Bits of LMS Crab in deepest Lincs

[RANGERS]

I came across an LMS Crab in a very rural area of Lincolnshire a few weeks ago, the wheels had been removed from the frames and running plate and the cab was separate from the rest of it but it was unmistakable. I'll keep the location under wraps to keep the metal fairies away but I'm more than a little curious as to what it was doing there?

 

Presumably it was there for some part of restoration but it was an odd place to find it, any information would I'm sure suppress my curiosity.

 

[cctransuk]

I came across an LMS Crab in a very rural area of Lincolnshire a few weeks ago, the wheels had been removed from the frames and running plate and the cab was separate from the rest of it but it was unmistakable. I'll keep the location under wraps to keep the metal fairies away but I'm more than a little curious as to what it was doing there?

 

Presumably it was there for some part of restoration but it was an odd place to find it, any information would I'm sure suppress my curiosity.

 

It's 42859; Google will provide details.

 

Sounds like a lost cause from what I've just read.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[m0rris]

Its part of a long running saga which only ever seems to get worse for the loco... it was formerly stored,long term, at RAF Binbrook. However, things got a little strange and the net result was someone, not the owner, started breaking it up for scrap, the police got involved and now the largest selection of its mortal remains is what you came across. Its unlikely to ever steam again unless a millionaire takes up its cause.

[RANGERS]

Just about sums up what I came across, it was in a much worse state than I'd guess it ever was in its time at Barry. Very sad to see it but given its current state, I'd doubt it'll ever be in a complete state again, let alone steam.

[DOCJACOB]

For the record it also spent some time in Hull Dairycoates depot mid 80's, quietly rusting in a siding there. Ended up in Binbrook when Daircoates was cleared. I do have an image somewhere from an openday, and another "grab" shot while my wife was driving along A63.

[Catkins]

It is rather sad to see what has happened to this loco, and without the injection of some cash or compensation, the remains are only useful for spares or scrapping.

 

I mention compensation because who ever started to break up the loco was acting unlawfully, and there is an on going investigation into this.

[gismorail]

Was at Binbrook yesterday collecting a load in my wagon. Just by chance I noted a set of locomotive driving wheels just sitting in an open yard area near to where I was loading. I walked across to inspect them and the loco number stamped on the centre of one of the wheels was 42859 the wheels have been treated to a coat of black paint as well as having been well greased and marked up as to the position of the wheels as there were on the loco  LF LM LR etc. No sign of any other bits of the crab anywhere to be seen ....

Lots of bits of aircraft around (Sea Harrier alongside Hanger 3) and was told that there area still some Lightning airframes in some over-grown areas by the old runway.

Very interesting place almost in a time warp !!!!!

[Dava]

The boiler was apparently scrapped by the owner, say goodbye to this one , fortunately the ELR has the right idea

 

Dava

[gismorail]

Did wonder if the ELR were looking to rescue these wheel set as they appear to in a fair condition

[sir douglas]

I remember this in Railway magazine, which i can only remember vaguely.

 

its been going on over a year, theres a lot of legal and police issues involved, and the owner of the loco isnt allowed to move it because of rent problems with the land that it was on, half of it was illegally scrapped.

 

Regards, Sam.

[phil-b259]

Its a shame really though because you would think that a loco of that type (medium power good coal + water capacity) would be a useful (well more useful than yet another Bulleid Pacific) item on the Heritage railway scene.

[DavidH]

Did wonder if the ELR were looking to rescue these wheel set as they appear to in a fair condition

 

According to Steam Railway, if I recall, the owner has refused all approaches to sell. Mind you, that's only one side of the story and doesn't say what the approach was or how it was made.

 

The boiler was in an unrestorable state, so its scrapping makes no difference. At least, that is what was reported.

[Horsetan]

According to Steam Railway, if I recall, the owner has refused all approaches to sell. Mind you, that's only one side of the story and doesn't say what the approach was or how it was made.

To me, it is the classic situation of someone who had enough money to buy the hulk from Barry, but either not enough money to actually restore it, or an unwillingness to allow others to help for fear that he would lose control over his "pet". Or both. Whatever money he might have had in the fund has been well and truly spent on legal fees.

 

I think pride prevents him from admitting it, but he has to all intents and purposes lost any prospect of a working 42859.

 

This reminds me of the disappearance of 31065 for almost three decades - with parts scattered at Sellindge and Gamlingay - before its owner Esmond Lewis-Evans finally accepted help from the Bluebell Railway.

