RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted November 7, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) Hello all, Apologies, I realised I meant to upload a better image showing the bogies.. Rapido are well known for their attention to detail in this area, and I have been very impressed with the bogies on the Pendolino (that feature separate dampers on every one) and I feel the 92 bogies and underframe details are looking similarly impressive. The actual third rail conductor shoes are not yet added. Cheers Ben A Edited November 7, 2016 by Ben A 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomag Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 I am hoping for 321 CAD images soon too, but we did ask the drawing office to prioritise the 92 a few weeks ago for obvious reasons. !Satire Alert! Is it because you already have our money for the 321s? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGR Hooper! Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Hello all, Apologies, I realised I meant to upload a better image showing the bogies.. IMG_4510.PNG Rapido are well known for their attention to detail in this area, and I have been very impressed with the bogies on the Pendolino (that feature separate dampers on every one) and I feel the 92 bogies and underframe details are looking similarly impressive. The actual third rail conductor shoes are not yet added. Cheers Ben A The wheels look nice and fine! RP25 standard? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted November 7, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2016 Sara - The wheels will be to RP25. Rapido's default mode is to specify models to NMRA standards unless - as with the NEM couplers which are a European (MOROP) design - we specify others. Bomag - Satire on/ That Was The CAD That Was /satire off. For avoidance of doubt: the Class 92 and the 321 are separate, ring-fenced projects. The reason we had for delaying the 92 was to give our main customer base (those who like us want modern WCML stuff) a bit of a financial break. But our hand was forced. And CADs are not the costly part. Cheers Ben A. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Hello all, Apologies, I realised I meant to upload a better image showing the bogies.. IMG_4510.PNG Rapido are well known for their attention to detail in this area, and I have been very impressed with the bogies on the Pendolino (that feature separate dampers on every one) and I feel the 92 bogies and underframe details are looking similarly impressive. The actual third rail conductor shoes are not yet added. Cheers Ben A Yum, yum! Nevertheless, I shan’t stray from 00. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jjb1970 Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2016 The CAD images look terrific, it's shaping up to be a first class model and makes me a bit envious of N modellers!! Good to see adoption of nice fine wheels. I think the poseable pantographs, I have some Japanese N gauge models and that has always been the Japanese approach. In N especially it allows for a much finer, more prototypical looking pantograph. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornish trains jez Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 (those who like us want modern WCML stuff) Absolutely right Ben! Just now need class 85's, 87's, 90's......... More EMU's, MK3 sleepers, MK4 stock, class 91's........oh the list is long!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Mike Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2016 I think the other point worth mentioning about the 320/321 and 92 is that the 320/321 is inevitably a more complex beast and even though we hadn't announced the 92 work was already underway in the background. Cheers, Mike 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Absolutely right Ben! Just now need class 85's, 87's, 90's......... More EMU's, MK3 sleepers, MK4 stock, class 91's........oh the list is long!!! 80, 81s, 82s, 83s but especially 91s and a whole train to go with them. (What have I said? Wait until I find out how much that would will cost.) 00 Decorum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigP Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 (edited) -- Edited January 31, 2021 by bigP Deleted 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomag Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 Ah, and those very lovely (and very different from the proposed Farish mk2F) aircon mk2D and mk2E coaches that ran on the West Coast in 3 or 4 liveries. Hint, hint. Nudge, nudge..... Paul As covered in a prototype thread Mk2ds were not that common on WCML services, neither were Mk2Es but these were regulars north of New Street on Cross Country services Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigP Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 (edited) -- Edited January 31, 2021 by bigP Deleted Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomag Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 (edited) Oh, I see I never realised Glasgow - Birmingham didn't classify as the WCML. Good job the 2D & 2E coaches delivered in '72 specifically for the Euston-Manchester/Liverpool* and Euston-Aberdeen/Inverness* services were never cascaded to other services when mk3s arrived. Otherwise people modelling other regions/areas might have reason to buy them as well. (* Michael Harris MK2 book) Dibs on modelling Tring then. Paul I have no problem in you defining WCML trains as you wish but generally it is considered to be services to/from Euston or other services mainly/solely on the WCML. Similarly CC trains to Newcastle and Scotland and Transpenine services are not normally considered ECML services. Given previous smart answers I said that they were not common on Euston services; I did not say they were never used. However, from the first use of wcml a/c stock (excluding Pullmans) until replacement by 390s something like 85% of train miles of day stock was Mk2F and Mk3 (there were still a lot of MK2c coaches on secondly services until the late 1980's). The WCML did receive some 1st class Mk2D coaches (no seconds) to upgrade remaining Mk1 first class stock (based on Mk1 transfers/withdrawals at the time) but they were mostly transferred within about 10 years. Similarly they got some Mk2e seconds but those not moved to CC services were mostly transferred to other regions. In terms of the services listed by Harris, while stock may have been ordered for specific services whether they ended up on them for any length of time is another matter - take the Mk3b BFOs which were touted as being produced for the all 1st class Manchester Pullmans but which had a multitude of drivers and were not introduced AFAIK until after the service went two class and they went to other uses e.g. The Mk3 Clansman set. Edited November 17, 2016 by Bomag Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornish trains jez Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 MK2 air cons were mostly used on Euston to Manchester/Liverpool services and the MK3's more generally on the Euston to Glasgow services. Not a rule of thumb though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted November 18, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 18, 2016 (edited) Hello all, We were