Clagsniffer Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I was just curious to see what people set their volume at on cv63 for home based layouts? I'm asking as I've just sent my Bachmann 37 round my layout to test the track and it was deafening! I actually quite liked it but the Mrs wasn't overly impressed! The dog also went a bit nuts every time the horn went off! I haven't checked what the setting is yet, I'll do that in the morning, but I'm interested to see what other people run their locos at. Especially using esu v4 chips with bass reflex speakers like my 37 has. Is there such a thing as a happy medium where I can enjoy the thrash without getting thrashed off the other half? Looking forward to 'hearing' your thoughts! Cheers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRman Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 The settings vary considerably according to what the speaker setups are on each loco, which version of the LokSound decoder is fitted, and the qualities of the individual sound projects involved.For example, a Bachmann class 25 with original speaker sealed in with blu-tack and LokSound v4 was set at 90 (out of 192).A class 37 with two speakers, LokSound v3.5 and Howes sounds was set at around 35 (out of 64).Another class 37 with sealed rectangular speaker, LokSound v4 and Legomanbiffo sounds was set at around 120 (out of 192).For exhibition use I usually turn these settings up a bit.The best I can suggest is experiment a bit with your settings until both you and SWMBO are satisfied.If your DCC system allows programming on the main (POM) then you can adjust the master volume settings in CV63 on the fly, while the train is in motion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefrk Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 It would be nice if some exhibitors would turn the sound DOWN at exhibitions i.e. so only those in front of the railway can hear it and not those half way across the venue.... Just my two penny worth. Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I was just curious to see what people set their volume at on cv63 for home based layouts? I'm asking as I've just sent my Bachmann 37 round my layout to test the track and it was deafening! I actually quite liked it but the Mrs wasn't overly impressed! The dog also went a bit nuts every time the horn went off! I haven't checked what the setting is yet, I'll do that in the morning, but I'm interested to see what other people run their locos at. Especially using esu v4 chips with bass reflex speakers like my 37 has. Is there such a thing as a happy medium where I can enjoy the thrash without getting thrashed off the other half? Looking forward to 'hearing' your thoughts! Cheers. Another option would be to set up the volume adjust "logical" feature to any spare F button. This is possible on both the Lok 3.5 and V4. You could then adjust the the (CV63) volume quickly, by just simply pressing an F button, set to "momentary" action, repeated presses will then cycle the volume level up/down via 4 steps on a Lok 3.5 and 6 steps on a Lok 4, depending on the max value pre-set in CV63, For a Lok 4 37 with a Bass reflex CV 63 = 128 I find is a good starting point for home use. HTH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 It would be nice if some exhibitors would turn the sound DOWN at exhibitions i.e. so only those in front of the railway can hear it and not those half way across the venue.... Just my two penny worth. Dave I agree wholeheartedly. I remember when Bachmann first brought out their class 20 with sound. If you went in to an exhibition hall with one running, that was all you could hear. There is a growing opinion that the sound should be set as the prototype. If you are standing at say 100 to 150 yards away from a locomotive which is just ticking over you would not be able to hear it but you would be able to hear the horn. This equates to about 6 feet in 4mm scale. So, why not adjust the volume so that at 6 feet you are just at the point when an idling loco can be heard. I think this would be so much more realistic. Consider a motive power depot with maybe 6 or 8 locos idling at the same time. You wouldn't be able to hear yourself think with the as delivered volume. Also, with only 1 or 2 locos idling, if you start up a third, you can't hear the start up and it makes little difference to the overall sound. Most important, when a train passes you, you only hear the locomotive as it passes, then the train sound takes over (clickerty clack). Has anyone ever heard the train sound with locomotive set at the delivered volume? Didn't think so. With the volume set at a prototypical level then features on the layout start having an effect like the real thing. When a train goes into a cutting or under a bridge or behind a building, the effect on the sound is much more noticeable. Time to turn it down, I think. The experience will be so much better. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 And shovelling coal. You can't hear the fireman at work on a steam locomotive as it passes you. Get rid of it. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PhilH Posted March 11, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 11, 2015 Funny enough I was running some stuff on my oh-so-slowly progressing generic US switching layout, just to make sure it all still worked. All of the diesel locos are sound equipped and all set to what I thought was a reasonable volume. I found that after about 15 minutes the sounds really started to get on my nerves, so turned all the sounds off which made the session a much more relaxing affair. Now I'm wondering if a simple background soundtrack of ambient raiiway sounds played at a low level would suit me better. Must be getting old.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Funny enough I was running some stuff on my oh-so-slowly progressing generic US switching layout, just to make sure it all still worked. All of the diesel locos are sound equipped and all set to what I thought was a reasonable volume. I found that after about 15 minutes the sounds really started to get on my nerves, so turned all the sounds off which made the session a much more relaxing affair. Now I'm wondering if a simple background soundtrack of ambient raiiway sounds played at a low level would suit me better. Must be getting old.... Hello Phil, I've had the same uncomfortable feeling. Almost nausea. I put it down to the volume. I've stood outside of Gateshead shed with with a load of diesels idling and didn't feel like that. You should only be able to hear the loco as it passes with a backing track of a skylark or lowing cattle in the distance. The train passing should dominate but only for a short time then it's back to nature. The sound of nature that is. I'm not advocating that we all get undressed once the train is out of sight. