Clay Country Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 It appears the empties were not collected from Penzance this morning as expected. I can't imagine there's any great rush to remove the tanks from Long Rock (unless FGW wants them out of the way). Anyone know what arrangements (if any) have been made for moving them? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gary H Posted November 1, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 1, 2013 I had a look on RTT and it appears as cancelled. Im a Real time trains newb though mind! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerces Fobe2 Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 National Express coaches went through a phase of moving passengers through hubs (like a parcel courier) and getting them to change coaches which resulted in some very long journeys for a relatively short distance!. Madness again! XF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterbournecm Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 A DBS contact tells me next Friday.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Triang Paul Posted November 1, 2013 Author Share Posted November 1, 2013 Tanks were shunted in readiness but nobody told us there was no loco...... !!! Don't know why or any date for collection yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gary H Posted November 1, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 1, 2013 Tanks were shunted in readiness but nobody told us there was no loco...... !!! Nice to know the rail industry is functioning normally then! 8) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornish Triang Paul Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 Apparently, for Long Rock alone, FGW will save per year £4000,000 . Says a lot for DBS ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted November 5, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 5, 2013 Apparently, for Long Rock alone, FGW will save per year £4000,000 . Says a lot for DBS ! Are you saying that's £4 MILLION p.a. that will be saved, or £40k? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted November 5, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 5, 2013 Saved or diverted to line the shareholder's pockets? Such is business. I shouldn't complain. We were given a share allocation in lieu of a cash pay rise one year despite our union fighting for a "real" pay rise. I still get an annual notice of dividend. It's usually worth around £5 a year (a good annual increase, that) and that gets swallowed up in bank fees meaning I get the princely sum of nothing. And who's this from? Why First Group of course! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium drjcontroller Posted November 6, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 6, 2013 Apparently, for Long Rock alone, FGW will save per year £4000,000 . Says a lot for DBS ! My understanding is that DBS are merely the carrier, Esso supplied the fuel from Fawley for FGW and Esso formally contract(ed) DBS to move it. This would mean Esso are FGW's customer, not DBS. Douglas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 My understanding is that DBS are merely the carrier, Esso supplied the fuel from Fawley for FGW and Esso formally contract(ed) DBS to move it. This would mean Esso are FGW's customer, not DBS. Douglas Surely, it is FGW that is a customer of Esso and not as you suggest? Unless FGW imposed specific conditions, then it would be Esso (or whichever other fuel company who might also have tendered) who determined the means of delivery to the depots, and priced their tenders accordingly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 6, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 6, 2013 Surely, it is FGW that is a customer of Esso and not as you suggest? Unless FGW imposed specific conditions, then it would be Esso (or whichever other fuel company who might also have tendered) who determined the means of delivery to the depots, and priced their tenders accordingly. It has long been the practice in the oil industry for the oil company to chose (and it pays for) the mode of transport to their end customer. Hence after BR increased the rates for oil traffic back in the late 1980s/early '90s some supplies to BR depots were changed over to road delivery. It is nothing new for railway depot fuel supplies to be delivered by road - provided the receiving depot has the necessary facilities the oil company will use the cheapest mode. And if - to take matters to their extreme - the depot at Penzance had the necessary connections and sufficient storage capacity on site it could even be supplied by sea if that was the cheapest form of transport. And I'm surprised it has been necessary for several of us to repeat this very basic - and long established - fact several times in this thread. FGW wants the best deal it can get on fuel and the supplier will bid to get that business and use the most cost effective method of getting it to its customer, whatever the customer's business. If the customer specifies method of delivery and that costs more than a cheaper (for the oil company) method then the price of the fuel would be increased to reflect that difference, and that too has been the case for decades. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterbournecm Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 I believe the empties are due to be collected Friday morning (tomorrow). Good luck with any photos, I'm at Lostwithiel so will see the them pass there between 11 - 12.30 all being well. May be scrap added at BZ too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clay Country Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 I'll be at Truro, hoping for a shot among the semaphores. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Captain Kernow Posted November 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2013 I'll be at Truro, hoping for a shot among the semaphores. Passes 0947 hrs (6C11) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clay Country Posted November 8, 2013 Share Posted November 8, 2013 According to Real Time Trains something (presumably light loco) ran in the path of the loaded train down to Penzance this morning, so 6C11 should be running. Shame the weather is so dire :-( Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterbournecm Posted November 8, 2013 Share Posted November 8, 2013 The loco 66075 has gone down light - albeit as 6C21. Glad I got my Dowgas sunny shot 4 weeks ago now. Miserable today!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted November 8, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 8, 2013 The loco 66075 has gone down light - albeit as 6C21. Glad I got my Dowgas sunny shot 4 weeks ago now. Miserable today!! 66075 WBAK ST BLAZEY 850C21C608 7 * PENZCSDFL N Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
