Modbury

[nick_bastable]

14 hours ago, -missy- said:

I so want to do some BG stuff!

 

Julia.

you know you want to

 

Nick B

[drduncan]

19 hours ago, -missy- said:

I so want to do some BG stuff!

 

Julia.

Me too. I keep telling myself that I’ll just scratch this itch and get back to proper GWR modelling 1900-14 but then I think hmm a roundy roundy with a Brunel trestle layout so that the BG Rover can stretch its legs with a long ish train, or maybe the New Quays extension for the still unfinished Nampara (which was suppose to be the ointment for the BG itch after all). It seems once you start you just can’t stop.

[Trewisin]

Hi Ian just poped back for a quick update on 517 you have been busy over the last few weeks, its looking really good .Just numbers to finish it off and crew . Regards Ray. 

[Ian Smith]

A little work on my Summer/Autumn project ...

 

For this build I've decided to veer away from my usual solid milled brass chassis, so a couple of pieces of 0.5mm phosphor bronze were sweated together then fretted and filed to shape (after the axle holes were drilled) :

 

 

Once separated, cheeks of thin double sided PCB were soldered in place where the frame spacers will go, I cut the frame spacers from fairly robust 1mm brass.  With rods to help with the alignment, the two frames were soldered to the frame spacers :

 

 

I have decided to use another of the Tramfabriek 6mm diameter motors in this build, so a motor/gear block was milled up from solid brass :

 

 

The outsides of the frames were chemically blackened, and the previously painted wheel sets were inserted, quartered and set to the correct back-to-back - rather pleasingly, the quartering was spot on first time (using the sighting through the spokes method), and only needed the crankpin holes to be opened out a smidge to get a perfectly running and free-rolling chassis!! :

 

And the components bolted together :

 

Having never built a loco in any scale with outside valve gear, I'm going in at the deep end because this little thing needs the full monty of Walchaerts valve gear, so that will be my next challenge!

 

A short video to illustrate :

https://youtu.be/d8DGf9BsQo8

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Ian

Edited April 3, 2022 by Ian Smith
reinstated the photos

[richbrummitt]

16 minutes ago, Ian Smith said:

A little work on my Summer/Autumn project ...

 

For this build I've decided to veer away from my usual solid milled brass chassis, so a couple of pieces of 0.5mm phosphor bronze were sweated together then fretted and filed to shape (after the axle holes were drilled) :

 

Once separated, cheeks of thin double sided PCB were soldered in place where the frame spacers will go, I cut the frame spacers from fairly robust 1mm brass.  With rods to help with the alignment, the two frames were soldered to the frame spacers :

 

I have decided to use another of the Tramfabriek 6mm diameter motors in this build, so a motor/gear block was milled up from solid brass :

 

The outsides of the frames were chemically blackened, and the previously painted wheel sets were inserted, quartered and set to the correct back-to-back - rather pleasingly, the quartering was spot on first time (using the sighting through the spokes method), and only needed the crankpin holes to be opened out a smidge to get a perfectly running and free-rolling chassis!! :

 

And the components bolted together :

 

Having never built a loco in any scale with outside valve gear, I'm going in at the deep end because this little thing needs the full monty of Walchaerts valve gear, so that will be my next challenge!

 

A short video to illustrate :

https://youtu.be/d8DGf9BsQo8

 

Thanks for looking.

 

Ian

 

One of these has been on my to-do list for about 10 years. I suspect it will still be there in 10 more.

 

I assume that you will be doing a coach too, unlike the one in this video: www.youtube.com//watch?v=q-2no7hmp2A 

 

Edited June 23, 2021 by richbrummitt
I have component drawings for the motion if they would be of use

[Ian Smith]

5 hours ago, richbrummitt said:

 

One of these has been on my to-do list for about 10 years. I suspect it will still be there in 10 more.

 

I assume that you will be doing a coach too, unlike the one in this video: www.youtube.com//watch?v=q-2no7hmp2A 

 

Richard,

I have the Worsley Works etch for No.93, I think with a bit of fettling I can produce one of the 1905/6 versions from it.  I also have a Langley 70’ autocoach, so with a fair wind my plan is to produce one of the two-car sets that ran around the Plymouth area when they were introduced.

