Edwardian Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 I'm not so sure. Given the LBSC Liveried E4 is now a bargain sale regular they might be thinking a small run at a premium price is a surer bet than a larger run on general release. I find it hard to belief that the equally exquisite MR compound is still around at knockdown prices several years after it's released. It must be an absolute nightmare being a manufacturer of such a niche product as RTR model railways to such a fickle market. It's more a (thankless) labour of love than a business model! If the SECR C Class was anything to go by (which wasn't limited to 504), a standard limited edition won't be enough. However, is Marsh Umber "pretty enough" for collectors? Although we don't know how many were made, the long hangover of the LSSCR-liveried E4s suggests that maybe it isn't. Limited or not, the additional tooling costs will also be shared between however many Bachmann turn out in early SR condition. John Much has been written of quantities of unwanted umber E4s and their knock down prices. I do not know how many were made compared with the fully lined C. I suspect far fewer of the latter were made. Though the umber E4 suffers by this comparison, I am not convinced it is a special case in the way often asserted. A couple of the box shifters have knocked it down to £80 for a time. But, it remains for sale at full or near full price alongside its olive green and black sisters on the books of most retailers for most of the time. It should not be singled out as a slow seller just because it wasn't a flash in the pan. More noticeable has been the way the first generation Hornby J15s were flogged off at £75 to make way for the next lot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted December 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 15, 2016 Much has been written of quantities of unwanted umber E4s and their knock down prices. I do not know how many were made compared with the fully lined C. I suspect far fewer of the latter were made. Though the umber E4 suffers by this comparison, I am not convinced it is a special case in the way often asserted. A couple of the box shifters have knocked it down to £80 for a time. But, it remains for sale at full or near full price alongside its olive green and black sisters on the books of most retailers for most of the time. It should not be singled out as a slow seller just because it wasn't a flash in the pan. More noticeable has been the way the first generation Hornby J15s were flogged off at £75 to make way for the next lot. I suspect that, for whatever reason(s), the E4 may be a bit of a slow seller whatever colour they paint it. Either that, or they just made too many. The J15 was, by no means, the only Hornby loco to be panic-discounted because subsequent runs of models followed too hard on the heels of the first. In a few cases, second tranche models were available at heavy discounts on release, too. I acquired a thoroughly inappropriate (for me) 72xx and an unplanned third S15 at greatly reduced prices thanks to Hornby's bad timing. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 I suspect that, for whatever reason(s), the E4 may be a bit of a slow seller whatever colour they paint it. Either that, or they just made too many. The J15 was, by no means, the only Hornby loco to be panic-discounted because subsequent runs of models followed too hard on the heels of the first. In a few cases, second tranche models were available at heavy discounts on release, too. I acquired a thoroughly inappropriate (for me) 72xx and an unplanned third S15 at greatly reduced prices thanks to Hornby's bad timing. John John, I suspect that you are right on all counts. There does not seem to me to be any basis for the belief that the umber E4 is significantly any less popular or slow selling than the other liveries. It may be, as you say, that too many of all were produced. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenGiraffe22 Posted December 15, 2016 Share Posted December 15, 2016 The main thing stopping me buying an LBSC E4 is even if I wanted it on a separate small layout, there is next to nothing rtr for it to pull... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tractionman Posted December 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 15, 2016 The main thing stopping me buying an LBSC E4 is even if I wanted it on a separate small layout, there is next to nothing rtr for it to pull... ok not quite RTR but almost: http://www.smallbrookstudio.co.uk/products/4569521210/4mm-IoW-Southern certainly a range to consider for something for the E4 to haul. the Smallbrook resin kits fit Dapol chassis so reasonably easy to assemble. all the best, Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 So, over the various web pictures and magazines, I believe I have clocked EPs of: - unrebuilt cab etc version - presumably to be the olive green release - rebuilt, presumably the BR Beachy Head and - early condition with bogie brakes. This latter is only useful for LBSC liveries, and, indeed, if not mistaken, pre-WW1 umber livery style, plus the photographic grey and grey and red undercoated versions hat ran for a time. Nothing has been announced that is compatible with this tooling variant. What's going on? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 1, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 1, 2017 (edited) So, over the various web pictures and magazines, I believe I have clocked EPs of: - unrebuilt cab etc version - presumably to be the olive green release - rebuilt, presumably the BR Beachy Head and - early condition with bogie brakes. This latter is only useful for LBSC liveries, and, indeed, if not mistaken, pre-WW1 umber livery style, plus the photographic grey and grey and red undercoated versions hat ran for a time. Nothing has been announced that is compatible with this tooling variant. What's going on? I'm tempted to say that either you're confused or they're confused - but photos suggest that you definitely aren't and I suspect they probably aren't either. So to a more likely explanation - The purpose of EP models is, as you know, to check the fit if parts and the really means all parts. So if a model is tooled and provision happens to be made for future expansion of the range with, say, an earlier livery version for the Collector's Club or a commissioner then those parts will come off the moulding machines and it's logical to test their fit. But a problem might arise if you either release, some someone snatches, a photo of those parts applied to an EP - especially if that EP is put on public display as iyt instantly either confuses folk or sets hares running about either inaccuracies or the possibility of another variation being likely to emerge in the future. So either they have been caught out (in various ways - choose your one to your satisfaction), or they let it slip out on purpose in order to see if anyone would notice, or the factory got it wrong. Hopefully I think they were probably just making 'passive' provision for a later addition to the range - however it might be sold. Edited January 1, 2017 by The Stationmaster Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted January 1, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 1, 2017 Indeed as Mike says an EP will often contain a mix of possible combination of parts, as well as an incorrect mix together on the same EP, that have been tooled, even those not yet announced as variants... At the end of the day it's the purpose of the EP! