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Ron Ron Ron

Lenz LH101, LZV200, SET101 and trade-in offer.

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Some 8 years after announcing that their DCC system would be updated with a new Command Station and handsets, could it be that Lenz are finally ready to release the LH101 handset (shown at Nuremberg last year) and LZV200 Command Station (it replaces the LZV100) ?

Although this has been promised each year for several years, their press release states that a release of these new products will finally materialise in 2018.

 

Note that the SET100 system is also to be replaced by a new SET101, containing the new handset and LZV200.

 

 

One other piece of news, is that in the German language Nuremberg trade fair press release, Lenz have announced a trade-in offer for existing owners of the LH100 handset.

 

 

 

 

We exchange... LH100 for the new LH101

If you send your functional and intact LH100 (from software version 3.0) to Lenz, you will get the new LH101 in exchange

(that is, the LH100 shipped in at Lenz) at a preferential price of 79 Euro (plus 7 Euro shipping)!

An offer that you can hardly refuse ...

The campaign begins with the availability of the LH101 - expected in the 2nd quarter;

 

Whether this offer will be extended across all markets (e.g. the UK), is yet to be announced.

 

 

 

.

Edited by Ron Ron Ron

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In other news, the handset radio modules, announced last year, are still under development (i.e. they probably won't see the light of day for another year or more).

 

Also, Lenz announce an update to the Silver+ Mini decoder

It is now replaced by the Silver+ Mini V2.

 

New features are...

4 function outputs

USP capability

S.U.S.I. interface

 

...plus 

 

 

 

Highlight: Vmax control.

 

We have also equipped these new digital plus decoders with these useful setting options.

 

 

  • Vmax separately adjustable for forward and reverse travel. This allows prototypical speed especially for tender and towing locomotives, the predefined Vmax is correct according to the direction of travel.

 

  • Vmax separately adjustable for maneuvering: Set manual control to "Vmax", the speed is right!

 

  • Operating hours counter, very useful for maintenance intervals of the locomotive.

 

Later this year, these options will also be available as an update to all other Digital plus Decoders!

 

 

 

.

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Interesting that Model Railways Direct are listing the LZV200 for £259 (RRP £323), the LH101 for £132 (RRP £165) and Set101, which reportedly includes both items, at £265 (RRP £331).  At that combined price, I would be more inclined to buy new rather than pay for upgrades, as the LZV100+LH100 would likely sell for a reasonable price on Ebay.  Plus I will also have a surplus 23151 LAN/USB PC connection as the LZV200 now has that integrated. 

 

As far as the ugrade offer for the LH100 to LH101 is concerned, there needn't be any restriction on being resident in Germany to qualify I would have thought. 

Edited by RFS

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As far as the ugrade offer for the LH100 to LH101 is concerned, there needn't be any restriction on being resident in Germany to qualify I would have thought.

 

If buying direct from Germany, I'm sure it would be illegal to discriminate against non-German customers, whilst we're still members if the EU.

However, the question I raised about the offer being made available in other markets was with respect to it being made available through UK based and approved dealers.

 

 

.

Edited by Ron Ron Ron

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If buying direct from Germany, I'm sure that would be illegal whilst we're still members if the EU.

However, the offer might not necessarily be available through UK based and approved dealers.

 

 

.

Why would it be illegal?

 

It may affect any warranty that came with it, but it isn't illegal to buy stuff from Germany or any other country - that is what the EU is about. It may be better to buy it whilst we are an EU member as presently there is no import tax as we are within the free trade zone ;)

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Why would it be illegal?

 

It may affect any warranty that came with it, but it isn't illegal to buy stuff from Germany or any other country - that is what the EU is about. It may be better to buy it whilst we are an EU member as presently there is no import tax as we are within the free trade zone ;)

 

The whole point of the Single Market is that companies cannot discriminate against customers based on their geographical location.  That's what would be illegal.  Same applies to warranties: I have purchased an LV102 booster and many Lenz decoders from German box-shifters and my son-in-law bought his Set100 from Germany too.  The warranty has to be valid wherever you are. 

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I think you've both got the wrong end of the stick.
I have edited my last post to make my suggestion clearer.
 
I said, or meant it would probably be illegal to discriminate against non-German customers.
So if the offer is not made available through UK retailers, then you should be able to take advantage of the offer, by buying from a retailer in a country where the offer is being made; e.g. Germany.
 
 

Why would it be illegal?

 
As RFS (Robert) says, you cannot discriminate against customers in other parts of the single market, based on their nationality.

