The "Ghan" 3 hours of Slow TV

[melmerby]

Hi all

On BBC 4 Sunday 28th October is a programme called:

The Ghan, Australia's Greatest Train Journey

 

It is three hours starting at 2000, lasts until 2300 and has no commentary, just captions of interesting facts every so often.

 

The real journey is 54 hours!

 

Keith

Edited October 25, 2018 by melmerby

[chrisf]

Thanks for the head up, Keith.  As some know, I will be on this train between 13th and 15th February.

 

Chris

[jukebox]

You're getting the highlight version.

 

https://www.sbs.com.au/programs/the-ghan

 

It was so popular when broadcast here, we got a director's-cut 17-hr version the Sunday afterward!

 

https://www.sbs.com.au/guide/article/2018/01/10/17-hours-ghan-bigger-ever

 

I had it playing on my TV, and the family would dip in and out to watch various parts across the day.

 

Enjoy!

 

Scott

[Zomboid]

If it went down that well then I guess it's inevitable that they'll do the Indian Pacific next

[Gwiwer]

It is indeed a long slow journey and while the scenery changes significantly across the continent that change is barely noticeable hour-by-hour whilst trundling through it.

 

There are reasons why Australia's long-haul rail cruises are slow.  First and foremost this is not a public transport option - they are top-dollar rail cruises; those few bargain-priced seats aimed at the backpacker market have now been withdrawn making the cheapest fare for an end-to-end trip several thousand dollars.  The rail experience offers optional coach tours during some extended servicing stops.  The Ghan waits several hours at Alice Springs for example and for an additional sum it is possible to enjoy a coach tour of the MacDonnell Ranges and surrounding areas, though not reaching that famous rock in the desert which is around a six-hour drive away.

 

The infrastructure is designed and built to be a freight railway.  Typically it carries lengthy and medium-speed freights with the Ghan (and Indian Pacific) being weekly events, twice-weekly in high season, and not terribly important in the scheme of things.  To this end there is no proper passenger facility in Darwin and the "station" at Alice Springs is a long yard with buildings and hard surfaces rather than dirt but no actual platform for the most part.

 

The traction is not designed to run at high speeds and neither is the ageing rolling stock.  And when one is engaged in the silver-service of champagne meals one does not want to have too many track jolts and coupler snatches.  There are also some lengthy waits in loops to cross trains in the opposing direction; these can be hours long though they try to keep the Ghan and IP moving close to schedule and hold freights when possible.  

 

Australian weather conditions can make high speed rail travel less safe than in European and other nations where it is commonplace.  Dust storms, unfenced track in a land where camels, kangaroos and other wildlife roam freely, torrential rains causing unexpected washouts and flooding and the 50C heat of an outback day can all take their toll on the infrastructure.  Better to roll along at a lower and safer speed than to hare through the desert at 200kmh and hit a broken rail or a wandering camel at that speed.

 

The operator of the Ghan and Indian Pacific also runs the Overland, the sole remaining passenger rail link between Melbourne and Adelaide. These two cities are far closer than any on their two other trains and this twice-weekly service is not marketed as a land cruise.  In fact it is barely marketed at all and the operator has been accused of intentionally running it down in order to withdraw it.  It survives by a thread supported by both State governments, South Australia and Victoria, whose towns it serves.  This too is a slow journey taking around 12 hours for 700 or so kilometres.  Notwithstanding which it is frequently late by an hour or two and has gained the nickname of "The Overdue" with some reason.  

 

In all cases anyone seriously wishing to travel between the main cities served would fly.  Even the regional towns along the way have air links with few exceptions.  If you really must travel at ground level there are faster and more frequent road coaches plying between the main cities, though they are few and far between heading north of Adelaide to Alice and Darwin simply because there are so few people and so little demand.

[melmerby]

The points raised by Gwiver are what one would expect from such a large country.

Long distance travel by air would be the norm and only the larger cities supporting anything like a decent passenger railway.

This mirrors the US where long distance passenger travel is very much a minority sport supported meagrely by the government through it's Amtrak company.

Endless double stack boxes on two mile + long trains is the main bread & butter of the train operators in the US and no doubt Aussie rail freight is also pretty healthy.

 

Keith

[hmrspaul]

Not done the Ghan, however there seem to be a lot of aussies whom prefer to travel by train. We did the Indian Pacific from Perth to Adelaide and didn't talk to anyone else that was a foreign tourist, and the train was well loaded. https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/indianpacific The highlight was seeing a wild Dingo. The bar steward did mention some of the expense of running these trains - the hire of the loco alone was considerable.

 

Likewise the Melbourne to Sydney "Country link" HST was well loaded, despite it taking about 12 hours or so - but it does serve some sizeable towns along the way. Railway does allow for better understanding of the country than just flying over it - and this journey was very reasonably priced.

