Smart Meter = smart move?

[Jonboy]

That’s one more than me, don’t know if living in a ground floor flat, or the economy 7 makes us too  difficult to deal with?

[Reorte]

On 31/08/2019 at 12:51, The Stationmaster said:

It really is a load of sentimentalised rubbish and it irritates n me very much.  It's almost as if those youngsters actually believe what they are saying.  And technically it's carp as well - the electricity industry knows exactly how much energy is being used and so do we if we look at the relevant website.  So a dumb meter won't tell them anything, they already know that demand goes up when folk put the kettle on during an ad break on the tv or when Sunday lunch is being cooked.  

 

I have no objection to "sentimental" - that's often used as a criticism but ultimately if something's not driven by sentiment then it's arbitrary (even motives like "it gets me more money" are a sentiment - I'd go as far as "this gets me what I need to survive" as being one, even though it's almost universally shared). The problem is a lack of deeper thought into those sentiments in issues like this though, rather too much just accepting being told what'll help to fulfil them, and what are worthwhile ones to hold in the first place.

[GeoffAlan]

On 12/04/2017 at 19:42, Dunsignalling said:

According to someone interviewed on a consumer programme the other day it will be better to wait - there is a second generation smart meter on the way that will work better - the ones fitted so far will need a software upgrade in a year or two to make them compatible with the revised standard. 

 

John

Speaking to a friend who recently left the technical side of the supply industry.....

 

Avoid 1st gen SM like Ebola, and the 2nd generation is less than perfect. Wait for the 3rd generation ones to come out, as they are supposed to be foolproof, universal, and still several years from introduction.

[caradoc]

Maybe I'm being simplistic, and perhaps it is technically not feasible, but given the way consumers are encouraged to switch energy suppliers for a better deal, would it not have made sense from the outset for Smart Meters to have been able to communicate with all suppliers, with a simple means of changing over if the consumer switches ?

[Bernard Lamb]

18 minutes ago, caradoc said:

Maybe I'm being simplistic, and perhaps it is technically not feasible, but given the way consumers are encouraged to switch energy suppliers for a better deal, would it not have made sense from the outset for Smart Meters to have been able to communicate with all suppliers, with a simple means of changing over if the consumer switches ?

Write out 100 times.

In this country we do not do joined up thinking.

 

I also thought that we no longer exploited children, but seeing the advert a few posts back it would appear not to be the case.

Bernard

 

 

[Mark Saunders]

10 minutes ago, Bernard Lamb said:

Write out 100 times.

In this country we do not do joined up thinking.

 

I also thought that we no longer exploited children, but seeing the advert a few posts back it would appear not to be the case.

Bernard

 

 

 

It is the exploitation of Adults via their Children but the whole point is the removal of cash rom unsuspecting/gullible adults/parents  wallets/bank accounts.

 

Mark Saunders 

[The Stationmaster]

2 hours ago, Reorte said:

 

I have no objection to "sentimental" - that's often used as a criticism but ultimately if something's not driven by sentiment then it's arbitrary (even motives like "it gets me more money" are a sentiment - I'd go as far as "this gets me what I need to survive" as being one, even though it's almost universally shared). The problem is a lack of deeper thought into those sentiments in issues like this though, rather too much just accepting being told what'll help to fulfil them, and what are worthwhile ones to hold in the first place.

If the things were promoted, with solid examples, as being something which will definitely save you money there would potentially be far more interest in them than the rather dodgy, and unsupportable, claim that they will save the planet.  As so many RMweb threads indicate a lot of people seem to regard saving money on purchases (of anything) as the final arbiter of choice.  But you'd have to be pretty dim to find a smart meter able to save you any money when 'off' switches are readily available on every electrical device in your home.

[alastairq]

1 hour ago, Mark Saunders said:

 

It is the exploitation of Adults via their Children but the whole point is the removal of cash rom unsuspecting/gullible adults/parents  wallets/bank accounts.

 

Mark Saunders 

 I agree...but, being a old person trying to adapt to the modern world...I adopt the selfish attitude of...the more gullible they are, then so what? Won't affect me! So, let them wallow in their gullibility....

[alastairq]

Has anyone thought of pressing the 'complaint' button on this advert?

 

After all, it seems assertions are made without providing facts?

