RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted March 30, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 30, 2015 Not just livery wrong body by the looks of it just done a quick look on Flicker and 43022 as done by Hornby as there dummy seams to have a Gaurds compartment. Don't remember when the guards compartment windows were removed, but in this photo of 43022 in the Hornby livery it still has it http://www.hondawanderer.com/43022_Circourt_1987.htm. In looking on the web, I found this page with various HST photos http://www.drehscheibe-online.de/foren/read.php?17,6682615,page=all. Scroll down to No.28 (two different IC liveries back to back), No.31 (a set hauled by 37077) and No.32 (a PC hauling BG). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveClass47 Posted March 30, 2015 Share Posted March 30, 2015 Hi, see what I mean about the Silver lettering? Not a game changer for me, but a tiny bit bloody annoying! Cheers Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveClass47 Posted March 30, 2015 Share Posted March 30, 2015 Hi, photos of my R3271 HST now uploaded. They are also in my Gallery. I have also reviewed this locomotive on my youtube channel. Look out for the March Update2, coming before the end of March! Cheers. Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonny777 Posted March 30, 2015 Share Posted March 30, 2015 Don't remember when the guards compartment windows were removed, but in this photo of 43022 in the Hornby livery it still has it http://www.hondawanderer.com/43022_Circourt_1987.htm. Oh dear, that 1987 photo will also be a bit of a blow to anyone who insisted the buffets were turned, by the early 80s. so the seating faced 1st class. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted March 30, 2015 Share Posted March 30, 2015 I got so fed up with waiting for Hornby to release this livery, I repainted a power car myself! I'm glad I did now with all of the reported inaccuracies. The bogies are incorrect too....if you look at the axleboxes, they are the later 'MTU' engine variant. On a brighter note, the running numbers are fairly easy to remove taking your time with a cotton bud and t-cut, most of the names are commercially available from Fox transfers. 052 by rothburyuk, on Flickr 049 by rothburyuk, on Flickr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
owentherail Posted March 30, 2015 Share Posted March 30, 2015 .......it's white on the box. Yet they still c0ck it up!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfsup Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Meanwhile... The MML Powercars have also turned up. https://www.facebook.com/207521425956079/photos/pcb.894833800558168/894833607224854/?type=1&theater Now those two both appear to use the original HST bodyshell with guards compartment and original lights - which limit 43043 to a very limited period in it's history, whereas this Intercity one seems to use the later without guards compartment. Little disappointing that again, simple errors seem to be scattered across Hornby's range again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
43179 Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Meanwhile... The MML Powercars have also turned up. https://www.facebook.com/207521425956079/photos/pcb.894833800558168/894833607224854/?type=1&theater Now those two both appear to use the original HST bodyshell with guards compartment and original lights - which limit 43043 to a very limited period in it's history, whereas this Intercity one seems to use the later without guards compartment. Little disappointing that again, simple errors seem to be scattered across Hornby's range again. Weirdly, these now have black brake disc inserts on the wheels rather than nice silver ones. Not difficult to fix, but if they can get it right on earlier models..... Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard w Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Takes about 10 mins to get rid of the silver lettering using cotton buds and t-cut. Transfers from Fox are the same size but more widely spaced. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 That's fair enough Richard, but I really don't think the consumer should be expected to have to correct such a silly error on something costing the thick end of 200 quid.I very much doubt the majority would be happy to attack their brand new purchase with a bottle of T-cut! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard w Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Totally agree Lee. A quick check at Hornby would surely have identified this issue. I'm not pleased at having to renumber the dummy car either. A great model, but it's fallen at the last hurdle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveClass47 Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Totally agree Lee. A quick check at Hornby would surely have identified this issue. I'm not pleased at having to renumber the dummy car either. A great model, but it's fallen at the last hurdle. Hi Why did you have to renumber the dummy car Richard? You're a braver man than I for t cutting a new model lol. I'm sure it will look good when done. I'm sticking with the silver lettering for now. As for the image on the box folks, that's just a computer generated image. The image shown are even incorrect with the guards window configuration, as the model bares no resemblance to the image in this respect. Which is correct?, model or image?! No doubt the next run of hst in this livery (maybe in another 30 years!!) will have everything correct. Well one can hope anyway!