the case. So, what ever comes of this, some time out will be taken. 

 

I've already started the ball rolling by reluctantly withdrawing from an exhibition early next year. 

 

This is the second layout I've had an issue with this year. Someone is definitely trying to tell me something. 

 

Rob.

[Winslow Boy]

26 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

 

 

Hi Bob, 

 

This was suggested by @MrWolf off piste. I've used DAS on all bar one of my previous layouts without ill effect. This is the second time I've used a glued and screwed MDF top skin with DAS applied on top of that, Ewe being the first and did so without ill effect......BUT......

 

The difference between these two layouts is the depth of the shelf used, 38mm on this and 50mm on all other layouts. In addition, this board is some 6+ins longer. Perhaps it is these two factors which when combined has caused the issue. 

 

After coming back from Bracknell, I did say I felt a reset was needed. If I was in any doubt of this and I wasn't, this episode has now confirmed that this is the case. So, what ever comes of this, some time out will be taken. 

 

I've already started the ball rolling by reluctantly withdrawing from an exhibition early next year. 

 

This is the second layout I've had an issue with this year. Someone is definitely trying to tell me something. 

 

Rob.

Roundy Roundy?

[F-UnitMad]

20 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

Roundy Roundy?

In O gauge, 2ft square.... 🤩🤩🤩

[franciswilliamwebb]

3 minutes ago, F-UnitMad said:

 

 

Now if you insist on running widdershins you can't expect to be lucky with warping🤪

[F-UnitMad]

8 minutes ago, franciswilliamwebb said:

widdershins

Ok, had to Google that.... every day a school day!! 😁👍

 

Edit, clearly it's my sense of humour that's warped, not my baseboard! 🤪

Edited May 19 by F-UnitMad

[Izzy]

1 hour ago, NHY 581 said:

This is the second layout I've had an issue with this year. Someone is definitely trying to tell me something. 

 

Hi Rob,

 

Perhaps this is the opportunity to try a new direction with your baseboards and associate bits. Try using the laser cut ply ones or just use ply/softwood as the basis ( good quality birch ply, none of this rubbish sold by the 'sheds'), and since you like exhibiting and make several layouts of similar size over time perhaps design and make a modular leg/display unit that any of them could use, fit into. Just change the name board etc. A modular system for power control so that whatever you choose to use just plugs in via a suitable Din socket and sits say on the floor or elsewhere out of the way, (and so mains voltage doesn't get anywhere near any layout). Wi-fi DCC handsets/systems are ideal for this type of direction. So one system, many layouts....ahem... (since you can only run one at a time!)

 

Bob

Edited May 19 by Izzy