lmsforever Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Should be known very soon and hope that improvement is the name of the game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Market65 Posted December 7, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 7, 2015 Hi. Just picked up the new timetables from Scarborough station. They run to May 2016, and they are still in Northern's name and colours. But I suppose they would be. Regards, Rob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 7, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 7, 2015 (edited) Should be known very soon and hope that improvement is the name of the game. Bearing in mind that Northern have the lowest average fare per journey, I wonder if they'll be a price hike to fund the improvements? Some reports doing the rounds that the announcement for Northern (and TPE) will be on the 10th. Cheers, Mick Edited December 7, 2015 by newbryford Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Slight delay whilst they add a new requirement for either submersible or floating trains. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted December 8, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 8, 2015 Slight delay whilst they add a new requirement for either submersible or floating trains. Sounds like the Warships are needed! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Hydraulics do have a deeper floodwater threshold than locos with electric motors. Though I'm not sure if be volunteering to see if I could get through... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
black and decker boy Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Rumour from journalists over on WNXX is arriva for northern (if not then abellio) I am interested to see what has been proposed for the new and expanded fleets for both franchises. I am less bothered by the name over the door as all the staff and working practices get TUPE'd over. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
black and decker boy Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Journalists on WNXX say announcement is 0700 Wednesday, so not long at all so long as they mean tomorrow :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 4630 Posted December 9, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 9, 2015 (edited) . Edited November 14, 2016 by 4630 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Well there we are. I'm interested to see Arriva's detailed fleet strategy. They'll need some more second-hand or 'new-to-the-franchise' vehicles in addition to the new trains, to cope with those growth levels, unless they can pack more pax per square metre than the laws of physics generally allow.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ColinK Posted December 9, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2015 Thanks for the info. Wonder if there will be a rush by preserved lines to buy Pacers? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold young37215 Posted December 9, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 9, 2015 Biggest issue for me is what will happen to the Cumbian Coast loco hauled services. Nothing I can see in the announcements addresses this point, is anyone aware of the timescales for the loco hauled services? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DavidLong Posted December 9, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2015 young37215, on 09 Dec 2015 - 09:41, said:Biggest issue for me is what will happen to the Cumbian Coast loco hauled services. Nothing I can see in the announcements addresses this point, is anyone aware of the timescales for the loco hauled services? You have to look into the detail in the announcement. It says: "the locomotive-hauled carriages used on the Coast will be refurbished." And also: "up to 6 extra services will be provided per day to stations on the Cumbria Coast route between Barrow-in-Furness and Carlisle, with more capacity on the busiest services and the timetable better suited to employees at Sellafield and Whitehaven" Interesting that they may continue as I had read that there were reliability problems with the current arrangement. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
37081LochLong Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 The last time Arriva ran services around Shefield I'd never seen so many trains cancelled but when Northern took over that all ended... I hope we don't revert back to the cancellations. Also wonder if that puts an end to the trial with the modified 144012 pacer unit which was supposed to extend their life? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Loco hauled services have a fairly healthy lifespan because their replacement stock won't be available until either cascaded by electrification or displaced by new trains, and the focus of the cascades until December 2019 will be on Pacer elimination. The 144e was never going to survive beyond 2019 on Northern scheduled services, Pacer elimination is a mandatory franchise requirement. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DavidLong Posted December 9, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2015 (edited) It looks like TPE could be in the market for some electro-diesel (sorry, can't bring myself to use bi-mode) trains. Trains to Scotland, both west and east coast will be 125 capable but also Middlesboro' and Scarborough. As the latter is unlikely to be electrified and Manchester - Leeds via LNW route electrification is delayed they are going to need some non-electric capability. Could be an open goal for Hitachi as other manufacturers only offer either/or. That's if Hitachi have the capacity at the new factory. Also note that Cleethorpes/Hull will get 'fully refurbished' trains, so I assume that this will be the future use of Class 185s. Pleased to see that my local station at Atherton will finally get four trains an hour to Manchester. As a suburban station, eleven miles from its associated city this should be a minimum requirement and certainly would have been under London Overground or Merseyrail. Currently two trains an hour with a clumsy forty minute/twenty minute split. David Edited December 9, 2015 by DavidLong Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oakydoke Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 The Deutsche Bahn conquest continues....