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium James Makin Posted April 1, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 1, 2015 Can anyone help?.... Hornby seem to avoid naming their HST releases in the original Blue Yellow and later Exec liveries. Which is a shame, as a fair few HST units were named! In light of the recent release of Hornby R3271 in Exec Intercity livery, can anyone tell me of a website/book where I might find the history of the naming of the Class 43 HST machines? If Hornby's latest release 43021 and 43022 were named I might like to get etched plates made up to fit to them! Does anyone know where this information can be found? Hi Dave, I've found Colin J Marsden & Darren Ford's Encyclopaedia of Modern Traction Names a really good resource - poured over this book for many years, it has info on almost all the D&E nameplates fitted up to about 1998 when the book was published - including all of the HST nameplates! It lists the name, variations, date of naming, any ceremony, meanings and renamings, plus a photo of the plate on each machine - amazing book if you are fascinated by nameplates like me! http://www.amazon.co.uk/Encyclopedia-Modern-Traction-J-Marsden-Darren/dp/1901419029 Enjoy! Cheers, James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Endacott Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 I took a lot of photos of HSTs in 1990 and I don't remember any of the earlier power cars having the guard's window plated over by then. Absence of the window was always a way to identify the later batch. If you are not happy about the silver lettering (yes, it is wrong) don't try counting the number of slats in the bodyside vents. Geoff Endacott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sub39h Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 As built all power cars up to 43152 had guard's windows. They weren't plated over until they were refurbished in the 2000s I believe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sub39h Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 If you are not happy about the silver lettering (yes, it is wrong) don't try counting the number of slats in the bodyside vents. I think that's a more acceptable error because to me the slats still look right. Only problem is when I wanted to remove one of the slats to represent the oil tap the ER cars had fitted I didn't know where to put it! They seem to be in different places on different power cars too. http://ukrailways1970tilltoday.me.uk/EastCoastHST43310in2009.jpg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveClass47 Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 I think we can all agree that these Executive HST's have several minor issues. The slats, the lettering, the bogies, the brake discs and the guards window. Whilst these all annoy the majority of us, the things like the bogies, brakes and slats are really minor errors that most of us (including me) didnt know were wrong. These wont keep me up and night in a cold sweat. The lettering and window are a bit more obvious, but you know what....its still looks a beauty of a loco and I am sure the next release in years to come will address this, by which times this R3271 will be several years old and we'll all have forgotten about the minor mistakes. Well most of them anyway! lol My concern is not really with these individual errors, but with the person who signed off on this job to be manufactured! Surely someone should be held accountable for these mistakes? Or don't Hornby work like other businesses, where if there is a product error someone gets held to account and roasted by their boss?! Followed by an announcement on their website acknowledging the issues. Followed by a Product recall to correct some of the issues?? Either the QC team or the person who emailed the drawings and manufacturing instructions to the factory in China must be notified of their mistake? Or if its the factory's error then they should be told, have some of their manufacturing fee revoked, with the savings being passed on to the consumers of these models!! Am I living in fantasy land?....most probably yes!!! lol In the meantime the sun will still rise in the east and set in the West, the world will keep turning and my HST fleet will keep powering around my layout, while I look on with a smile on my face. Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waverley West Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Generally, I can forgive errors that I wouldn't have realised were wrong without some research. The slats and bogie details fall into that category as far as I am concerned. What does annoy me is when I see errors that: a. are glaringly obvious (such as the grey band on the blue/grey Mk 2es, not to mention the "sole bar", and the silver lettering on the InterCity HST), and that b. I have managed to avoid with my own amateur resprays thanks to a little research, which often doesn't amount to much more than finding a few suitable photos of the prototype I want to model. Hornby have missed out on quite a few sales from me due to these careless mistakes, including several rakes of Mk 2es, several rakes of "improved" Mk 3s and quite possibly a pair of InterCity-livered HST power cars too. I'll stick with my own resprays, carry on improving my old Mk 3s and wait for Bachmann to come up with the goods with the Mk 2fs. I don't suppose my views will bother Hornby one bit, but I think I'm far from alone. For all the above, I think it's only fair to say that my three HST rakes are ever-present favourites on my layout. The power cars in particular are lovely models. For a ha'penny worth of tar and just a little more care, they could be absolutely superb, that's all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonC Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 If you renumber them to a later one without the guards van window, will the cooler group still be correct? didn't they change part way through the build too? