Jump to content
 

Colas buys 10 Class 60s from DB Schenker


Recommended Posts

Hey,

Just heard from a post on facebook/video on youtube that Colas Rail is getting 5 Class 60s. Saw a video of a Colas Class 56 top and tailing with the 5 60s sandwiched between them. From what I could see in the video the locos are 60002, 60047, 60076, 60066* and 600XX. The movement was numbered 0X60

I've got no more info to spare but if anyone else knows please do share it.

Cheers!

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

its already been briefly discussed in this thread, but is lost amid the 70 odd pages!

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/5294-end-of-the-tugs/?p=1401922

 

its actually 10 (possibly 20) they have, they are being refurbished by db schenker in toton for colas, the first one should be out in late may hopefully, looking forward to it

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

wow, that's like Pepsi refettling a bottling plant for coke...

I'm intrigued as to why they need to mess with these demics when they have 70s and 66s...

because we dont have enough 66s or 70s for all the work we have!

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

wow, that's like Pepsi refettling a bottling plant for coke...

I'm intrigued as to why they need to mess with these demics when they have 70s and 66s...

Jim has already supplied the most obvious answer but there could well be a bit more to it than that.  The Class 60s are owned by their operator whereas almost all the newwer traction is leased (although I don't know about the Class 70s in that regard).  In terms of new kit leasing has certain financial advantages however when it comes to fully depreciated secondhand assets it could well be that different set of accounting rules apply within Colas and the acquisition of a tangible asset could be financially beneficial although equally they might well be obtaining them from DBS on some sort of lease.

 

Thus while the practicalities of having them available is one thing the way the money works can be just as important, for both parties in the deal.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The class 60 has a role to play in the UK hence unlike all the rest of the old BR fleet it inherited EWS/DB kept them safe in more secure locations.

 

The fact that DB felt it worth putting many of them through a complete strip down overhaul indicates there is an ongoing need for their grunt. Clearly they don't need them all and it is refreshing that DB are open to selling/leasing to other UK operators rather than simply holding on to them until they are in the same state as 45015.

 

I've read that GBRF are looking at reengineering some 92s to be a diesel / electric hybrid though I wasn't sure if this was an April Fool.

 

I guess the last engines that BR procured weren't that bad then.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The class 60 has a role to play in the UK hence unlike all the rest of the old BR fleet it inherited EWS/DB kept them safe in more secure locations.

 

The fact that DB felt it worth putting many of them through a complete strip down overhaul indicates there is an ongoing need for their grunt. Clearly they don't need them all and it is refreshing that DB are open to selling/leasing to other UK operators rather than simply holding on to them until they are in the same state as 45015.

 

I've read that GBRF are looking at reengineering some 92s to be a diesel / electric hybrid though I wasn't sure if this was an April Fool.

 

I guess the last engines that BR procured weren't that bad then.

The GBRf story was around long before April 1st. I wouldn't be surprised to see some of them being reworked, as they already need a lot of work to make them useable; some of those that Eurotunnel bought had been pretty thoroughly cannibalised whilst they were at Crewe Electric. The diesel engine wouldn't be that big; you're looking at something that can be used for haulage into and out of non-electrified yards, and perhaps getting trains from under broken knitting, not running up Shap at 120 kph.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I still seem to be missing the point ...

firstly , do 70s have more grunt than 60s or vice versa?

so , your doing well, you be just got new 66s and 70s and need more power , you don't put a repeat order in, instead you commit to costly overhauls if rotten locos from the competition ...er...

 

and if I was the Germans , I'd sell any of these assets over my dead body. I think EWS got hammered for that ...

Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the point for colas is they need more motive power, 66s are limited availability, gbrf have committed to 21 of the 28 that are being built, and after that without a different power unit no more can be built, emission regs I think. The lease costs on these and 70s may not be favourable compared to older reconned locos, (as stated by stationmaster). Also the tightening of emission regs will presumably affect future new builds, and so it makes sense to snap up some quality type 5 power (best of British n all that) before someone else does?

All speculation on my part, but good to see better fortunes for a class that looked doomed before its time a few years back. I hope they tweak the livery a bit though, a bit more black, aka loadhaul would look the biz!

Chris

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

I still seem to be missing the point ...

firstly , do 70s have more grunt than 60s or vice versa?

so , your doing well, you be just got new 66s and 70s and need more power , you don't put a repeat order in, instead you commit to costly overhauls if rotten locos from the competition ...er...

and if I was the Germans , I'd sell any of these assets over my dead body. I think EWS got hammered for that ...

i've not driven a 60 (yet) so cant comment on the power compared to a 70 but if they have more 'grunt' they they will be a cracking loco!

