Signaller69's projects

[Signaller69]

Here are your possible headcode permutations. Some were never used in practise, others were quite rare.

 

Most used in the early days anyway were 15, 35, 65 and 26

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20040312161544/http://www.jhowie.force9.co.uk:80/303tributepage5.htm

 

Edit - tried to paste it in here but the formats were lost

 

Jim

Thanks Jim, they can be found on Darrels Smugmug pages too: https://darrels.smugmug.com/Trains/Class-303/i-sD4V9Z3/A

The image after that one gives the Central lines headcodes.

[luckymucklebackit]

Thanks Jim, they can be found on Darrels Smugmug pages too: https://darrels.smugmug.com/Trains/Class-303/i-sD4V9Z3/A

The image after that one gives the Central lines headcodes.

 

 

Its interesting to look at old timetables and see which services ran, the semi fast and fast services were confined to one or two peak hour trains from Helensburgh to Bridgeton in the morning and return in the evening, these trains always ran via Yoker so effectively Headcode 21 was never used for normal service trains.  The Craigendoran and Dumbarton headcodes were only used by one or two Summer Sunday services that ran between Craigendoran Pier and Balloch Pier (reversing at Dumbarton) as part of a train/steamer excursion.  The south side headcodes were actually part of a 4 digit headcode that would have been carried if a DMU was substituted and this would have been the description of the train on the Glasgow Central Signalbox diagram, so the Gourock train which carried 50 was actually 1L50 or 2L50 depending on the stopping pattern

 

Jim

[D6775]

This is looking really good Martyn, now if there was a 7mm version...........

[Signaller69]

This is looking really good Martyn, now if there was a 7mm version...........

Hmmmm, can't suggest much there I'm afraid, but I can't help thinking the old Triang Big Train mk.2's might hold a few possibilites; they even come with working sliding doors iirc. Extreme cut & shut perhaps...

[Charles]

Hi, Signaller69.

 

I must say that I am really impressed with your Class 303 project and the progress you have made.

 

They have always been a favourite of mine, having spent too many evenings travelling from Bridgeton Cross to Balloch and back when I should have been doing my homework.   Haven't seen one since 1971 however.

 

The attached photo, taken from the Blue Trains booklet produced by BR at the time of the Glasgow electrification may be of interest to you regarding front end details (can't imagine it could be subject of any copyright issue), although you certainly seem to have that aspect very well in hand

 

I am looking forward to seeing how your project comes to fruition, in particular how you deal with the wrap-around glazing.

 

Thanks for the inspiration.

 

Charles

[Signaller69]

Hi, Signaller69.

 

I must say that I am really impressed with your Class 303 project and the progress you have made.

 

They have always been a favourite of mine, having spent too many evenings travelling from Bridgeton Cross to Balloch and back when I should have been doing my homework. Haven't seen one since 1971 however.

 

The attached photo, taken from the Blue Trains booklet produced by BR at the time of the Glasgow electrification may be of interest to you regarding front end details (can't imagine it could be subject of any copyright issue), although you certainly seem to have that aspect very well in hand 303 at Milngavie 001 (2).jpg

 

I am looking forward to seeing how your project comes to fruition, in particular how you deal with the wrap-around glazing.

 

Thanks for the inspiration.

 

Charles

Thanks Charles, if this thread encourages someone to have a go then I am very happy.

 

I think that photo (and the booklet) were the ones linked by Jim a page or 2 back; it is an interesting photo as not too many show the cab end buckeye coupling in the lowered position very well; the inner ends had fixed buckeyes and buffing plates (as they lacked buffers). It also shows both cab end train air pipes to have red handles at that time.

 

As I am away from home this weekend there has been no further progress I'm afraid but I'm hoping to get the bodyshells finished this coming week, and perhaps sort the interiors.

 

Thanks,

Martyn.

[Signaller69]

Not had much free time this week but I have been messing around with headcode numbers and destinations. As usual these have been printed off my old PC onto white transfer film. They may be changed yet, particularly the destinations which should be a little bigger/ deeper letters, so will have to mess around with the font & character settings.

The other reasons for not much progress with the 303 are firstly, some remedial work on Crinan, and second, trying to finish a couple of new wagons ready for Crinan's outing to Wigan show:

These being a Parkside BR Shocvan (built pretty much as per the kit) and a Dapol Std Brake Van (moulded handrails removed and replaced with wire ones, etc). The latter will replace one of my much earlier efforts, and just needs the glazing finishing prior to fitting the roof. As for the former, well, I like vans!

[keefer]

Regarding the destination blinds, have a look at Iain Logan's Electric Soup website.