 

It may affect any warranty that came with it,....

 
Again, as RFS says. Warranties should be valid EU wide.

 

...but it isn't illegal to buy stuff from Germany or any other country - that is what the EU is about.


Indeed. Who suggested otherwise?
It's what the EEC was about. The EU is going and intends to go, much further than being a free market. (Oops!... political).
 
 

It may be better to buy it whilst we are an EU member as presently there is no import tax as we are within the free trade zone https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/emoticons/default_wink3.gif


Certainly a good point to bear in mind.
Currently, there shouldn't be any difference in the UK between buying from say, Rails of Sheffield and say Modellbahn-Lippe, except that prices will be listed in different currencies.

With rapid parcel services, postage times are similar, if not the same (e.g. next day delivery option).

 

At the moment we don't know if the situation will be different once we've left the EU.

It will depend on the outcome of the talks on transition and the "future relationship".

In the meantime, we should be able to buy from EU countries like Germany, with confidence.

 

 

.

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Who suggested it was illegal to buy from Germany?

 

You did in your original post - which you admit you have edited and now changed (after being questioned on what you meant) to make it say what you actually meant to say rather than what it did ;)

 

Glad that you understand that you were wrong though.

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Currently, there shouldn't be any difference in the UK between buying from say, Rails of Sheffield and say Modellbahn-Lippe, except that prices will be listed in different currencies.

With rapid parcel services, postage times are similar, if not the same (e.g. next day delivery option).

 

.

VAT rates vary.

The item in Germany AFAIK has a lower VAT rate than the UK's 20% so even if the retailers are selling at the same base price the added VAT will make a difference.

 

I have bought several boxes of Marzipan direct from Niederegger in Lübeck (Germany) and the rate IIRC is about 9% which on a £50+ order makes quite a difference.

I also buy my LDT stuff & Digikejis direct for the same reason.

 

Keith

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VAT rates vary.

The item in Germany AFAIK has a lower VAT rate than the UK's 20% so even if the retailers are selling at the same base price the added VAT will make a difference.

 

I have bought several boxes of Marzipan direct from Niederegger in Lübeck (Germany) and the rate IIRC is about 9% which on a £50+ order makes quite a difference.

I also buy my LDT stuff & Digikejis direct for the same reason.

 

Keith

 

VAT rate in Germany is 19%. Whether there's a reduced rate for foodstuffs like Marzipan I couldn't say. 

 

If after Brexit we completely leave the Customs Union, then any purchase we make from the EU will have VAT deducted at whatever that EU country's rate is, but we'll pay VAT at UK rate via customs duty here. 

Edited by RFS

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VAT rate in Germany is 19%. Whether there's a reduced rate for foodstuffs like Marzipan I couldn't say. 

 

 

 I found this:

 
German VAT Rates

 

19% Standard: All other taxable goods and services.

 

7% Reduced: Some foodstuffs; water supplies; medical equipment for disabled persons; some domestic passenger transport; intra-community and international passenger transport for certain road, rail and inland waterway transportation; books (excluding e-books); newspapers and periodicals; admission to cultural events; writers and composers; some agricultural supplies (fertilizers); hotel accomodation; certain admission to sports events; social services; medical and dental care; firewood; some timber for industrial use; take away food; cut flowers and plants for decorative use and food production; taxation of some gold coins and jewellery.

 

0% Zero: Intra-community and international transport (excluding road and rail and some inland waterways transport).

 

The UK sellers must be hiking prices as buying model railway kit, paying German VAT plus the extra cost of carriage and it is stll cheaper.

Quite why marzipan is reduced rate I'm not sure!

 

Much of the 7% band is zero in the UK such as printed material, disabled products, some take away food, safety gear etc.

 

Keith

 

Edit reformatted for clarity

Edited by melmerby

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If after Brexit we completely leave the Customs Union, then any purchase we make from the EU will have VAT deducted at whatever that EU country's rate is, but we'll pay VAT at UK rate via customs duty here. 

Then Royal Mail can gleefully bang on their handling charge as well!

 

Keith

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Who suggested it was illegal to buy from Germany?

 

You did in your original post - which you admit you have edited and now changed (after being questioned on what you meant) to make it say what you actually meant to say rather than what it did ;)

 

Glad that you understand that you were wrong though.

 

 

No I wasn't wrong, if you read it properly.

 

I was responding directly to the comment by RFS.

It formed part of a conversation.

 

RFS -  "As far as the upgrade offer for the LH100 to LH101 is concerned, there needn't be any restriction on being resident in Germany to qualify I would have thought."