 

I intend whittling the motion from bits of nickel silver rather than going down the etching route, mainly because this is a one off (for me) so by the time I’ve spent ages drawing/amending artwork I think I could have hacked the bits I need from raw materials. However if I fail I may take you up on the offer, thank you.

Ian

[Donw]

One of these

 

 

Mine is in 7mm

 

Don

[Ian Smith]

5 hours ago, Donw said:

One of these

 

 

Mine is in 7mm

 

Don

Yes Don, that’s the one.

The main differences I can see between No.93 and her earlier sisters is in the layout/number of engine room windows and the style of the recessed passenger door(s) - narrow double doors on earlier batch, single wider on No.93.

[queensquare]

Fantastic project Ian. I also have one of Worsleys etches for 93 and fancy building it for Tucking Mill. I have this long term plan to have stock to enable me to run TM in either NSLR, GWR or SDJR guise (all perfectly feasible in my version of history) which would extend the exhibition life of the layout quite considerably. Shame you're not going down the etching route for the motion.

 

Your little motor bogie design is brilliant, beautifully simple but with a nice heavy lump of brass just where its needed - I shall be copying that! 

 

Jerry

[bgman]

Hi Ian,

 

Not certain if you've seen excellent the 7mm build by Rosspop but it may be of some help with the photographs etc

 

see here ..... 

 

Well worth a look.

 

G

[Ian Smith]

3 hours ago, queensquare said:

Fantastic project Ian. I also have one of Worsleys etches for 93 and fancy building it for Tucking Mill. I have this long term plan to have stock to enable me to run TM in either NSLR, GWR or SDJR guise (all perfectly feasible in my version of history) which would extend the exhibition life of the layout quite considerably. Shame you're not going down the etching route for the motion.

 

Your little motor bogie design is brilliant, beautifully simple but with a nice heavy lump of brass just where its needed - I shall be copying that! 

 

Jerry

Jerry,

I think that the ability to run TM with various stock is a great idea.

 

I had thought about drawing up artwork for etching the motion but as I mentioned in an earlier post this is my first attempt at anything with outside cylinders, and I felt that constructing the motion may well prove iterative and therefore costly if the etching route was chosen (I would also want to put enough other projects together on the artwork to make it viable which would all take time - I hope to have the railmotor complete ready for the Uckfield exhibition in October (hoping that the show goes ahead)).

 

I do feel that weight is probably the most crucial aspect in 2mm scale loco construction (especially in the smaller prototypes of my Edwardian period) so a solid block of brass above the drivers was imperative.

The availability of the Tramfabriek 6mm motor through the Association’s shop further promotes the ease of constructing smaller prototypes - my 517 performs really nicely and pulls my rake of 6 wheeled coaches with ease, I remember my Metro slipping her wheels trying to drag my shorter rake of 4 wheelers up Highbury’s bank 

 

1 hour ago, bgman said:

Hi Ian,

 

Not certain if you've seen excellent the 7mm build by Rosspop but it may be of some help with the photographs etc

 

see here ..... 

 

Well worth a look.

 

G

Grahame,

I have seen Rosspop’s build over on WT, but will be revisiting it as I progress with this project. Thanks for reminding me.

 

Ian

[Donw]

My model is from a Mallard Kit built so long ago that Slaters did not do proper wheels of that size so the drivers are wagon wheels with a brass crank soldered on. It has been used a lot and the valve gear became a bit loose. It locked up one day and theflywheel on the motor  caused the brass crank to be lifted on one side. I worked out that with the crank set to 9 0 clock would be the easist point to get the position correct and re-soldered it. My good friend Steve Naylor thought it might happen again and took the Railmotor home and bushed all the valve gear pivots. I have now fitted a sound decoder with a recording from the Didcot one. I must get round to attending to the roof as the  plastic has become brittle over 40 years. It also introduced me to Fred Blackman (Mallard Models) who it turned out lived a couple of miles down the road from me.

I really look forward to seeing yours Ian no doubt in my mind you will produce another little cracker.

 

Don

[Trewisin]

Hi Ian. Got your bags packed and ready for Uckfield 16/17 th of October . Its looking good at the moment.

Isee you have been busy again. keep up the good work hope all goes well for October hope to meet up.

Regards Ray.