R A Watson Posted November 8, 2013 Share Posted November 8, 2013 i have been following this topic with interest since it started and have come to the conclusion that whilst the participants are very knowledgeable about the operations of the railway there is a lack of knowledge of the modern fuel market. For the last ten years of my employment one of my many and varied duties was the overseeing and monitoring of the fuel supply for our fleet of buses including ensuring timely reordering of additional supplies so I may be able to inform readers of how the market works. Fuel supply contracts with a specific supplier no longer exist locking the customer into a specific purchase price, instead the operator uses an agent who negotiates each delivery at the lowest price available on the day on the spot market, as the price is continuously fluctuating this can lead to considerable savings. Each penny saved on a 36000 litre load equals £360.00 less on the fuel bill, it is possible to get a discount of 10 - 20 pence against retail pump price which is a considerable saving on operating costs especially if you are getting three loads a day as mentioned earlier, this price includes the delivery costs by road tanker. In the case of Long Rock fuel will probably come from the Falmouth terminal and Laira's from Catedown so delivery mileage is small and unlikely to suffer delays or interruption. There was a comment earlier asking if National Express buses fueled at Long Rock.. Services were operated both by First Group from their Camborne depot and my employer with Plymouth based vehicles, when First withdrew we took over their services with some of our vehicles and crews turning round overnight at PZ. These vehicles are fueled at Long Rock but in a commercial filling station at an agreed discount so the answer is, yes. but! I was in conversation with my successor a few days ago and he told me that they had carried out an accountancy exercise recently and found that the equivalent price of fuel through the depot pump gave a theoretical saving of 1/4 to 1/3 of a million pounds annually. Just a small point to ponder when you complain about the cost of filling your vehicle. Wally . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted November 8, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 8, 2013 There was a comment earlier asking if National Express buses fueled at Long Rock.. Services were operated both by First Group from their Camborne depot and my employer with Plymouth based vehicles, when First withdrew we took over their services with some of our vehicles and crews turning round overnight at PZ. These vehicles are fueled at Long Rock but in a commercial filling station I am able to confirm that First (previously Badgerline) vehicles on National Express duties did not refuel at Long Rock. They were maintained at Camborne which was a fully-fledged depot while the Long Rock site was at that time a muddy yard. Camborne drivers from the National Express roster were also the only ones who normally drove them meaning a fair amount of dead mileage accrued. Whilst fuel was available at Long Rock the presentation of vehicles left a lot to be desired especially on wet days and the film of brown grime over them, and the driver's shoes, would have been unacceptable for National Express duties. We felt it was unacceptable for local bus operations as well but there was no wash at Long Rock and use of a long brush only added to the mud. Shortly after a visit from the big boss (later Sir) Moir Lockhead, who asked where the bus wash was and was told "thirty miles away" First relocated to their current site in the former BT depot on hard standing and with covered workshop facilities. A few National Express operations ran from there for a short time and with some vehicles refuelled and parked at Long Rock but First eventually gave up all such operations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foo Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 ote name="R A Watson" post="1219454" timestamp="1383942677"] In the case of Long Rock fuel will probably come from the Falmouth terminal and Laira's from Catedown so delivery mileage is small and unlikely to suffer delays or interruption. Wheres the terminal in Falmouth? Lived here all my life and cant think of a fuel terminal anywhere atm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 Wheres the terminal in Falmouth? Lived here all my life and cant think of a fuel terminal anywhere atm. This tank farm, on the seaward side of the docks, looks as though it might be it:- http://goo.gl/maps/AL2J0 Presumably the fuel comes in by coasting tanker, and is then distributed by road. There was earlier discussion of First Group buses being refuelled at Long Rock; if they were, they'd have to use separate storage and dispensing facilities, as diesel for rail use comes under a different tax regime to that used for vehicles using the public highway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerces Fobe2 Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 There is fuel depot in Falmouth Docks however that is for bunkering shipping. In the past there was a fuel depot at Ponsharden which is now the park and ride services to the town. Nigel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foo Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 Yeah was thinking that. There was also the fuel dump at swanvale famously hit in ww2 with the pumping station across the path now being turned into houses... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted November 9, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 9, 2013 There is fuel depot in Falmouth Docks however that is for bunkering shipping. In the past there was a fuel depot at Ponsharden which is now the park and ride services to the town. Nigel Agreed - that tank farm is purely for ship bunkering fuel. And as Brian suggested it is indeed replenished by coastal tankers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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