Mikemeg's Workbench - Building locos of the North Eastern & LNER

[mikemeg]

Firebox and boiler tubes? impressive...

 

It's the 4mm scale steam that is the challenge!!

 

No, just the valve gear and inside motion.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited October 23, 2017 by mikemeg

[Compound2632]

No, just the valve gear and inside motion.

 

just...

[Horsetan]

 

It's the 4mm scale steam that is the challenge!!

 

No, just the valve gear and inside motion.....

 

just...

 

What's not to like? 

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

Today I'm having a 'detailing day'; just finishing adding those tiny details which, in and of themselves, are fairly inconsequential but taken together they do serve to lift the model.

 

I don't normally ever mention any problems which I find during these test builds, at least to anyone other than Arthur, but I'm sure Arthur won't mind if I mention this one. As supplied, the sanding rod was only half as long as it needed to be (35 mm instead of 68 mm) - obviously this has been reported and now corrected - so what to do?

 

Whenever I cut the last component from a fret, I always cut the fret up and save any brass or nickel silver strips longer than about 25 mm (one inch) of whatever width and keep them. Might just 'come in handy'!!

 

I was lucky in that I had a piece of brass strip exactly the same width as the sanding rod, around .8 mm. So a taper was filed at the end of the sanding rod and a taper filed at the end of the augmenting strip and the two pieces then soldered together, taper to taper. Once soldered then the join was dressed off with very fine needle files and is now, hopefully, invisible.

 

The sanding rod support, over the centre splasher, is 0.4mm wire filed flat. I knew that technique (posted by N15class higher up the thread) would come in handy, somewhere.

 

The cab detailing is also now almost complete with just one retaining bar to add, after which I'll photograph that.

 

So, at this point, all of the etched parts, except the brakes, brake linkage and the ash pan are on. Any parts needing changes have been reported and amended by Arthur, as necessary. So the test part of the build is largely complete and, once again, the first set of etches has produced a complete model.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg

[jwealleans]

Bit of an aside, but Wizard Models do some nickel-silver square .4mm section for point rodding which is equally useful for sander operating rods, if they aren't supplied.

[ArthurK]

Bit of an aside, but Wizard Models do some nickel-silver square .4mm section for point rodding which is equally useful for sander operating rods, if they aren't supplied.

 

Yes they are in the kit but those Mike got were wrong so he had to improvise. My fault!

 

ArthurK

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

A photo of the completed cab interior sub-assembly. This was primed to show up the detail, though without the backhead being present. Now just a little trimming on some of the lever pivots and then to push the whole lot into the cab!!

 

This photo is around six times actual size, so please excuse any errors in the workmanship!!

 

I believe that Arthur has re-designed (and simplified) this part of the kit!! But that is a cab interior; and I still haven't fitted the etched rashers of bacon and fried eggs!!

 

I have a rule with these test builds. Whatever Arthur etches, I will build. My therapist was really impressed!!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

And does it all fit into the cab? Oh ye of little faith; of course it does.

 

With all those levers and the shelves, where did the driver sit?

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

One or two folks have asked how this model will be driven, given the relatively small volume of the firebox and boiler. As with Arthur's J24 kit, the recommendation is to drive on the rear axle using the High Level Roadrunner Compact Plus gearbox (in this instance with a 60 : 1 gear ratio) and the Mashima 1020 motor. I don't believe that there is sufficient vertical clearance, in the firebox, to allow the use of a Mashima 1024.

 

The Roadrunner Compact Plus does have an articulated final drive carriage, which must be correctly positioned and then fixed to the primary drive carriage. I normally use superglue for this fixing as there are plastic gears in there, which may not take too kindly to the application of excessive heat of soldering.

 

The photo below shows the arrangement, though the top end motor shaft has not yet been cropped flush with its end bearing; an operation which is essential if the motor is to sit inside the firebox. I believe Arthur has designed the centre mainframe spacer and the ash pan to fit around this drive train arrangement. Any other arrangement i.e. driving on the centre axle, would require some modifications to the spacers and the brake hangar stretchers.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

Another little addition, which is worth making, is a planked cab floor. Just a piece of white paper, cut to size and profile and then scored at 2 mm (scale 6") intervals to represent the cab floor planking. I normally coat the entire underside of this floor with a very thin film of Araldite and then stick it into the cab, leaving it for several hours to set. This hardens the paper and allows it to be primed and painted. The cab interior assembly can then be fitted once the cab internal platework has been primed and painted.