 

[queensquare]

On 24/06/2021 at 11:24, Ian Smith said:

Jerry,

I think that the ability to run TM with various stock is a great idea.

 

I had thought about drawing up artwork for etching the motion but as I mentioned in an earlier post this is my first attempt at anything with outside cylinders, and I felt that constructing the motion may well prove iterative and therefore costly if the etching route was chosen (I would also want to put enough other projects together on the artwork to make it viable which would all take time - I hope to have the railmotor complete ready for the Uckfield exhibition in October (hoping that the show goes ahead)).

 

I do feel that weight is probably the most crucial aspect in 2mm scale loco construction (especially in the smaller prototypes of my Edwardian period) so a solid block of brass above the drivers was imperative.

The availability of the Tramfabriek 6mm motor through the Association’s shop further promotes the ease of constructing smaller prototypes - my 517 performs really nicely and pulls my rake of 6 wheeled coaches with ease, I remember my Metro slipping her wheels trying to drag my shorter rake of 4 wheelers up Highbury’s bank 

 

 

Thanks Ian, I shall be following this closely and pinching ideas along the way!

 

Jerry

[Ian Smith]

Progress(?) of a sort with the Steam Railmotor ...

 

With the power unit running (albeit without its full set of Walchaerts motion), I decided that I should now turn my attention to the upper works with the items provided on the "scratch aid" etch from Worsley Works.

 

The etched parts provided in the "scratch aid" kit.  As can be seen there are a pair of sides and ends and an underframe floor.

 

Initially, I turned my attention to the underframe.  This comprises a floor with two fold up uprights to prevent the body sides from bowing inwards, and a pair of parts to fold into an L profile to represent the solebars.  These parts were separated from the etch, the relevant folds made and strengthened with solder and the solebars united with the floor.  The only hitch on the way was one of the tabs not the sole bar didn't align with its slot in the floor, so the tab was simply filed off.  Despite varying my soldering points to minimise heat build up, I did end up with a very slightly bowed underframe, pressing it firmly down onto a sheet of tufnol and re-applying the iron along the floor where the sole bar slots were eradicated this issue though.

 

A not very clear photo of the assembled underframe (solebars at the bottom, upright support for the body sides top).

 

As I mentioned in my previous post, I am trying to build an SRM from an earlier lot than the preserved 1908 dated No.93 that the etch represents.  The main differences that I can see is that the earlier lot(s) started life with a pair of large windows to the engine compartment (later the windows were reduced in size, a panel instated with a cover for the water filler in the middle), and the main compartment passenger door was a pair of narrow doors on the earlier lots.

 

With the above in mind, the first task was to enlarge the engine room windows on the etch :

First, the existing vertical window bar was removed, and the panel on the side of the windows towards the rear of the coach cut out, making good with fine files.

 

Second, the new window spaces received a patch of 0.004" nickel silver sheet - I had decided that it would be far better to cut the new windows in situ rather than trying to align pre-formed windows.

 

Third, a vertical line was marked with a permanent marker where the central window frame will be, a hole drilled in the middle of each window, then files were employed to work outwards from those holes to removed what will be the glazed area of each window.

 

This gave me a pair of sides with a pair of windows cut out.  In reality, these windows should slide, so one should sit behind the other - the jury is still out on whether I will file one of the windows out to the panelling and solder another piece of 0.004" behind and repeat the process to give me a slightly more rebated window (I almost certainly will as I know it will bug me into the future if I don't!!)

 

The doors to the engine compartment at the front of the coach were next.  From what I can see, it appears that the doors did not have a turn-under (indeed the later ones were sliding doors).  First though, the turn-under on the coach sides was formed - I always do this by taping the bottom of the side to a piece of 3/4" round bar and forming the turn-under by rubbing along the lower part of the side with my thumb (for the thin-sided panelled coaches that I've built so far this works really well, although I'm not sure how it would work with more modern stock with thicker sides).

 

To allow the flat door to sit correctly against the inside of the side, I soldered some 0.004" each side of the upper half of the door frame and then soldered the door in place behind that, filling any gaps where the turn-under is with solder.

 

One of the engine compartment doors in place.

 

Now comes the problem !!!