 

 

Paul

[brianusa]

Long distance trains these days are an anachronism, a left over from the glory days.  In the Wild West they were a definite asset compared to a Conestoga wagon and were probably so in Australia for a similar reason or any big country; Russia and the Trans Siberian.  But in this day and age the tracks are best left to the long freights which are more important.  As mentioned there is not a lot to see in the Australian hinterland, nor in Siberia and not in the US until West of the Rockies, unless one likes prairies and steppes.  Be thankful that all this can now be traversed in a few boring hours by air instead of a few days.

 

Brian,

Edited October 27, 2018 by brianusa

[Phil Parker]

If it went down that well then I guess it's inevitable that they'll do the Indian Pacific next

 

Been there, done that:

 

 

For me, the trip 26 hour by rail was far more interesting that flying. There isn't a better way to see the country so fast. Living in the UK, we don't experience the wilderness in the Aussie sense. Speed wasn't an issue as I was on holiday, if you want to rush about, take the plane and don't take a holiday.

[Gwiwer]

 

 

the Melbourne to Sydney "Country link" HST was well loaded, despite it taking about 12 hours or so - but it does serve some sizeable towns along the way

Unlike the Ghan and Indian Pacific the XPT is a public transport service.  It is run by the Government of New South Wales though receives some financial support from the State of Victoria in respect of the twice-daily Sydney - Melbourne service which runs through both states.  

 

Very like the Ghan and IP the XPT is severely hampered by the tortuous gradients and curvature of the route in places (including a spiral at Bethungra on the Melbourne run and another at Border Loop on the Brisbane run) and the fact that the regional railways are essentially for freight.  The same weather and environmental conditions apply; if you go too fast on steel rails on a searing hot day the rails may buckle or snap under the train or it may hit a stray animal or previously-broken rail.  Although derived from the British HST its operating environment is completely different and line speeds are seldom much above 100kmh (around 62mph) with a maximum of 160kmh (100mph) on favourable stretches.  Accordingly the trip of around 1000kms is fearfully slow.  Road is faster.  Air is much faster city centre to city centre even allowing for transfers, check-ins and such like.  The Sydney - Melbourne air corridor has flights between two and four times every hour taking 60 - 80 minutes according to conditions.  

 

The XPT cannot compete with air on time and not always on price.  Many trains are well loaded but the consist has been cut from 8 to 6 or 5 cars over the years to match falling demand generally.  n addition many users are taking advantage of NSW generous senior citizen discounts which, in addition to state-supported discount fares, allows (or at least did allow, if things have changed) an annual trip for $5 anywhere.  So the well-filled train may not be attracting so much revenue and is heavily subsidised by NSW.

 

XPT sets still serve the key long-haul routes centred on Sydney.  Twice a day (of which one is overnight) to Melbourne, once daily to Dubbo in the mid-west, three times daily north to Grafton of which two extend to Casino whence one runs through to Brisbane and the other connects for that city by way of road coaches via Byron Bay and other major towns.  Again some of those trips are overnight; Sydney - Brisbane takes around 14 hours for example. 

 

Use at intermediate towns and cities varies but end-to-end traffic is more or less confined to seniors using heavily-discounted tickets and backpackers out to see the land rather than the air.  

[luckymucklebackit]

Caption said 44 coaches, I counted 36 at the crossing - Train divided in section!!!!!

 

Good viewing!

 

Jim

[Steamport Southport]

So we've got three hours of an Australian train rumbling through the desert. Yet when we had a British branch line journey on for an hour we were told that it had to be Flying Scotsman as nobody would watch anything else.

 

 

 

 

 

Jason

[Gwiwer]

Caption said 44 coaches, I counted 36 at the crossing - Train divided in section!!!!!

 

Good viewing!

 

Jim

 

Rear 8 dropped off in the loop for Coober Pedy because the front 36 wouldn't fit in the platform

[Phil Parker]

So we've got three hours of an Australian train rumbling through the desert. Yet when we had a British branch line journey on for an hour we were told that it had to be Flying Scotsman as nobody would watch anything else.

 

 

 

 

 

Jason

1-How do you know anyone is watching the Ghan?

 

2-You may not like Scotsman but the general public does so if you want lots of viewers, which loco do you want?

[Hroth]

1-How do you know anyone is watching the Ghan?

 

2-You may not like Scotsman but the general public does so if you want lots of viewers, which loco do you want?

1: I watched the first 90 minutes, the Electric Monk is watching the rest for me.  I'll catch up with it in segments, its the railway equivalent of watching Andras Schiff playing Bachs "The Well-tempered Clavier" on the Proms...  The amazing thing is the sheer amount of "nothingness"!