Plus there's the use of children in promotion?

It would indeed be nice if the promotions company were forced to make a public withdrawal of the ad, and apologies for misleading [gullible? See above?] adults?

[Reorte]

15 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

If the things were promoted, with solid examples, as being something which will definitely save you money there would potentially be far more interest in them than the rather dodgy, and unsupportable, claim that they will save the planet.  As so many RMweb threads indicate a lot of people seem to regard saving money on purchases (of anything) as the final arbiter of choice.  But you'd have to be pretty dim to find a smart meter able to save you any money when 'off' switches are readily available on every electrical device in your home.

 

I completely agree. The problem isn't with the sentimental though, it's that what's being promoted doesn't actually do anything to achieve it (unless there are people who just like the idea of a world full of smart meters for its own sake).

 

Personally speaking I'm a depressed, grumpy so-and-so most of the time because of a disconnect between the world and what appeals to my sentiments - that's why I put so much store in what usually gets dismissed as "sentimental." But those promoting smart meters on the claimed grounds are making the mistake of believing they're a means to an end that they want. The error is in their reasoning, not their sentiment.

[PaulCheffus]

2 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

But you'd have to be pretty dim to find a smart meter able to save you any money when 'off' switches are readily available on every electrical device in your home.

Hi

 

Yes everyone knows how to switch off a item but that doesn't mean they will. A Smart Meter can show the difference between leaving it on and switching it off in real money.

 

When my children were younger they would walk into a room and put the light on. They would then leave the room without switching the light off. You could tell them time and time again to switch the light off but they took no notice. My daughter is now grown up with children of her own and they have a Smart Meter. She no longer leaves lights on and neither do her children as they have been shown the difference it makes on the Smart Meter.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

[boxbrownie]

6 hours ago, caradoc said:

Maybe I'm being simplistic, and perhaps it is technically not feasible, but given the way consumers are encouraged to switch energy suppliers for a better deal, would it not have made sense from the outset for Smart Meters to have been able to communicate with all suppliers, with a simple means of changing over if the consumer switches ?

Now your just being stupid, applying logic and common sense to a problem......

[Platform 1]

There's a helpful website that explains pretty much everything about Smart Meters - the tech page is at https://www.smartme.co.uk/technical.html

 

Elexon's roll-out report page is at https://www.elexon.co.uk/about/key-data-reports/smart-meter-technical-detail-report/

 

10 hours ago, caradoc said:

from the outset for Smart Meters to have been able to communicate with all suppliers

 

I believe the SMETS2 technical specs weren't fully agreed until some suppliers had already deployed significant numbers of smart meters.  Wanting to avoid re-work, suppliers tried to get ahead - hence the current (!) shambles.

 

[Dave47549]

.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Dave47549
Removed pointless guff

[PaulCheffus]

6 minutes ago, Dave47549 said:

 

Does that smart meter switch the light off when the room's unoccupied? 

 

My old (un)smart meter demonstrated energy wastage courtesy of a marked rotating wheel. It rotated faster when more electric was consumed, slower when things were switched off etc. And it didn't need biased propaganda for it either.

Hi

 

No but it shows the effect of switching it off.

 

I’m assuming you never had your old meter replaced with a digital one which doesn’t have a spinning wheel.

 

A seven year old will understand the cost far easier by using a smart meter than showing them a spinning disk.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

Edited September 2, 2019 by PaulCheffus

[Dave47549]

.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Dave47549
Removed pointless guff

[PatB]

On 01/09/2019 at 17:39, jjb1970 said:

 

When we have the media and politicians treating a 16 year old school girl with no scientific or technical expertise in any of the relevant subjects as the new messiah on climate change this comes as no surprise. 

 

Here's a conspiracy theory for you. The protests in Hong Kong are being funded by those wishing to silence Ms Thunberg. All the time the media are showing tear gas grenades bouncing off umbrellas they're not showing Greta.

 

You know it makes sense .