 

When I originally examined the sides to ascertain whether they would be suitable for an earlier variant, one of the things I'd noticed was that the panels each side of the central passenger door(s) were equal width - the one on the side nearest the engine compartment should be wider.  I decided that I could live with this minor anomaly, although even No.93 has the old arrangement of panel sizings around the central door so in actual fact there is an error in the Worsley Works artwork.  I was hoping that I would be able to modify the existing single door by simply supergluing small pieces of 0.005" plasticard in the various panels/window to give the illusion that it was a double door in my model.  However, it transpires that the error in panel width alluded to has introduced another error in the artwork - the door frame is too wide for the door provided :

As can be seen, the door is too narrow for the door frame (I have added a piece of 0.004" behind the door frame as I had for the engine compartment doors, although it is yet to be filed back to the size of the door frame). 

 

I am now in a bit of a quandary, in that I'm not too sure how to progress.  As I see it, I can try to make a new set of double doors to fit the door frame which will I will probably do in plasticard and glue in place after all of the soldering has been completed (I seriously doubt that I would be able to fret out a lace of mouldings in nickel silver to apply over a pair of doors).  The alternative (if I want to use the existing doors) would be to lose about 1mm of length in the doorway (which would be the easy way to do (but it would give me a 69'6" SRM, which I don't mind if necessary) with potentially just a single door).  Decisions, decisions!!!

 

Either way, I'm going to put it to one side for a few days while I cogitate 

 

One other thing that I need to check is the coach ends - I'm not completely convinced that they aren't too tall compared to the sides!!  I haven't removed them from the fret yet, but a casual look makes me think that they may be!  I'll report back on that one.

 

Thanks for looking,

Ian

 

Edited April 3, 2022 by Ian Smith
reinstated the photos

[bécasse]

Can't you narrow the doorway by soldering some brass strip (etch waste?) in at right angles and then filing to shape? Given your obvious skills you could probably even correct the panelling in the process. Then you would stand a reasonable chance of reproducing the double door as you intended.

[Ian Smith]

15 minutes ago, bécasse said:

Can't you narrow the doorway by soldering some brass strip (etch waste?) in at right angles and then filing to shape? Given your obvious skills you could probably even correct the panelling in the process. Then you would stand a reasonable chance of reproducing the double door as you intended.

Thanks. For the comment and the vote of confidence 

I will add that alternative to my cogitations.

[Siberian Snooper]

Ian,  before you get to far, fold the ends to the correct angles and measure the width, because if they are like the 4mm ones they will be narrow, about a mm. You will also need to modify the floor to suit or because the floor supplied has square ends, make a new one adding on the extra length for the cabs.

 

Have fun I'm doing battle with the Plymouth Auto trailers.

 

 

[Ian Smith]

A small amount of progress has been made with the SRM, viz the ends ...

 

In my previous post I remarked that I was concerned that the ends might have been a tad too tall for the sides, I need not have worried as once removed from the fret I was able to compare the relative heights of each and am satisfied that all is well.

 

In the post immediately before this one, Siberian Snooper alerted me to the possibility that the ends when folded to the correct angles may come out too narrow, again on a dry run of folded ends compared with folded up end supports showed that all is well on that front too.  Although it has to be borne in mind that the ends are designed to fit inside the sides, so if Siberian Snooper was expecting the sides to fit inside the ends then that would give the impression that the ends were too narrow.  (Assuming that the 2mm etch is a shot down version of the 4mm one).  So on with this instalment ...

 

The first step is to fold up the end supports and to open out the body-to-underframe bolt holes to accept 12BA.  With that done, 12BA nuts were soldered in position over the holes (on the inside) using a cocktail stick through the hole into the nut to hold said nut in place while a bead of solder is applied.  The side supports need to be folded up to the angle of the turn under of the body side rather than a full 90 degree bend.  All of the folds were reinforced with a bead of solder.

 

Before the ends were folded up, I drilled the various handrail holes (these are marked with half-etched dimples on the rear).  Once drilled, the ends were carefully folded to the correct angles (comparing the end with the end support).  It was then a case of bending up pieces of phosphor bronze wire to the correct sizes to suit the half dozen handrails on each end, and then soldering each in place - I decided to fit the handrails before attaching the ends to their supports because once attached it would be pretty tricky (if not nigh on impossible) to get the iron to the backs of the handrail wires!!  Once all the handrails were in place, I filed back the stubs of wire on the inside to allow the end supports to fit unimpeded.