 

I've also added the fall plate, which is a beautiful bit of etching!!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg

[Jon4470]

Another little addition, which is worth making, is a planked cab floor. Just a piece of white paper, cut to size and profile and then scored at 2 mm (scale 6") intervals to represent the cab floor planking. I normally coat the entire underside of this floor with a very thin film of Araldite and then stick it into the cab, leaving it for several hours to set. This hardens the paper and allows it to be primed and painted. The cab interior assembly can then be fitted once the cab internal platework has been primed and painted.

 

I've also added the fall plate, which is a beautiful bit of etching!!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

Mike

The loco is really coming together nicely - looks superb.

 

May I ask a question please? When ( and how) do you fix the roof onto the cab?

 

Thanks

Jon

[mikemeg]

Mike

The loco is really coming together nicely - looks superb.

 

May I ask a question please? When ( and how) do you fix the roof onto the cab?

 

Thanks

Jon

 

Jon,

 

Firstly, many thanks for the kind words.

 

I normally fix the roof onto the cab when everything else, in the cab, is done - detailing, painting the cab interior and underside of the roof, crewed up, etc.

 

To fix the roof, I use Araldite and just stick the roof to the stretchers at the top of the cab sides, though they could just as easily be soldered. I like Araldite because it sets slowly - very slowly - so that the roof can be positioned/re-positioned (if necessary) during setting. Superglue, setting very quickly, doesn't give you that opportunity and once it is set It's "God's own" job to shift it.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited October 27, 2017 by mikemeg

[ArthurK]

Another little addition, which is worth making, is a planked cab floor. Just a piece of white paper, cut to size and profile and then scored at 2 mm (scale 6") intervals to represent the cab floor planking. I normally coat the entire underside of this floor with a very thin film of Araldite and then stick it into the cab, leaving it for several hours to set. This hardens the paper and allows it to be primed and painted. The cab interior assembly can then be fitted once the cab internal platework has been primed and painted.

 

I've also added the fall plate, which is a beautiful bit of etching!!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

I suppose there is no real reason why I shouldn't have etched the plank lines although I suspect the planks were planed 8" timber rather than 6"

 

ArthurK

[mikemeg]

I suppose there is no real reason why I shouldn't have etched the plank lines although I suspect the planks were planed 8" timber rather than 6"

 

ArthurK

 

Oh dear! So I've built a J25/6 and not a J25/8.

 

Perhaps no-one will notice or at least no-one brandishing a millimetre rule.

 

Next job is to prepare the  Railmatch weathered black prior to starting the painting. A few years ago I read an article devoted, completely, to painting models.

 

The tip I most remember was to let the pigment settle and then remove most of the oil from the top of the jar of enamel and replace it with a good quality enamel thinners. This reduces the viscousity of the paint, improves its covering qualities, reinforces the matt finish and reduces the drying time.

 

The other tip (of many, many tips) which resonated, was after painting any flat surface, then lay the surface horizontal, while drying, to avoid the paint responding to gravity and curtaining.

 

Above all I remember :-

 

Take the painting slowly and in stages. Allow each stage or part to dry before moving to the next part or stage.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited October 28, 2017 by mikemeg

[ArthurK]

And does it all fit into the cab? Oh ye of little faith; of course it does.

 

With all those levers and the shelves, where did the driver sit?

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

At Mike's suggestion i am posting a few photographs that I used to prepare the drawings for the cab interior of the J25. These are of the preserved J21 whilst it had a short stay at Marley Hill. If we ignore all the gubbings at top right of the cab (which controls the Loco and train brakes) the cab layout on the J21 and J25 was virtually identical as was that of the J24. We must note that the J25 was a smaller wheeled version of the  J21. The major difference apart from the wheel diameter was that the boiler of the J25 was pitched a little lower.

 

 

Points to note are the wooden shelves (shorter on the right) and wooden planking on the 'seats' (missing at the time of the photo). Sandboxes were built into the seats with a single sanding lever on the fireman's side. a linkage under the cab floor connected with the right sandbox. On the J25 the sandboxes fillers were covered with a hinged wooden flap.