 

Destinations in old and new styles (note he states they are approx. twice full-size for 4mm scale and would need scaled down in MS Paint etc.):

 

http://homepages.enterprise.net/iainlogan/modelrail/free.html

 

 

As for the headcode numbers, i have no idea about the original font, but in 'Blue Train' days it changed to standard Gill Sans numbers as used on the 4-charcter headcode boxes (obviously scaled to fit the smaller headcode box):

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/4549162042/in/album-72157607267122063/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/3033316804/in/album-72157607267122063/

Edited September 20, 2018 by keefer

[Signaller69]

Regarding the destination blinds, have a look at Iain Logan's Electric Soup website.

 

Destinations in old and new styles (note he states they are approx. twice full-size for 4mm scale and would need scaled down in MS Paint etc.):

 

http://homepages.enterprise.net/iainlogan/modelrail/free.html

 

 

As for the headcode numbers, i have no idea about the original font, but in 'Blue Train' days it changed to standard Gill Sans numbers as used on the 4-charcter headcode boxes (obviously scaled to fit the smaller headcode box):

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/4549162042/in/album-72157607267122063/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/3033316804/in/album-72157607267122063/

Thanks Keefer, I will take a look at those links. As my old PC is not connected to the interweb I am a little limited by the available fonts, so it will have to be a case of best fit probably, although I have stacks of transfers which may provide something appropriate. I agree they are not particularly accurate as it stands. More playing around required I think!

 

Thanks,

Martyn.

[luckymucklebackit]

Just a note on the destination blinds, it was rare to just have the destination as per the "GLASGOW" shown in the photo, Most of the time it would be (for example) "Airdrie", with "via Singer" in small print below, after 1974 because of the increase in routes an auxiliary blind was fitted to the middle window.

 

Jim

[Signaller69]

Just a note on the destination blinds, it was rare to just have the destination as per the "GLASGOW" shown in the photo, Most of the time it would be (for example) "Airdrie", with "via Singer" in small print below, after 1974 because of the increase in routes an auxiliary blind was fitted to the middle window.

 

Jim

Thanks Jim, yes I need to try to find more examples that pre-date the extra auxiliary blind. The "Springburn" one is ok (style/size issues excepted) but I suspect the "Helensburgh" should have "Central" added underneath it. As these are reduced down to 2pt sizing they are almost impossible to read, which may actually be a blessing as any layout this is likely to run on will probably be a fictional terminus.

 

But I will have another play around and see what I can come up with.

 

Martyn.

 

Edit: thinking about it, I suspect the headcodes should be the same at each end on each journey? Both being changed at the end of the journey. Although it is common for modellers (and rtr manufacturers) to put different ones on each end. Thoughts anyone?

Edited September 21, 2018 by Signaller69

[Signaller69]

Had a brief play around with headcodes this afternoon, using "Modern" font which looked quite a good match on screen,for the destination lettering (though not the headcode numbers). Unfortunately at 2pt sizing it didn't print very well on the white Decal Paper, even with "bold" selected, nor even on the "high quality photo" setting (actually looks clearer in the photos than real life - on lower res settings it didn't come out white at all for some reason). It might be clearer in bold 3pt using a more condensed spacing, but this might be too large for any double row destinations to fit; I will have another look over the weekend.

[darrel]

Class 311103 bogie close ups

[Signaller69]

Class 311103 bogie close ups

Many thanks for sharing those images Darrel, the spring detail really shows well, very useful.

 

Best regards,

Martyn.

[Signaller69]

The 303 now has its identity! Having a good photo of unit 062 around the time I am modelling it, it made sense to model this; a quick check followed by a cross reference showed it formed of cars SC75772 (DTS), SC61838 (MBS) & SC75828 (BDTS). HMRS Pressfix transfers were used, including the set number on each end.

Some new headcodes have been printed off and will be applied tomorrow along with a sealing coat of varnish.

[Signaller69]

I have decided to go with slightly modified Kadee couplings on the 303. No.5 couplers (minus the draft gear box) were screwed solid straight onto the bogies on the Driving trailers; a little filing of the bufferbeams was required to ensure clearance. No.17 NEM Short couplers were plugged straight into the pockets on the Replica powered chassis of the centre Motor Brake, however before fitting they were glued solid to prevent unwanted movement (the NEM pocket being on a flexible mount and the slight pivotal movement in the knuckles still allows for curves), and all the tails were cut off to improve looks.

Just need to decide whether to go with cosmetic or functional couplers on the cab ends now.

[leopardml2341]

I guess that depends on whether you're gonna build owt to 'mu' it with?

 

Don't think these units hauled a tail load' as DMUs did, but no doubt someone will be along with the evidence the moment I click 'post'.