 

Because of the recessed door at the engine end of the sides, the not-quite-vertical side supports on the previously folded up end support piece need to be filed away to clear the recessed door so that later in the build the side will fit properly - As can be seen I'm thinking ahead on this build for a change!!

 

It was now that I decided to unite the folded ends with their respective supports.  To ensure that the ends would be vertical compared with the base of the support, I double-sided taped an engineers square to a piece of tufnol against which I could push the end while I tack soldered the end support.  Once tacked, I checked that the side supports were flush with the edge of the ends (both along the bottom and at each side), and also made sure that the end support was true in all directions (it took a couple of attempts with each end until I was happy with everything).  Once satisfied the solder joints were all made good.  Hopefully, the image below should illustrate the principal :

 

 

The two ends after uniting with their respective end support pieces.  Also shown is the taped down engineers square against which the first tack joint was made.  As can be seen the turn under support of the end against the square has been filed back to clear the recessed door at this end of the coach sides.  Also noticeable is the small patch that I soldered over the holes etched in the ends for mounting the warning gongs - when first built the rail motors did not have gongs instead relying on an ordinary whistle, so I won't be fitting gongs.

 

 

The current state of the ends - I have fitted a couple of lamp irons on the engine compartment end (and over-enthusiastically tinned one of the panels on the other end for same).  I still need to fabricate and fit steps on both ends too.

 

Thanks for looking,

Ian

Edited April 3, 2022 by Ian Smith
reinstated the photos

[Dragonboy]

I’ve just had an incredibly relaxing 20 mins or so over lunch watching a video of Modbury that popped up on YouTube.

 

Your layout is absolutely exquisite Ian and the video is just the sort of calm and measured “action” I love to see on a model. 
 

I’m not convinced action is the right word because it tends to suggest the breakneck harem scarum activity more associated with gaudy boxes hurtling round a round roundy layout at impossible speeds on minimal radius curves but, as they say, each to their own. 

 

Now that I’ve found this thread I can imagine I’ve several enjoyable days reading to come. 
 

Brian

[Ian Smith]

8 hours ago, Dragonboy said:

I’ve just had an incredibly relaxing 20 mins or so over lunch watching a video of Modbury that popped up on YouTube.

 

Your layout is absolutely exquisite Ian and the video is just the sort of calm and measured “action” I love to see on a model. 
 

I’m not convinced action is the right word because it tends to suggest the breakneck harem scarum activity more associated with gaudy boxes hurtling round a round roundy layout at impossible speeds on minimal radius curves but, as they say, each to their own. 

 

Now that I’ve found this thread I can imagine I’ve several enjoyable days reading to come. 
 

Brian

Brian,

Thank you for the kind comments and I’m glad that you enjoyed the video. I tried to provide the sort of “action” that would have been typical at a small through station in the steam era.

I hope that in your perusal of the thread that you find things of interest and are inspirational to you.

Enjoy.

Ian

[Ian Smith]

A little more progress on the Steam Railmotor ...

 

Firstly, I decided to retain the recessed passenger doors.  As mentioned previously, for this build I wanted to fit the original double doors (rather than a single door supplied in the kit), so this entails some modification to the etch.  Therefore some modification of the doors is required, this requires new mouldings (to simulate the drop lights in each of the doors, and also to provide separate panels in each of the new doors).  I elected to solder in a new piece of moulding down the middle of the existing window aperture, but before this could be done I had to form it!!  With that in mind, a piece of 0.010" nickel silver strip the width of the 'droplight edge-raised moulding-droplight edge' was soldered to a stout piece of brass, then files were applied to file flats down to about 0.005" along each edge of the strip to give me a strip that had a top hat profile.  Pieces were then cut from that strip and soldered in place in the existing droplight to give a pair of drop lights instead.

Doors with the added strips to simulate the edges of the pair of droplights and the central edge mouldings of the two doors.  I've also removed the wide door handle moulding that was etched onto the right hand side of each door.

 

I intend to instate the remainder of the mouldings with small pieces of 0.005" plastic sheet once all of the soldering operations have been completed.  There will also be a bit of thinning of the new central droplight/door moulding to round the corners of the droplight frames where the new inserts meet the existing droplight frame.