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutton Bank Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Hello all, On a related note, yesterday I received my HST in BR blue/grey (R3269) and was slightly less upset at the asking price once I had it in my hands - it's frankly very impressive. However, having already watched Dave's Dean Park mini review of the Exec version, I was paying particular attention to any paint flaws or things otherwise amiss with the quality control. It was at that point it became quite obvious that there was also something strange with the main InterCity logo: the white outline is crisp and opaque, excellent. But inside the outline the colour is black. After staring at it for a bit, referencing the box and then looking online, it would seem to be as designed, but why? See http://www.anticsonline.co.uk/l.aspx?k=2598414 I'd love to hear your thoughts because I certainly can't remember ever seeing the prototype of this and it almost feels like Hornby is messing with us. But why? Cheers, Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BR(S) Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Hello all, On a related note, yesterday I received my HST in BR blue/grey (R3269) and was slightly less upset at the asking price once I had it in my hands - it's frankly very impressive. However, having already watched Dave's Dean Park mini review of the Exec version, I was paying particular attention to any paint flaws or things otherwise amiss with the quality control. It was at that point it became quite obvious that there was also something strange with the main InterCity logo: the white outline is crisp and opaque, excellent. But inside the outline the colour is black. After staring at it for a bit, referencing the box and then looking online, it would seem to be as designed, but why? See http://www.anticsonline.co.uk/l.aspx?k=2598414 I'd love to hear your thoughts because I certainly can't remember ever seeing the prototype of this and it almost feels like Hornby is messing with us. But why? Cheers, Tom Black colouring inside the InterCity 125 did exist on some power cars, although I don't think it was many or for very long. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waverley West Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Black colouring inside the InterCity 125 did exist on some power cars, although I don't think it was many or for very long. I think you're right BRS, but like you say it was an initial livery variation that was tried out for a short time only. There was also one which had all the blue replaced by black back to the start of the guard's compartment, but I'm not sure whether it ever worked on the mainline in that livery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BR(S) Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Just having a look for a picture with black lettering. No luck so far, but I did find this interesting picture of a set in Swallow livery with a pristine power car and absolutely filthy coaches at Dawlish Warren: http://www.railshotsuk.com/HSTsandUnits/HSTs-1975-2000/38602125_6wWWcC#!i=3483586760&k=gvmRvjn Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveClass47 Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Hello all, On a related note, yesterday I received my HST in BR blue/grey (R3269) and was slightly less upset at the asking price once I had it in my hands - it's frankly very impressive. However, having already watched Dave's Dean Park mini review of the Exec version, I was paying particular attention to any paint flaws or things otherwise amiss with the quality control. It was at that point it became quite obvious that there was also something strange with the main InterCity logo: the white outline is crisp and opaque, excellent. But inside the outline the colour is black. After staring at it for a bit, referencing the box and then looking online, it would seem to be as designed, but why? See http://www.anticsonline.co.uk/l.aspx?k=2598414 I'd love to hear your thoughts because I certainly can't remember ever seeing the prototype of this and it almost feels like Hornby is messing with us. But why? Cheers, Tom Hi Mate, Interesting about the black lettering....I did think it was just a error in the Hornby catalogue when I saw it at first, but as my Eastern rake is due to arrive today I will be able to see for myself. I suppose it will make it stand out from my Western Blue Grey HST, but I never remember seeing these with the black (I was only born in 1977!). If this 'alternative' logo has been correctly applied by Hornby, then WELL DONE THEM! I hope, that after waiting 35 years for Hornby to produce a 254 class of HST set for the East coast that they've not buggered it up!!!! I also notice that the 254 xxx numbering does not appear on the lower section of the nose, as it does with the 253 xxx Western sets! The Hornby HST is a fantastic product....I just wish they would do it justice with every release! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveClass47 Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Generally, I can forgive errors that I wouldn't have realised were wrong without some research. The slats and bogie details fall into that category as far as I am concerned. What does annoy me is when I see errors that: a. are glaringly obvious (such as the grey band on the blue/grey Mk 2es, not to mention the "sole bar", and the silver lettering on the InterCity HST), and that b. I have managed to avoid with my own amateur resprays thanks to a little research, which often doesn't amount to much more than finding a few suitable photos of the prototype I want to model. Hornby have missed out on quite a few sales from me due to these careless mistakes, including several rakes of Mk 2es, several rakes of "improved" Mk 3s and quite possibly a pair of InterCity-livered HST power cars too. I'll stick with my own resprays, carry on improving my old Mk 3s and wait for Bachmann to come up with the goods with the Mk 2fs. I don't suppose my views will bother Hornby one bit, but I think I'm far from alone. For all the above, I think it's only fair to say that my three HST rakes are ever-present favourites on my layout. The power cars in particular are lovely models. For a ha'penny worth of tar and just a little more care, they could be absolutely superb, that's all. Hi, I I feel your pain with the mk2e Blue Grey....the shade of grey appears different to me, but the application of the band just doesn't look right. Infuriating. The solebar is an issue, but not as glaring as the livery. I went for the Intercity Swallow ones. I have to say, the livery on those is well applied and crisply done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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