 

as already pointed out 66s have a waiting list and 70s would be similar i suppose, i never gave the emmission argument a though but thats probably another factor, grandfather rights and all that

 

compared to the 70s i think the 60s will be a far better all rounder, there are a few niggly little things on the 70 that make them a pain in the backside for certain types of work and locations, from what im led to believe the 70s (and 66s) will be used mainly on the NDS infrastructure work in the south and west which will leave the rest of the trains to be worked by 47/56/66 and eventually 37s, i cant see a reduction in the existing fleet once all the 70s and 60s are up and running either

 

the logs for example when it switched from a 66 to a 56 the had to be reduced from 21 to 19 wagons and even more if it went via the s+c (17 wagons), you think if that train could be increased back to 21 wagons how much more income the company would get, 2 wagons a day extra, 5 days a week, near as damn it an extra train every 2 weeks and the ability to run via the s+c again with a decent load, just have to watch out for the froth and drool around whalley bridge as it passes micks house!

 

similarly the coal, currently 70s cant be used on it (but watch this space!), 60s were built for that job so im hoping to see them on there, i very much doubt that 70s will see their way onto the logs or coal on a permanant basis, just a trail maybe now that we have 60s

 

(the above views are my own and not colas'!!)

Link to post
Share on other sites

interesting stuff , thanks .

 

so the 70s may well spend their time shuttling on the NDS rag tag trains of clapped out engineering stock ??!

 

I thought they'd put their oldest bangers on there.

 

I'm not being critical of colas, just trying to work out how it all works for a FOC...

 

I think colas may be to blame for me taking a more active interest in " modern image ":)

away from my BR blue stuff

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

The 60's certainly had more grunt in West Yorks than the 66's and the 66's could put it's power down more effectively than a 56.  There used to be special signalling arrangements at Ferrybridge for trains to Knottingley to ensure that 56's on MGR's didn't get halted on the curve but 59's and 66's just sailed round.  The 60's were also very powerful which I think is why they are still preferred on the heavy oil trains from Humberside.

 

I can't comment on the 70's as my days spent in signal boxes chatting to the signalmen are over.

 

Jamie

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

interesting stuff , thanks .

so the 70s may well spend their time shuttling on the NDS rag tag trains of clapped out engineering stock ??!

I thought they'd put their oldest bangers on there.

I'm not being critical of colas, just trying to work out how it all works for a FOC...

I think colas may be to blame for me taking a more active interest in " modern image ":)

away from my BR blue stuff

i think you may have the the wrong impression of NDS trains, some of it is quite 'hi-tech', points carriers, auto ballasters, falcons, self discharge trains, side tippers etc, gone are the days of trains of seacows, rudds, clams etc!!

 

i think it was a requirement of the contract that certain locos could be provided to work the trains, certainly reliability is important as delays to these trains can be costly

Link to post
Share on other sites

i think you may have the the wrong impression of NDS trains, some of it is quite 'hi-tech', points carriers, auto ballasters, falcons, self discharge trains, side tippers etc, gone are the days of trains of seacows, rudds, clams etc!!

 

i think it was a requirement of the contract that certain locos could be provided to work the trains, certainly reliability is important as delays to these trains can be costly

With the penalties involved if possessions over-run, the contracts for delivery of materials to worksites, and to and from regional depots, are very closely monitored by Network Rail. Hence the FOCs putting their newest locos on these workings- if they don't deliver on time due to stock/crew problems, it could cost them a very lucrative contract.

The days of an unreliable loco hauling a selection of superannuated 'ex-revenue' wagons are long gone- since privatisation, engineers' trains are every much part of commercial operations as container trains or power station coal.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I still seem to be missing the point ...

firstly , do 70s have more grunt than 60s or vice versa?

so , your doing well, you be just got new 66s and 70s and need more power , you don't put a repeat order in, instead you commit to costly overhauls if rotten locos from the competition ...er...

 

and if I was the Germans , I'd sell any of these assets over my dead body. I think EWS got hammered for that ...

I think you will find that the DB are required by law (in Germany - oddly where they are based) to sell all un used assets. The UK operations will be covered by this requirement.

Look over the "tellerrand" and see just how many ex DB loco's (diesel and electric) are operated by their competition.

 

Mike

Link to post
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


×
×
  • Create New...