 

The boiler was in an unrestorable state, so its scrapping makes no difference. At least, that is what was reported.

42859 was thought to have firebox problems (see old copies of "The Barry List", etc.) which may explain why the ELR went for 42765 all those years ago. The boiler barrel itself was thought to be still usable.

[phil-b259]

42859 was thought to have firebox problems (see old copies of "The Barry List", etc.) which may explain why the ELR went for 42765 all those years ago. The boiler barrel itself was thought to be still usable.

 

Regardless of whether its the boiler barrel or the fire box or both, it makes no difference, it may well have been deemed 'unrepairable' 5, 10 or even 20 years ago but that doesn't mean it never will be. These days Heritage railways are doing things all sorts of things boiler repair wise that nobody thought possible back in the late 80s or early 90s. Had the crab boiler survived it might well have been salvageable in the years to come - as things stand (assuming what is in the public domain is true) the loco is likely never to run again.

[Enterprisingwestern]

Regardless of whether its the boiler barrel or the fire box or both, it makes no difference, it may well have been deemed 'unrepairable' 5, 10 or even 20 years ago but that doesn't mean it never will be. These days Heritage railways are doing things all sorts of things boiler repair wise that nobody thought possible back in the late 80s or early 90s. Had the crab boiler survived it might well have been salvageable in the years to come - as things stand (assuming what is in the public domain is true) the loco is likely never to run again.

 

Agree, not much of Tornado was available to refurbish?

 

Mike.

[Peter A Hall]

Comments on other forums suggest that much of what survives of 42859 is now located at the Lincolnshire Wolds Railway including the frames and wheels.  Not able to confirm this myself and no mention on Lincolnshire Wolds Railway website.  Anyone able to clarify? 

[APOLLO]

Found this on Google, scroll down a bit

 

http://www.rodcollins.com/wordpress/raf-binbrook-history-a-documented-visit-photographs

 

 

Such a waste.

 

Brit15

[Marshall5]

I presume this refers to the thread on National Preservation https://www.national-preservation.com/threads/lms-hughes-crab-42859.17817/page-27#post-2075212  According to the most recent posts one set of driving wheels is missing.  It is a long shot but could that be the set that Gismorail referred to in post 9.  If this set has been scrapped it makes restoration even more unlikely.

Ray.

[DOCJACOB]

If its at Lincolnshire Wolds Railway news to me.

 

But then I cant see further than wagons.

 

Last I heard some bits ended up in scrapyard over Skegness way and from recollection would have been interesting/challenging restoration anyway as firebox wasn't too clever.

Edited February 27, 2018 by DOCJACOB

[Dava]

It didnt have to end this way...13065 looked great at Loughborough last month.

 

 

Dava

 

[Davey]

I came across an LMS Crab in a very rural area of Lincolnshire a few weeks ago, the wheels had been removed from the frames and running plate and the cab was separate from the rest of it but it was unmistakable. I'll keep the location under wraps to keep the metal fairies away but I'm more than a little curious as to what it was doing there?

 

Presumably it was there for some part of restoration but it was an odd place to find it, any information would I'm sure suppress my curiosity.

 

Tell people it's GWR and they will fall over themselves clamouring to preserve it!!

[Steamport Southport]

Tell people it's GWR and they will fall over themselves clamouring to preserve it!!

 

Not really. There are plenty of neglected GWR locomotives unfortunately.

 

 

 

 

 

Jason

[Peter A Hall]

The current edition of STEAM RAILWAY reveals that the frames of 42859 at least are now located at the East Lancashire Railway and have been for a number of weeks.   How much else from the locomotive still survives and whether any other major components are also located at the East Lancs is not stated.  Confirmation that the boiler was scrapped is mentioned.

 

The report states that the frames were moved from Binbrook to Tuxford in 2013 which leads one to conclude that is where they have been until the recent relocation.  Enquiries earlier this year prior to finalisation of the eighteenth edition of 'Preserved Locomotives of British Railways' (Platform 5 Publishing) indicated that it was highly unlikely the frames were then at the Lincolnshire Wolds Railway or ever had been, 

[DOCJACOB]

You can change highly unlikely at LWR Ludborough to NEVER at LWR Ludborough

 

I think a few years back there was some very vague random thought of possibly moving her here, but that was when in much better state than current.