[jjb1970]

I have actually complained to my children's school about some of the utter nonsense they have been taught on environmental matters. Now don't get me wrong, I fully support teaching children about the importance of environmental protection, the threat of climate change etc and have no objection to schools promoting tree hugging. However in the same way that I object to bad science and blatant errors in basic math even when it supports something I like (such as reducing emissions) so I object to teachers teaching their pupils utter nonsense for the right reasons. It was the same meeting where I upset the school principal by saying that if they were going to enforce a strict uniform policy (which I support) then he and his staff should set an example rather than going into class in casual clothes and then demanding that the children wear blazer, tie etc. I don't think he likes me. 

[45156]

Getting back on topic a bit now.

 

I've had numerous phone calls, letters and e mails from Eon about the "need" to change to a smart meter and have explained to them on many occasions that because of the location of my gas meter, it is really not possible to fit a smart meter, but to no avail.  So I have now said they can come and fit these - so that they can see for themselves the impossibility of fitting this appliance at this property.  They are due this morning, and I expect them to be gone with a report about the impossibilty of doing a fit within ten minutes of arrival

[APOLLO]

First they came to read the gas meter
But they could not
Because I was not in (but I emailed the readings)

Then they came for the electric meter
But they could not
Because I was not in (but I emailed the readings)

Then they wrote to me about smart meters
And I did not reply
Because I was not interested

Then they phoned many times about the smart meters
And I did not have them fitted
Because I knew what was coming

Then they came for me, last one in the country without smart meters
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

 

And the bu88ers cut me off !!!!!!!!!!

Brit15

[Reorte]

1 hour ago, 45156 said:

Getting back on topic a bit now.

 

I've had numerous phone calls, letters and e mails from Eon about the "need" to change to a smart meter and have explained to them on many occasions that because of the location of my gas meter, it is really not possible to fit a smart meter, but to no avail.  So I have now said they can come and fit these - so that they can see for themselves the impossibility of fitting this appliance at this property.  They are due this morning, and I expect them to be gone with a report about the impossibilty of doing a fit within ten minutes of arrival

 

That could backfire on you if they find a way! Better just tell them "no" and don't bother explaining. Npower have stopped pestering me since I did that. AIUI they use some mobile network to send the data and there's precious little reception in the house so wouldn't work anyway. One of my neighbours let them turn up and they did, only to say they couldn't fit one anyway for that reason.

[Platform 1]

1 hour ago, Reorte said:

they use some mobile network to send the data and there's precious little reception in the house so wouldn't work anyway

 

Don't count on this - the newer SMETS2 can use a MESH network (peer-to-peer) that hops between nearby meters until it finds one with a mobile network connection.  Or they might fit an aerial!  They're out to get us...

 

[Reorte]

7 minutes ago, Platform 1 said:

 

Don't count on this - the newer SMETS2 can use a MESH network (peer-to-peer) that hops between nearby meters until it finds one with a mobile network connection.  Or they might fit an aerial!  They're out to get us...

 

It's a row on its own with the same sort of reception in all of them as far as I know. How many solid stone walls can the signals get through?

[caradoc]

3 hours ago, 45156 said:

Getting back on topic a bit now.

 

I've had numerous phone calls, letters and e mails from Eon about the "need" to change to a smart meter and have explained to them on many occasions that because of the location of my gas meter, it is really not possible to fit a smart meter, but to no avail.  So I have now said they can come and fit these - so that they can see for themselves the impossibility of fitting this appliance at this property.  They are due this morning, and I expect them to be gone with a report about the impossibilty of doing a fit within ten minutes of arrival

 

After switching to Eon I had a couple of emails about Smart Meters, but after I contacted them on line and explained the situation (the same issue as you 45156 !), I have had no further hassle.

 

[TheQ]

28 minutes ago, Platform 1 said:

 

Don't count on this - the newer SMETS2 can use a MESH network (peer-to-peer) that hops between nearby meters until it finds one with a mobile network connection.  Or they might fit an aerial!  They're out to get us...

 

If I got one it couldn't transmit because we can only get a moble signal upstairs facing a window that points to a mast many miles away through a small forest. it works sometimes..

The meter is a brick cupboard down stairs,  directly it would be transmitting at the slope up of our garden.

 it's got to go through  four more brick walls of our house, a 2 ft thick compressed mud garden wall. and then two garage walls then a house wall to get to the neighbours meter. Who's house is lower than ours.

To get from that house to the mast means 3 house walls, a hedge, a double unit mobile home , then off the small forest.

 

Good luck with that one..