invited to Brush's Loughborough works today to allow us to check a few dimensions and details to ensure our CADs are as accurate as possible. Present in the workshop were 92028 in freshly applied GBRF livery and 92018 in Caledonian Sleeper teal. The trip enabled us to check key dimensions and also ensure that the underframe detail (which is very important to Rapido and to us, as anyone who has seen our TEA tankers or Pendolino will know) is right. Brush have asked us not to upload any images on social media that show the inside of the workshops, and we are happy to comply. There is a full account of the trip on our website, although the photographs have been very carefully cropped to show details just of the locomotive and explain how they relate to the CADs we have. The designers in China will now check the dimensions we measured today against their designs and we are hoping to have final CAD drawings to show everyone at the Warley National Model Railway Show at the NEC next weekend where we will be on Stand C31 with Rapido Trains. We would like to thank everyone who has supported this project - and our others - and look forward to seeing people and answering any questions. Cheers Ben A. Edited November 18, 2016 by Ben A 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted November 18, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 18, 2016 Awesome! How are sales looking? Will come and have a chat at Warley, looking forward to it! Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted November 19, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) Hi Nick, Sales are encouraging, and we have seen patterns of ordering with the Pendolino and of course the TEAs and this experience makes us 90% confident this model will get from CAD to tooling, which is of course the big jump. Broadly speaking with previous projects we have seen early adopters who trust us to actually deliver models come in straight away, then we see another surge when CADs are done, plus at deadline points. We have not set any deadlines yet but we will do once the CADs are approved. Happy to chat more at Warley for anyone who has more questions. We are on stand C31 with Rapido, who have also sent us revised CADs this evening. These incorporate several improvements over the first iteration, but there is still a little work to do in a couple of key areas that we were able to measure at Brush. Recently we also had the opportunity to visit Polmadie depot where the Caledonian Sleeper and GBRf locomotives are maintained. This was interesting as one of the locos present was 92043 "Debussy" in the colours of Europorte 2, GBRf's former owners. Thanks to Tom Smith for this image. This can be modelled by anyone ordering the un-numbered triple grey variant, but of course is now a defunct livery as Europorte 2 have sold GBRf so I wonder if this is a prime candidate for a repaint into GBRf's own livery, or even the Hector Rail brand used by the new owners on the continent. Cheers Ben A. Edited November 19, 2016 by Ben A 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornish trains jez Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 Looking really good Ben! Can't wait to see the tooling on this. Amazing that that 92 still has depot plaques, must be the only one left of its kind. I'm coming up to the Warley exhibition next Saturday so will drop by and say hello. Best regards, Jeremy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGR Hooper! Posted November 20, 2016 Share Posted November 20, 2016 Superb! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eddie reffin Posted November 21, 2016 Share Posted November 21, 2016 Ben/Mike, That last CAD looks the mutts nuts. Really looking forward to seeing this coming to fruition. Superb work guys Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steadfast Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 Hi Ben and Mike. CAD for the 92 looks really very nice! Only think that jumps out (though I expect you've got it already!) is the silver blobs on the upper body side, some kind of transponder I think. The left hand one should be deleted and the right hand one on the CAD looks a little to close to the grills? I'm glad I've got my order in already Have a good weekend Jo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted November 24, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2016 Hi Jo, Thanks for that. The duplicate transponder has been removed, and the position does vary slightly: some have them nearer the grilles: https://flic.kr/p/qi78P5 We obviously can't tool different bodies for such a tiny detail, but what I will do is find photos of all the locos we are proposing and position it in the most common location, moving if necessary. I have had an updated CAD and will post some more images later when I get back. cheers Ben A. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted November 24, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2016 (edited) Hello all, So we are revising the CADs and this is the new iteration. After some debate we have decided to make the main cab windscreen glazing a single part. The window frames are moulded in relief, and will be printed black. This has two advantages: it ensures any prismatic effect is negligible, which is important when the windscreens are so large (and because of other planned features) and also means the centre pillar can be to scale; to mould properly the centre pillar would need to be overscale if it was part of the body. The roof details and pantographs are pretty much done now. There is a tiny alteration yet to be made to the front end, though we feel we are very close now. The bogies now have the separate brake details added, and we have taken the decision to mount the NEM socket on the bogie. This is because the end axle is very near the end of the locomotive. We did consider leaving the outer axle as an idler (effectively making the loco a Bo-Bo) to allow space for a body mounted coupler, but felt any advantages of body mounting the coupler (which are not as clear as on coaches, when gangways can be arranged to touch) were offset by the potential lack of power. One of our priorities is to ensure the model performs well - with a robust, heavy chassis block, cored motor and smooth drivetrain to all wheels - and we are reluctant to rush this area, or do anything to compromise this. I have also been sent another photo showing the "closer" transponder mounting position. Cheers Ben A. Edited November 24, 2016 by Ben A 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornish trains jez Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 Looking great Ben! Soon be ready for tooling! Class 87 and 90 next then!?! Best regards, Jeremy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steadfast Posted November 25, 2016 Share Posted November 25, 2016 Hi Jo, Thanks for that. The duplicate transponder has been removed, and the position does vary slightly: some have them nearer the grilles: https://flic.kr/p/qi78P5 I can well believe that level of variation across a supposedly standard design! I was only comparing to the Europorte 2 loco below the CAD image. The revised CAD looks even better, lovely jubbly! Jo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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