 

Me (original text)  -  "If buying direct from Germany, I'm sure that would be illegal whilst we're still members of the EU"

 

i.e. any restriction to someone buying from Germany would be illegal, not that buying from Germany was illegal.

 

As you point out, I have now clarified that response with an edit.

 

 

Personally I have bought a number of items online, from German model railway retailers and saved money into the bargain.

​As a family, we've bought other items online that have come from various EU countries.

 

Hopefully we can now return back to the topic.

 

 

.

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Plus I will also have a surplus 23151 LAN/USB PC connection as the LZV200 now has that integrated. 

 

Hi 

 

Not sure about this as there isn't an Ethernet connection on the LVZ200 only a USB connector top left.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

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Hi 

 

Not sure about this as there isn't an Ethernet connection on the LVZ200 only a USB connector top left.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

 

Not really a problem as I can connect via USB. I don't use any form of wireless but have been using the LAN connection as it avoids the use of a USB-Serial converter, having had problems with the original LI-USB in the past. I have tested the USB connection of the 23151 and could not find any issues. 

 

What is not clear is how those who currently have a LAN/USB connected to a router for wireless connection to a Smartphone will be provided for. I wonder if the LZV200 will have built-in wireless too like a laptop? Perhaps the round socket below the USB is where you plug in the aerial. 

 

Another upgrade of note is that there are V2 editions of the Gold Maxi and Silver Mini decoders. One interesting new feature of these is the ability to set different values for max speed for forwards and reverse, obviously aimed at steamers. Also the announcement states that this new feature will be made available for all existing decoders via a firmware upgrade during the course of the year. 

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One interesting new feature of these is the ability to set different values for max speed for forwards and reverse, obviously aimed at steamers. Also the announcement states that this new feature will be made available for all existing decoders via a firmware upgrade during the course of the year. 

 

My bold...

 

I get your point, but actually more applicable to lots of early railbuses which had standard road vehicle gearboxes.

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My bold...

 

I get your point, but actually more applicable to lots of early railbuses which had standard road vehicle gearboxes.

But didn't they have a separate reverse option?

15mph on the return journey wouldn't be much use!

 

Keith

 

Keith

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But didn't they have a separate reverse option?

15mph on the return journey wouldn't be much use!

 

Keith

 

Keith

 

I don't believe so (open to correction...) - the Irish 3ft railcars were either used in pairs or used the turntables, and the Colonel Stephens railcars were used in pairs generally so the pulling unit did the work.

 

Therefore whether there is any need for a decoder to suit is a moot point - unless running a single unit in a depot environment?

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My bold...

 

I get your point, but actually more applicable to lots of early railbuses which had standard road vehicle gearboxes.

 

The German announcement actually says "Tender- und Schlepptenderloks".  In German a "Tenderlok" is actually a tank engine in our parlance, and a "Schlepptenderlok" is a tender engine. Both however are steam engines, but no doubt there are other types of traction that this new option could be used for. 

 

Another change I've noticed is that shunting speed operated by F3, and which is currently half normal speed, will be specifically configurable using the new decoder firmware.

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Hi 

 

Not sure about this as there isn't an Ethernet connection on the LVZ200 only a USB connector top left.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

 

I asked A&H Models about this but they had no information from Lenz, so I asked Lenz direct.  Their reply was "when using the LZV200, the connection to a LAN can be done with the interface 23151."

 

​So if you're planning to use the LZV200 with any wireless connection you'll need to buy/retain a 23151 + a router. 

 

​Seems strange, as Lenz are currently developing what they call a "Funkmodule" which basically consists of a wireless transmitter that you attach to your belt into which you plug your Lenz handset.

 

See here (in German, but with self-explanatory pictures) - http://www.digital-plus.de/digitalplus-handregler-funkmodule.php

Edited by RFS

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Translation:-

 

The wireless modules for XpressNet devices

 

Again and again desired by model trainers: a budget wireless hand controller. Lenz did not want to add another model to the controllers that are already available on the market, but has taken a different approach that, among other things, allows the further use of existing hand controls.

 

The solution is a radio system consisting of a transmitter unit connected to the XpressNet and mobile radio receivers into which the handheld controllers are plugged. The radio receiver carries the model railroader much like a "belt pack" for wireless microphones. Multiple mobile receivers can be powered by one transmitter, but controllers connected via cable to the XpressNet will remain optional.

 

The graphic shows how the wireless modules are integrated in the XpressNet.

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