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ColinK Posted March 11, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 11, 2015 Hi, I have the volume turned down very low on all my locos, so they are heard just like the above posts suggest. When I exhibited my layout last month I had planned to increase their volume slightly, however, I never got round to it. Nobody complained they were too loud, but a handfull of visitors thought they were too quiet. I guess that means the volume was about right. One thing that I think is important, is to match the volume of all the locos. I started by setting the volume of my class 20 to a level which was comfortable at home, then adjusted the volume of all other locos so the sound was about the same level. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 The sound of nature that is. I'm not advocating that we all get undressed once the train is out of sight. What someone does in the privacy of their home is their business - so turn it up as loud as you (and the neighbours/wife) can bare bear. But have to agree with other posts here that exhibitions the sound is almost always far too loud and only serves to drive me away from appreciating the modelling on the layout. The worst thing is the sudden switch off of sound as a loco enters the fiddle yard while you can still hear another one ticking over as it is waiting to be let out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted March 11, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 11, 2015 What someone does in the privacy of their home is their business - so turn it up as loud as you (and the neighbours/wife) can bare bear. But have to agree with other posts here that exhibitions the sound is almost always far too loud and only serves to drive me away from appreciating the modelling on the layout. The worst thing is the sudden switch off of sound as a loco enters the fiddle yard while you can still hear another one ticking over as it is waiting to be let out. Tricky one when they enter the fiddle yard. However if there are enough other sound locos on the layout it's not quite so noticeable. At shows All ours are turned down especially the bells and we try not to use them all the tine we are switching and if I find done left on I will look it up on JMRI slot monitor and switch it off (not always easy to spot which loco it is without slot monitor running). The tricky bit is setting a vlolume suitable for all venues. Some they are too quiet whilst if in a small classroom the are probably too loud. The beauty of the Surroundtraxx under board system is That all locos can be turned down or up with just one volume knob so we can adjust the round throughout the day depending on how noisy the show is at a particular time. Unfortunately this system needs Digitrax decoders (or at least the transponding function decoder) and the Digitrax command station plus sounds are generally only suitable for USA outline. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 . The worst thing is the sudden switch off of sound as a loco enters the fiddle yard while you can still hear another one ticking over as it is waiting to be let out. No need for for any sudden switch off of sound when a loco enters a fiddle yard, or for a number of locos ticking over in the yard awaiting their next turn of duty ! The Loksound 4 has an adjustable fade-out feature that can be used on an F key to fade the sound down or to silence if required, as the loco leaves the scenic section and enters the fiddle yard. It can then sit in silence, although the sound is still active - (but silent) ready for the loco's next use, on leaving the fiddle yard the fade can be cancelled by switching off whatever F key is used the sound will then fade up to the original volume level as it re-enters the scenic area. A very useful feature, and good for tunnels also etc when set to 50/60% fade. Some Zimo decoders also have a fade feature, but I'm not that familiar on how it's works or is implemented - but I'm hoping P Chetter will be along and enlighten us all in that respect - Lol HTH Ken Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassey jones Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 What volume......? Two factures how large the layout is and how far away are you from it. As for fade out, laws of physics take care of that as loco moves away from you........again depending how big your layout is...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 What volume......? Two factures how large the layout is and how far away are you from it. As for fade out, laws of physics take care of that as loco moves away from you........again depending how big your layout is...... I have had the pleasure of attending an operating day at Roy Jackson's Retford. At about 70 feet long it is genuinely awesome. My abiding memory is to see a train come into view which was so far away I couldn't recognise what type of locomotive was at the front. At 70 feet that equates to about a scale mile. Are you suggesting that you should turn up the volume so you can hear every sound at that distance? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauliebanger Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 No need for for any sudden switch off of sound when a loco enters a fiddle yard, or for a number of locos ticking over in the yard awaiting their next turn of duty ! The Loksound 4 has an adjustable fade-out feature that can be used on an F key to fade the sound down or to silence if required, as the loco leaves the scenic section and enters the fiddle yard. It can then sit in silence, although the sound is still active - (but silent) ready for the loco's next use, on leaving the fiddle yard the fade can be cancelled by switching off whatever F key is used the sound will then fade up to the original volume level as it re-enters the scenic area. A very useful feature, and good for tunnels also etc when set to 50/60% fade. Some Zimo decoders also have a fade feature, but I'm not that familiar on how it's works or is implemented - but I'm hoping P Chetter will be along and enlighten us all in that respect - Lol HTH Ken Ken, You rub the lamp, and I appear, Oh Master. All ZIMO sound decoders have had a 'fade all sounds' feature for as long as I can remember. This was designed to overcome exactly the problems outlined by earlier contributors. Of course, providing such functionality is one thing, getting operators to use them appropriately is another. Unlike the ESU system you describe above, you can adjust the decay rate but it always fades completely to mute, so no messing about, just hit the 'Mute' button once.