 

2: The best (and probably the most embarassing) thing about the film of the Flying Scotsman on the SVR was the stall at Bridgenorth, otherwise it was an interesting account of driving a steam locomotive.  One could wish for a more "appropriate" loco for the line, but the commercial necessity for it to be Flying Scotsman is undeniable.

Edited October 28, 2018 by Hroth

[Steamport Southport]

1-How do you know anyone is watching the Ghan?

 

2-You may not like Scotsman but the general public does so if you want lots of viewers, which loco do you want?

 

I am and so is the DVD recorder.

 

How do you know nobody is watching it? By accounts above (post three) it was popular when shown in Australia.

 

It's currently being shown on Sunday prime time BBC FOUR. A channel that gets quite good viewing figures.

 

 

Seeing as the programme last year was set on the Severn Valley Railway and supposed to be about branch lines then why wasn't a GWR branch line locomotive used? The railway itself has at least a dozen suitable locomotives. Prairie, 14xx, Pannier, Mogul or for a bigger locomotive a Manor. Even a DMU would have been preferable.

 

Or is it another case of the BBCs constant dumbing down and treating their viewers like idiots?

 

 

 

Jason

[Phil Parker]

I am watching it, admittedly while working on a model boat. Your posting suggested no-one would watch without Scotsman.

 

Scotsman was a good choice for the SVR film. No one said that absolutely no one would watch without it, just more people would watch with it. Ratings matter.

[Dava]

I remember a much more interesting TV program on the Ghan a few decades back when it went to Alice Springs. It may have been Great Rail Journeys in the early 80's.

 

This program was very monotonous and had little to say about the history or wider context or anything at all. Even the Salties you apparently find in Northern Australian rivers weren't mentioned so they didn't go out of their way to make it interesting.

 

Dava

[Hroth]

I remember a much more interesting TV program on the Ghan a few decades back when it went to Alice Springs. It may have been Great Rail Journeys in the early 80's.

 

This program was very monotonous and had little to say about the history or wider context or anything at all. Even the Salties you apparently find in Northern Australian rivers weren't mentioned so they didn't go out of their way to make it interesting.

 

Dava

I think thats the point about "Slow TV".

 

The BBC have broadcast several programmes in this genre, the Canal one didn't have much to say about the history of the canal system or the problems encountered when restoring the flight of locks the boat was passing through, the Bus Trip through the Yorkshire Dales didn't examine the transport problems of rural communities, the Sleigh Trip didn't enlighten us about the way of life of the Sammi people, and the SVR didn't have much to say about the Flying Scotsman or the SVR either.

 

None of the programmes were intended to.  They were just films with no music, no superfluous commentary, no gurning celebs. Just the usual environmental sounds and the view, but they are instructive if you care to look.

[chrisf]

I like the format of this programme, as I did with others - they did one about a rural bus route IIRC.  My interest is, of course, that of a future passenger, albeit in the opposite direction.  I now have more of a feel for what the train is like and the territory through which it passes.  It is good to know, for instance, that passengers are not confined to their cabins for the whole trip [where did I get that idea from?] but not so good to know that I will be eating crocodile!

 

Chris

[jukebox]

I like the format of this programme, as I did with others - they did one about a rural bus route IIRC.  My interest is, of course, that of a future passenger, albeit in the opposite direction.  I now have more of a feel for what the train is like and the territory through which it passes.  It is good to know, for instance, that passengers are not confined to their cabins for the whole trip [where did I get that idea from?] but not so good to know that I will be eating crocodile!

 

Chris

 

 

Eating the crocodile in the dining car is, I'm sure, optional (but surely also worth being adventurous about?)

 

You should, however, avoid reversing roles at all costs, should you decide to take a swim before you start your journey.

[eastwestdivide]

Strangely soporific. I know the clocks had just gone back, and my body clock was out of sync, so I was nearly nodding off after 25 mins or so of rumbling through open country. Turned over to see two aged actors negotiating the Anderton Boat Lift. Also slow TV!

[Southernman46]

The real journey is 54 hours!

Easy ...................................

 

Now Waterloo to Crewkerne via SWR on a strike day is a REAL ordeal ..............................

[Hroth]

One thing that amused me was when the driver picked up the train intercom when they were approaching the South Australia/Northern Territory border and told Bruce they were 10 minutes off.  Its a mercy he didn't say "G'day Bruce"!

[Zomboid]

Eating the crocodile in the dining car is, I'm sure, optional (but surely also worth being adventurous about?

A bit rubbery and fishy tasting the time I had it (though this was in Bristol rather than on board an Australian train). Wouldn't bother, personally.