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 It looks like TPE could be in the market for some electro-diesel (sorry, can't bring myself to use bi-mode) trains. Trains to Scotland, both west and east coast will be 125 capable but also Middlesboro' and Scarborough. As the latter is unlikely to be electrified and Manchester - Leeds via LNW route electrification is delayed they are going to need some non-electric capability. Could be an open goal for Hitachi as other manufacturers only offer either/or. That's if Hitachi have the capacity at the new factory. Also note that Cleethorpes/Hull will get 'fully refurbished' trains, so I assume that this will be the future use of Class 185s. Pleased to see that my local station at Atherton will finally get four trains an hour to Manchester. As a suburban station, eleven miles from its associated city this should be a minimum requirement and certainly would have been under London Overground or Merseyrail. Currently two trains an hour with a clumsy forty minute/twenty minute split. David I guess it depends if they'll need to be able to tilt for the WCML services. I imagine Hitachi are in a strong position either way, but Bombardier and Alstom have already proven that they can do it. And isn't someone planning to order some pendolinos for an open access service to Blackpool? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Refurbished stock may well be the 442 fleet with the motors de-meshed. See my comments in the 442 thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerr Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 I guess it depends if they'll need to be able to tilt for the WCML servicesThat is a good point and there is no mention if the new units will be capable of tilting, the only specification is capable of 125mph However, I would expect they will be fully EPS compliant due to the speed differential between TPE and WC services which limits capacity between Preston and Carstairs Equally, it does look like from 2019 the capacity is to be increased slightly As an aside, with TPE extending Manchester - Newcastle services to Edinburgh, I wonder if XC will be required to give up some paths or will reduce their stopping pattern to give a similar service pattern that exists on the West Coast, where TPE become the main stopping service Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DavidLong Posted December 9, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2015 (edited) The 'Northern Connect' services are part of the fallout from the decision not to amalgamate the two franchises and TPE losing services such as Barrow/Windermere - Manchester to Northern. The result is: "a new high-quality ‘Northern Connect’ service, meaning new or refurbished trains on longer-distance services, faster journeys and stations staffed daily with catering services and free Wi-Fi at each one – as well as serving the 5 major commuter cities, this network will also serve other destinations including Bradford, Halifax, Blackburn, Accrington, Burnley, Lincoln, Worksop and Retford" Newcastle - Carlisle is also mentioned in the detail of the document. The Barrow service is specified as new diesel trains and Windermere as new electric trains after electrification. David Edited December 9, 2015 by DavidLong Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerr Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 It looks like TPE could be in the market for some electro-diesel (sorry, can't bring myself to use bi-mode) trains.I do not see why the new trains need to be Bi-Mode, as TPE plan to refurbish the existing rolling stock and redeploy as required, the new rolling stock is to be deployed on routes capable of 125mph Equally, DfT earlier this year has advised that no new diesel trains will be ordered However, if the pacers are to be replaced, what types of engine will these use? I suspect new EMU will be ordered, and existing DMU redeployed Network Rail had better get their fnger out with even more electrification requiring to be completed by 2019 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 9, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2015 (edited) Nobody has yet mentioned the D stock rebuild project. Or does that count as "no new diesel trains"? Oops - looks like they're not in the plan. (Goes off to order for Arriva turquoise paint from Phoenix............ and search for Hurst 442 conversion kits) Cheers, Mick Edited December 9, 2015 by newbryford 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwissRailPassion Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 220 vehicles of 44 new intercity stock. This will presumably be the AT range from Hitachi as a bolt on order from the GWR run. 281 vehicles for Northern will be a mix of new DMUs possibly made by CAF (like Ulster) and electrics. Calder valley does very well out of the deal and so does TPE north. Extending the new 125 mph trains to Edinburgh via Newcastle is a good idea. Northern Connect sounds like a regional express or semi fast service eg Lincoln to Leeds and Nottingham and Chester to Bradford. Scarborough is to get an additional hourly service from Northern (this seems too much off peak) and the Bridlington line trains to go through to Leeds and be increased. All good news for many with Pacers given the heave ho. Considering the Northern franchise was last let in 2004 on a no growth basis, the new franchise address growth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Storey Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 The Deutsche Bahn conquest continues....... Possibly, except that it looks like DB want to sell their Arriva operation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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