On the fireman's side are the two dampers. These are simply flat bars bent to form a handle. The front damper is the one prominent on the left. The rear damper passes vertically through the floor by the side of the blinder.

Ahead of the front damper is the lever to operate the front sandboxes. On the right-hand side (driver's side)The reverse lever is the most prominent feature. Note the 'kickplate' at the front of the reverse quadrant and used to exert more leverage. Behind the reverse lever is the lever for the draincock valves. There are two square holes in the seats each side. These, I am pretty sure, have the injector levers which pass through the floor each side. The injectors were on the rear of the cab steps.

 

Question is all this detail necessary or will it be ignored by many modellers?

 

ArthurK

Edited October 28, 2017 by ArthurK

[Horsetan]

....is all this detail necessary or will it be ignored by many modellers?

Every little helps.

[Compound2632]

Perhaps no-one will notice or at least no-one brandishing a millimetre rule.

 

Question is all this detail necessary or will it be ignored by many modellers?

 

Too late - we all know now!

[DougN]

Well from my point of view, if the kit designer has the bits there it can be an easy decision to put them all in. Some may simplify but if you remove the decision the builder won't. Personally things like dampers do add to the view of the cab. I have only put them in twice as they were supplied.

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

The mainframes have now been painted, the wheels are on and the motor and gearbox located on the rear axle.

 

So, next check; does the motor sit in the firebox satisfactorily? Yes, no problem there.

 

Next check; does the chassis revolve freely with the rods added? Yes, no problem there either.

 

Do the running plates on the loco and tender line up? Yes, though there is a 10 - 15 thou disparity to be dealt with as the front end of the tender is slightly high. This will be dealt with as the next priority.

 

So now to the final detailing phases.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

A little bit of adjustment on the tender front axle springing and the loco running plate and tender running plate are now exactly level with each other, as they should be.

 

Way back, on one of the photos, I noticed that the riveted strip, on the front footplate step, wasn't level. So it was removed, filed back at the edges, and then re-done. Now it is level!

 

Next up the brakes, brake linkage, sand pipes, etc.

 

Now it does look like a J25. They may have only been freight locos but they were lovely!!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg

[JaymzHatstand]

Lovely indeed, and your build is particularly so!

 

Cracking stuff!

 

Cheers.

 

J

[Compound2632]

Now it does look like a J25. They may have only been freight locos but they were lovely!!

 

Indeed, though it's big brother William's larger-wheeled older sisters of Class C that do it for me - likewise the Class E 0-6-0Ts compared to Wilson's E1s. I do like to see a decent size of splasher above the platform.

 

Plus of course the Cs were originally compounds, albeit of the wonky two-cylinder variety.

[rowanj]

Excellent, Mike, and as always, some great tips for the less experienced. It will certainly help when I begin my LRM version. Looking at the kit, there seem to be areas where some additional fabrication may be needed, quite aside from the issues raised by Daddyman. But it cant be any harder than fitting Peco 3rd rail without the plastic conductors falling off the rail...

 

John

[mikemeg]

Indeed, though it's big brother William's larger-wheeled older sisters of Class C that do it for me - likewise the Class E 0-6-0Ts compared to Wilson's E1s. I do like to see a decent size of splasher above the platform.

 

Plus of course the Cs were originally compounds, albeit of the wonky two-cylinder variety.

 

So here's a photo of a Class C (LNER J21) carryng a superheated boiler and vacuum fitted. The photo was taken in 1931 outside Hull Dairycoates shed, though not by me!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited November 1, 2017 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J25

 

Driving the loco on the rear axle does mean that the gearbox occupies some of the space which the ash pan should also occupy. Arthur, has now redesigned the ashpan, effectively to wrap around the final drive carriage of the Roadrunner Compact Plus.

 

However, I've had to make those modifications to the ash pan. So now to see whether (or not) the bottom part of the final drive carriage is hidden by the ash pan.

 

Seems to be pretty well obscured and the chassis still works; so I think this modification is ok.

 

If you look, very closely, at the intersection of the cab front and the running plate, you may be able to discern the end of a tiny piece of 0.8 mm 'L' angle. This is mirrored on the other side of the loco also. This 'L' angle has now been incorporated into the production etchings.

 

So now for the remaining details - brakes and brake linkage. whistle, couplings, etc.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited January 12, 2018 by mikemeg