[Signaller69]

I guess that depends on whether you're gonna build owt to 'mu' it with?

 

Don't think these units hauled a tail load' as DMUs did, but no doubt someone will be along with the evidence the moment I click 'post'.

Hi Andy, to be honest I was more thinking about building a second unpowered centre car chassis, so it could be towed "across town" as happened with the real units until the gap between North and South Clyde electrification was eliminated of course. But this is only relevant if any future layout does not have catenary...

But that is looking unlikely!

[GordonC]

Sounds like a challenge to find photos of them towing anything

 

Hi Andy, to be honest I was more thinking about building a second unpowered centre car chassis, so it could be towed "across town" as happened with the real units until the gap between North and South Clyde electrification was eliminated of course. But this is only relevant if any future layout does not have catenary...
IMG_20180926_124332.jpg
But that is looking unlikely!

 

But were cars ever towed separately? I only ever remember seeing units travelling complete. I do remember seeing a photo of I think it was a Class 311 being towed by a steam engine en-route from Sheffield from delivery.

 

There is a similar thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/117912-glasgow-units-class-303-being-hauled/

[Titan]

Sounds like a challenge to find photos of them towing anything

 

 

But were cars ever towed separately? I only ever remember seeing units travelling complete. I do remember seeing a photo of I think it was a Class 311 being towed by a steam engine en-route from Sheffield from delivery.

 

There is a similar thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/117912-glasgow-units-class-303-being-hauled/

 

I think he means replacing the powered centre car with an unpowered one so that an unpowered 3 car can be hauled.

[Signaller69]

Sounds like a challenge to find photos of them towing anything

 

 

But were cars ever towed separately? I only ever remember seeing units travelling complete. I do remember seeing a photo of I think it was a Class 311 being towed by a steam engine en-route from Sheffield from delivery.

 

There is a similar thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/117912-glasgow-units-class-303-being-hauled/

Thanks for the Link Gordon.

 

Not aware of individual vehicles being moved on the "main line" but it probably wouldn't be impossible, though the inner ends having fixed buckeye couplings would mean a similarly equipped vehicle would be needed as an adapter, either with compatible brakes or else with a brake van at the rear running as a non-fitted freight movement presumably.

 

But they were regularly hauled across Glasgow in fixed unit formations to effect unit swaps; I have seen photos of brake vans being employed in this; I'm not sure why though if compatible locos were sourced? Unless a reversal was required en route possibly?

I think he means replacing the powered centre car with an unpowered one so that an unpowered 3 car can be hauled.

Correct. Sorry for any confusion!

[GordonC]

Thanks for the Link Gordon.

 

Not aware of individual vehicles being moved on the "main line" but it probably wouldn't be impossible, though the inner ends having fixed buckeye couplings would mean a similarly equipped vehicle would be needed as an adapter, either with compatible brakes or else with a brake van at the rear running as a non-fitted freight movement presumably.

 

But they were regularly hauled across Glasgow in fixed unit formations to effect unit swaps; I have seen photos of brake vans being employed in this; I'm not sure why though if compatible locos were sourced? Unless a reversal was required en route possibly?

 

Correct. Sorry for any confusion!

 

ah sorry, I thought you meant an individual centre car. If you've got an unpowered centre car then you might as well finish off another pair of driving ends for a 6 car set! ...

 

there was mention in that thread about a couple of modified Class 20s with high-level brake pipes and Westinghouse brake gear for pre-Argyle line days when the north and south electric lines were separate

[Signaller69]

ah sorry, I thought you meant an individual centre car. If you've got an unpowered centre car then you might as well finish off another pair of driving ends for a 6 car set! ...

 

there was mention in that thread about a couple of modified Class 20s with high-level brake pipes and Westinghouse brake gear for pre-Argyle line days when the north and south electric lines were separate

My thought was just to do an unpowered chassis with the power car body able to swap between powered and unpowered chassis depending on layout requirements, but in truth if I get around to building a small layout at home it will feature catenary anyway. I had previously been thinking of a depot layout whereby the unpowered unit scenario could have played out well.

[Signaller69]

Cab glazing experiments underway using curved parts of the clear packaging from "Poundland" "Bond Together" 2 part Epoxy Resin which has excellent clarity, held in place by a little Acrylic Matt varnish around the window edge. Drivers side not quite as good as the Secondman side but for a first go its not bad; it is easy enough to push out and replace if not quite right.

Edited September 28, 2018 by Signaller69

[Scottish Modeller]

Hi Martyn,

 

Still watching with interest!

 

So far I've built 9 303 units and still have another 3 to go.

 

Much like yourself - I found the curved windscreens a challenge.

 

In the end mine came from a pack of Tesco pate packaging.

 

Thanks