 

As previously mentioned, the doors as etched are too narrow compared to the opening into which they should fit.  Becasse suggested that I could narrow the opening by soldering patches into the gap and making good the panels afterwards by filing.  This was originally suggested because the panel adjoining the doorway on the engine end of the coach is too narrow - I decided on a half-way house, in that I am prepared to accept the too narrow panel adjoining the doorway, but clearly a doorway too wide for the door(s) is completely impossible to accept.

 

Looking at various photos of the prototype it would appear that the edge of the door reveal is radiused.  I therefore decided to solder pieces of 0.015" along the vertical edges of the door reveal and then carefully file them back to the face of the surrounding moulding, then round over the edge to a) narrow the door way and b) provide the rounded moulding into the door reveal.

 

Method employed to narrow the door reveals - the side at the top has a 0.004" backing piece soldered in place to increase the depth of the frame to allow the flat door to fit vertically behind the turn under of the side.  The lower side has the 0.004" backing piece filed back to the edge of the frame, two pieces of 0.015" brass strip soldered in place down the edges of the frame and the left hand of these strips having been filed back flush with the moulding and the rounded edge of the reveal filed.

 

Having filed both 0.015" doorway narrowing pieces flush with the raised moulding, I couldn't resist laying the side over the modified door for effect.

 

The "finished" sides - both sides have had their remedial work completed to the central doorways and the modified doors soldered in place.  It may also be noticed that I also took the opportunity to file away the rearward window of the engine compartment windows that I had previously added, and add a new piece of 0.004" behind which then had its central portion filed away to give me a recessed sliding window.

 

The next stage will be to complete preparing the sides and ends before they can be united - the door handles need to be fitted to the doors at the ends of the sides (the central doors cannot have these fitted until the plastic mouldings have been added after al soldering operations have been completed).  The steps and lamp irons need to be added on the ends too.

 

I have also addressed a running issue with the loco chassis - it ran fine when the motor leads were connected to a battery, but limped along rather erratically when placed on the track.  Clearly not being very heavy will be a major cause of this problem, which won't really be addressed until it is united with the coach body.  However I did feel that some improvement would be possible anyway, so the leading driving wheels (those without the worm gear) were removed by pushing a pair of pointed tweezers between frame and wheel back to ease the axle out of the muff.  Once the wheels were out, I opened up the axle holes to 1.6mm.  I then bent up a couple of lengths of fine phosphor bronze wires to form some simple electrical pick-up springs which would act on the top of the stub axles (I took the opportunity to slice about 0.5mm off the length of the muff while it was out to provide clearance for the spring wires).  The pick-up wires were soldered to the edge of the frames between the two axles.

 

The underside of the loco chassis showing the new pick-up springs.  As can be seen they have had to be bent so that they avoid the pcb pads of the central frame spacer, but being soldered only in the middle there is sufficient spring in them to to their job.  Also the motor end cap has been coated with araldite to offer some protection to the wires where they enter the motor, the wires are connected to pieces of 0.5mm phosphor bronze wire which in turn are soldered into holes in the side frames.  Eventually, I will be running wires to these from further pick-ups on the bogie at the other end of the coach.

 

Finally, a short video of the chassis running on my short test track.  The power is supplied by a home-made controller which uses a 9V PP3 battery as its power source (and the battery is quite an old one now so probably isn't delivering full beans anymore).

 

 

Thanks for looking

Ian

 

Edited April 3, 2022 by Ian Smith
reinstated the photos

[Regularity]

That runs smoothly, but the noise suggests a slight lack of concentricity on the worm wheel.

[Ian Smith]

On 12/07/2021 at 18:16, Regularity said:

That runs smoothly, but the noise suggests a slight lack of concentricity on the worm wheel.

Simon,

The noise may be down to the spur gear reduction straight off the motor shaft down to the worm shaft. I’ll just have to cake it all in grease 

Ian

Edit: Although listening to it again , the rhythmic noise seems to be on every revolution of the wheels.

Edited July 14, 2021 by Ian Smith

[Regularity]

Yep, it was the once per driving wheels revolution of the sound which concerned me.

Of course, a bit of toothpaste and half an hour in each direction at 9V might be a solution - washed off throughly afterwards. (Better engineers might use something like Molyslip…)