Rails Announce OO 18000 Gas Turbine Locomotive

[No Decorum]

On 01/10/2021 at 14:33, John ks said:

Excuse me if i am being a little pedantic but while the spec (copied from an email I received recently for the 18100 , E1000 & E2001) does say "all 4 axles "  the rest of the spec indicates  "Powered wheels on outer axles of each bogie " which is common with Heljans practice of having the centre wheels of 6 wheel bogies unpowered (eg class 47 & EM2)

 

 

Model Specification Include:

• Five pole motor driving all four axles (two on each bogie) with flywheels
• Powered wheels on outer axles of each bogie 
• 21-pin DCC socket with easy access
• Separately fitted wire handrails and sandpipes
• Spoked wheels
• Etched grilles
• Sprung OLEO buffers
• Flush glazing
• NEM coupler pockets
• Lighting: As per 18000. Two warm white headlights at front (lower left and lower right) in direction of travel and one red tail light at rear (lower centre). Including function (DC and DCC) to switch off tail light when hauling a train. 
• Warm white Cab lights. Including function to switch on/off.
• Separate engine room lights

 

John

Let’s compromise and settle on five-wheel bogies.

[gwrrob]

19 hours ago, TrevorP1 said:

I’m not sure what this actually means @gwrrob but I wouldn’t worry just yet.

 

Thanks @TrevorP1 and if it goes t*t's up I can always run a proper Castle instead. Your running on tighter curves has cheered me up though.

[Ian Hargrave]

Someone please refresh my memory. What dimension is 3rd radius ?

[Ian Hargrave]

6 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Someone please refresh my memory. What dimension is 3rd radius ?

Answering my own question it’s 505mm. Surely it can negotiate that ?

[cctransuk]

3 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Answering my own question it’s 505mm. Surely it can negotiate that ?

 

505mm. = 20" / 1'-8"; that's a pretty tight radius for 18000, I'd have thought.

 

CJI.

[Pteremy]

Mine has yet to arrive so I cannot comment from actual experience. But - and I can only say this in hindsight - the unusually deep sides to the prototype would appear to make it very difficult to make an accurate, tight radius friendly model. 

[Ian Hargrave]

27 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

505mm. = 20" / 1'-8"; that's a pretty tight radius for 18000, I'd have thought.

 

CJI.

Apologies.Yes of course it is.   Ok  mistake because I’m not at home. Mind now cleared. Thinking off piste  the comfortable radius should be 36”. 

[charliepetty]

On 08/10/2021 at 18:16, boxbrownie said:

So what was the ohm rating of the original speaker, did you test/measure it?

 

Are the replacements wired parallel or series?

 

Amazing the amount of space inside that model, very reassuring.

The speakers are identical to the speakers fitted too the Realtrack Models Class 156 DMUs, these are 8 Ohms and are made in the same factory in China.  Realtrack Models is part of the DC Kits group of companies (Charlie Petty/DCKits/Legomanbiffo) so we were involved with Neil (Wheeltappers) to get his brilliant sounds into these 18000 models as we financed and organised the decoders from ESU for Neil.  We have done the same on the NER Railcar from Rails which is running a tad late due to no fault of Rails.

 

Please note, even though wheeltappers are currently on Holiday we at DCKits have these in stock and are sending them out as we speak.

https://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=68&product_id=1873

 

Charlie

Edited October 11, 2021 by charliepetty

[MG 7305]

On 08/10/2021 at 17:09, mjcbasingstoke said:

My question regards the accessory pack which contains items which I have no idea where to fit, any suggestions?

If you look at the silver bogie frame on the locomotive from underneath you will see 4 holes in each rounded corner.  The long elongated silver U shaped details fit into 2 of these each, going from left to right.  If you look at the side on picture on the front of the box you can see that the ones with the slightly longer verticals (with a bolted 90 degrees change from vertical to horizontal) go towards the buffers and the others (with a simple bend of 90 degrees) go towards the centre of the locomotive.  The small silver U shaped details are steps which fit below the cab doors in the body from underneath.  Once again there are 2 small holes for them to be glued into if you look from underneath.  They do not go straight down but have a bias outwards.  Please see photograph in Kevin Robertson's book on the GWR gas turbines page 110 which is the best I can find.

 

Yes, I know, it would have helped if.....

 

Julian

[MG 7305]

On 09/10/2021 at 20:17, Trev1073 said:

I have fitted a chip and headlights / taillights work fine but no sign of the cab lights or engine room lights. Pretty sure these were not evident on DC either. I am using a Zimo MX638D decoder and all the dip switches are on. 

Hmm.  I am glad that I am not the only one to struggle here.  I too have fitted a Zimo decoder and no sign of the cab or engine room lights.  I do not feel that this is a real issue for me as I would never use them.  The head and tail lights are, I think, a little eccentric with the Zimo.  Order of batting is to select locomotive and then the lights (FO, F1 and F2).  But to make them actually come on I need to change the direction of travel of the locomotive!  Once this is done they work perfectly well and the rear light is directional (only coming on when it is the trailing end) and can be switched off if required if coupled to a train.  Once the lights are on I can change direction of travel and the lights behave as I would expect, but still no cab or engine room lights.

 

Best regards

 

Julian

[MG 7305]

Having said all that, it is a cracking model and will gee up my all GWR layout!

[toboldlygo]

Mine runs perfectly well on 4th Radius track too. 2nd Radius is a bit iffy, but it did re-rail itself.