(usually F19 in my projects). An alternative use of this feature is to set the decay rate to several seconds, then as the loco moves away from you, hit Mute and the fading sound replicates the way sounds recede normally. When the loco is travelling towards you, cancelling the Mute button will allow the sound to rise in volume as the loco approaches, then Mute againg as it passes and disappears into the distance with the sound fading gently. However, there is also a proper a volume adjustment which will turn it down with one F key or turn it up with another to achieve the desired balance. I usually have these on F27 and F28, safely out of the way, but accessible if needed. This enables any overall volume between silence and full power to be requested at any time, even whilst running. However, not all ZIMO sound projects are created equal. Caveat Emptor. Kind regards, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunmar Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I agree the location can sometimes dictate the volume - when at home I usually have it set at around 60. On the subject of shows I imagine my audience are looking over a fence and across a field and set the volume based on the scale distance they are from the loco. No I dont measure it out it's only approx. What I cant stand is the constant noise coming from the fiddle yard from stationary loco's. When I was operating Kinlochewe the sound was faded out as soon as the loco left the scenic area and was switched on just as it was entering the scenic area. Ken you mentioned that the Loksound has a fade out on the F key - where can I find this. I know SWD fit this as standard but what about the others ? Bill. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 My abiding memory is to see a train come into view which was so far away I couldn't recognise what type of locomotive was at the front. I have that problem with nearly all diesels, even on small layouts. Yes, of course the "problem" of sound is very much relative to the size of the layout and the distance the observer/listener is from the object. But (OK I'm guessing) most of our layouts are pretty small (and even smaller for those exhibited). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBAGE Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I have that problem with nearly all diesels, even on small layouts. Yes, of course the "problem" of sound is very much relative to the size of the layout and the distance the observer/listener is from the object. But (OK I'm guessing) most of our layouts are pretty small (and even smaller for those exhibited). I think the only problem of DCC sound is the volume. The volume has nothing to do with the size of the layout. The size of the locomotive is fixed, based on the scale used. If it were possible, would we change the size of the locomotive depending on how far away it was so that even at 70 feet (scale mile) you could still see that it was a deltic? Then why should we adjust the volume based on the size of the layout or how far the locomotive is away? It is only my opinion and we will all run our layouts the way we want but surely we should give some thought to scale sound. Once the sound is set to a scale level, there is no reason to change it. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 12, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 12, 2015 Ken you mentioned that the Loksound has a fade out on the F key - where can I find this. I know SWD fit this as standard but what about the others ? Bill. It doesn't come switched on as standard I'm afraid. If the soundfile creator hasn't included it in their setup then you need to do it in the function mapping. It's easy with a lokprogrammer but no idea how without it as it would mean several cvs I suspect. I usually find a naff sound like coupling and replace it with the volume control and then just double tap the relevant F button. Useful at shows when it goes quieter too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Is it on legobiffmans sound decoders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 12, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 12, 2015 Is it on legobiffmans sound decoders. It doesn't appear on the lists on the DC Kits website, if you're lucky he might pick up on it and include it on one of the not used Function buttons. http://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/shop/dcc_digital_loco_sounds/diesel_electric_digital_loco_sounds_includes_the_all_new_xl_v4_decoder_/class_33_legomanbiffo_now_with_all_new_interactive_features.php Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 It is only my opinion and we will all run our layouts the way we want but surely we should give some thought to scale sound. Once the sound is set to a scale level, there is no reason to change it. The problem is that "sound" does not scale. (It does not consist of purely linear elements) - just like colour, light, mass Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted March 12, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 12, 2015 The problem is that "sound" does not scale. (It does not consist of purely linear elements) - just like colour, light, mass Its all too loud for Kenton - thats why he has his fingers in his ears Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 It doesn't appear on the lists on the DC Kits website, if you're lucky he might pick up on it and include it on one of the not used Function buttons. http://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/shop/dcc_digital_loco_sounds/diesel_electric_digital_loco_sounds_includes_the_all_new_xl_v4_decoder_/class_33_legomanbiffo_now_with_all_new_interactive_features.php I contacted Bif about this option some time ago, when there was a discussion/thread about the "elusive" fade feature on SWD decoders using F1. Biff was going to look into it as time permitted, but he is a very busy boy ! and AFAIK it's not yet set up on his decoders - but i'm sure Bif will come along and advise on this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tractor_37260 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Ken you mentioned that the Loksound has a fade out on the F key - where can I find this. I know SWD fit this as standard but what about the others ? Bill. Hi Bill Some SWD decoders do have a fade feature on F1. It works well, but this option that can be set up on a Loksound 4 to any spare F key is actually more useful. Ideally using a Lokprogammer is the easiest way to set it up. It's a logical function (fade out sound) that can be set to any spare F key, once set up, the amount % of fade can then be adjusted via a CV . Once set, pressing the selected F Key (latched mode) fades down the sound to the pre-set % of master volume or silence if required. On releasing the F key the sound will then fade back up to the original volume, it works when the loco is moving or stopped. It's a very useful feature. If you don't have a Lokprogrammer, and wish to try it out, let me know what (spare) F key you plan to use, and I'll advise you what CV's to change. HTH Ken Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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