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Did I say I'd like one in malachite ? .... please Mr.Bachmann ...................... that would be just like the B.R. version but maybe with snifting valves ..... ................ I'll second that ! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 ............. and yesterday's announcements from Bachmann adise us that the Brighton atlantic is ..................................................................................... STILL in the drawing office at Barwell ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted January 9, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2017 ............. and yesterday's announcements from Bachmann adise us that the Brighton atlantic is ..................................................................................... STILL in the drawing office at Barwell ! I do not know where you have seen this but the press release we were given yesterday correctly states that the H2's are at the livery / artwork sample stage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 I do not know where you have seen this but the press release we were given yesterday correctly states that the H2's are at the livery / artwork sample stage. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/118606-Bachmann-announce-midland-1p-class-203-bep-buffet-car-vea-prestwin-and-carflat/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul.Uni Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/118606-Bachmann-announce-midland-1p-class-203-bep-buffet-car-vea-prestwin-and-carflat/ From that page: Artwork Stage (Barwell) 22T Double Bolster wagon (exclusively for TMC) 22T Plate wagon (exclusively for TMC) Class 438 / 491 4TC (exclusively for Kernow) WD Warflat SECR Birdcage coaches LBSCR H2 Class 4-4-2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 9, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2017 ............. and yesterday's announcements from Bachmann adise us that the Brighton atlantic is ..................................................................................... STILL in the drawing office at Barwell ! I really quite thought we'd seen samples on here, including the one with a very LBSC cab, prompting thoughts that a Pre-Grouping version might be in Bachmann's future. This is a very long way on from the drawing office stage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold NHY 581 Posted January 9, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2017 I do not know where you have seen this but the press release we were given yesterday correctly states that the H2's are at the livery / artwork sample stage. Agree. My understanding of 'Art work' is that livery samples are being produced for agreement..... Nearly there.... Rob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 February edition of Steam World has an article on the class. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted January 20, 2017 Share Posted January 20, 2017 I really quite thought we'd seen samples on here, including the one with a very LBSC cab, prompting thoughts that a Pre-Grouping version might be in Bachmann's future. This is a very long way on from the drawing office stage. Agree. Pictured here has been an EP of the class without mods and retaining bogie brakes. That suggests pre-WW1. No such model has been announced. Bachmann is, then, to some extent, keeping its options open, but if and when a production version of this early condition is to be released, who can tell. Might some gentle lobbying/expressions of interest in an 'as built' H2 be a good idea? I will add an email to Bachmann on this to my 'to do' list. Perhaps others could consider doing so? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Synch Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Agree. Pictured here has been an EP of the class without mods and retaining bogie brakes. That suggests pre-WW1. No such model has been announced. Bachmann is, then, to some extent, keeping its options open, but if and when a production version of this early condition is to be released, who can tell. Might some gentle lobbying/expressions of interest in an 'as built' H2 be a good idea? I will add an email to Bachmann on this to my 'to do' list. Perhaps others could consider doing so? It's more likely it will be a Collector's Club model, same thing happened with the J11, there was an EP that had original boiler fittings (which meant GCR condition) but wasn't announced in the main range; it promptly appeared in the Collector's Club. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 It's more likely it will be a Collector's Club model, same thing happened with the J11, there was an EP that had original boiler fittings (which meant GCR condition) but wasn't announced in the main range; it promptly appeared in the Collector's Club. Then I must join! More expense [sigh] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenny Emily Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Then I must join! More expense [sigh] I always join just at the point they announce something I really want. Membership runs for 12 months from the day you join, so you might as well leave joining until the day the model is released. You can pay for membership and whichever club models take your fancy in the same telephone call. I've done this several times over the years when there has been a period of models that don't take my fancy to let membership lapse during. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 When do they usually announce new collectors club models? Definitely joining if they do one of these in LBSC livery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 I always join just at the point they announce something I really want. Membership runs for 12 months from the day you join, so you might as well leave joining until the day the model is released. You can pay for membership and whichever club models take your fancy in the same telephone call. I've done this several times over the years when there has been a period of models that don't take my fancy to let membership lapse during. Great tip, thanks. But suppose you are a clueless idiot (me), how do you ensure that you hear of the announcement of a new Collectors Club model, given you're not already a member? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clearwater Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 Great tip, thanks. But suppose you are a clueless idiot (me), how do you ensure that you hear of the announcement of a new Collectors Club model, given you're not already a member? I would be rather surprised if it didn't get a mention on here somewhere! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 I would be rather surprised if it didn't get a mention on here somewhere! You might, just possibly, have a point there! I will just keep an eye out for froth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Midland Mole Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 I will just keep an eye out for froth. If they do announce it as a collectors club model, I will produce so much froth I will probably drown in it! Alex 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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