[toboldlygo]

Have Rails like Hattons (on the Beyer Garretts) have got the Early Crest wrong on one-side - shouldn't they be forward facing  on both sides as they were on every steam loco they were applied to?

Edited October 12, 2021 by toboldlygo

[Trev1073]

If anyone else is struggling with the lights on DCC using a Zimo decoder I have solved it by changing the MX638D to a MX638C. You need to change/ enter 3 into CV8. This seems to relate to logic or full function ??? It does however work.

 

Trev

[bubbles2]

1 hour ago, MG 7305 said:

If you look at the silver bogie frame on the locomotive from underneath you will see 4 holes in each rounded corner.  The long elongated silver U shaped details fit into 2 of these each, going from left to right.  If you look at the side on picture on the front of the box you can see that the ones with the slightly longer verticals (with a bolted 90 degrees change from vertical to horizontal) go towards the buffers and the others (with a simple bend of 90 degrees) go towards the centre of the locomotive.  The small silver U shaped details are steps which fit below the cab doors in the body from underneath.  Once again there are 2 small holes for them to be glued into if you look from underneath.  They do not go straight down but have a bias outwards.  Please see photograph in Kevin Robertson's book on the GWR gas turbines page 110 which is the best I can find.

 

Yes, I know, it would have helped if.....

 

Julian

Any chance of a photo or two?

Edited October 11, 2021 by bubbles2
Spelling.

[dibber25]

55 minutes ago, toboldlygo said:

Rails like Hattons (on the Beyer Garretts) have got the Early Crest wrong on one-side - they should be forward facing toward (cab 1) on both sides 

The model follows, correctly, the photographs which I supplied to Heljan from my research into the gas turbines for Trains Illustrated back in the 1980s. The early crest lion DID face left on both sides of the locomotive. (Refs - BR official photo and Times newspaper photo) (CJL)

[Roy Langridge]

5 minutes ago, dibber25 said:

The model follows, correctly, the photographs which I supplied to Heljan from my research into the gas turbines for Trains Illustrated back in the 1980s. The early crest lion DID face left on both sides of the locomotive. (Refs - BR official photo and Times newspaper photo) (CJL)

 

And in support of that Chris, a simple google of "18000 gas turbine" will provide the evidence with quite a few images of both sides having left facing crests.

Roy

[toboldlygo]

59 minutes ago, dibber25 said:

The model follows, correctly, the photographs which I supplied to Heljan from my research into the gas turbines for Trains Illustrated back in the 1980s. The early crest lion DID face left on both sides of the locomotive. (Refs - BR official photo and Times newspaper photo) (CJL)

 

There's also photo's where it didn't on google

[Zero Gravitas]

1 hour ago, toboldlygo said:

 

There's also photo's where it didn't on google

 

Which means you’re perfectly at liberty to apply a new crest on one side if that suits the period you are modelling :-)

 

Or if that’s not something you want to do, then you could always commission Rails to produce a version that meets your precise needs.

 

TBH, if that’s the only thing you can find to complain about, then I think Rails have done a pretty good job.

 

Yes, I know. It’s late, I’m grumpy - but the fact that we actually have an RTR model (and a good one at that) of such a prototype, and where RMWeb members had such welcome input to Rails to get it right, means that to me this sort of comment is not helpful.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Zero Gravitas

[dibber25]

1 hour ago, toboldlygo said:

 

There's also photo's where it didn't on google

So, RAILS haven't actually got it wrong, they've merely selected not to produce one minor livery variant which wasn't among the references with which they were supplied. (CJL)

[toboldlygo]

6 minutes ago, dibber25 said:

So, RAILS haven't actually got it wrong, they've merely selected not to produce one minor livery variant which wasn't among the references with which they were supplied. (CJL)

 

Agreed Rails haven't got the model wrong, I still can't believe it's been made by Heljan - it's beautifully made.

 

Heljan have put Early Crests on the wrong way round before, as I previously stated (and have put right on models for clients).

 

In the days before computers, it wasn't unusual for images to be mirrored in publications to suit. It's easy to spot on 18000 because of the windscreen wipers.

 

[peteskitchen]

Couple of observations of this model.

1st even on 3rd radius you can hear the mechanism rubbing on the inside of the body, it also severely slows down. On 4th radius and higher it runs like a dream. Smooth, quiet and powerful. 

2nd is the lighting. The single red light works as it should, however only the outer two lower white lights work. The roof light appears to work when the cab lights are on but I think its just the cab light filtering through the hole. The middle centre white light doesn't work at all. 

 3rdly the bogies are quite a work of art. There is very little movement in the frame, but there is a subframe inside holding the axles that can also turns independently to the outer frames. 

 I'm glad that my layout has no curves tighter than 4th radius. I've already ordered 18100 lol! 

[Roy Langridge]

6 hours ago, toboldlygo said:

 

There's also photo's where it didn't on google

Yes, but the point is your post (including the head banging) was simply wrong and 2 minutes of research could have told you  that rather than make a wrong assumption/statement. 
 

Roy

[MG 7305]

11 hours ago, Trev1073 said:

If anyone else is struggling with the lights on DCC using a Zimo decoder I have solved it by changing the MX638D to a MX638C.

Thank you for this pointer.

[Pteremy]

The issue about the crest has come up before. The heraldic convention is that it should face to the left. But until the College of Heralds objected the crests were often applied so that they faced 'forward'. I am sure this is covered in various sources. But the one I have checked back on is p7-8 of the 1960 Railway Observer. There is no specific date given for the CoH intervention, merely that it was 'ruled recently'. So, as if often the case, photographic evidence would be the best guide.