More 3D - adding something new every week

[rue_d_etropal]

Looking at the brake coach on the Wisbech line, according to book it is a 22ft 8in one, same as was on Mid Suffolk, but the second set of doors start where middle compartment door starts. It lines up perfectly on drawing, but oddly there are 2 larger panels between doors(not 3 smaller ones as on Mid Suffolk one), and 3 at the end. It would not be that difficult to adapt the Mid Suffolk design, just needing doors moved and an end connecting door added. Obviously a conversion, buthow much of one?

[rue_d_etropal]

Thought I should plug the gap, so done the J70 loco(not dissimilar to the Y6, but there are suble differences), and also the brake coach, based my MSLR one, with doors in different place.I now need to finishoff the O and G1 versions of both the Y6 and J70.

[rue_d_etropal]

Sticking with eastern side of the country(I seem to have quite a few on list), the LNER Clayton steam railcar. This is the production version. I intend to also do the first one which was slightly different, and slightly shorter. Also the trailer coach. Possibly not the most successful design in reality, but still worthy of a model.

[rue_d_etropal]

The American style bogie coaches on the WCPR have been on my list for a while. Now feel more confident with curved shapes, so here it is. May offer the ironwork as a separate item, optionally , in fine plastic, to get it to look better, but not tooo bad in basic form.

Edited September 12, 2018 by rue_d_etropal

[Corbs]

You are a machine! Just keep adding stuff to my wishlist!

[rue_d_etropal]

Whilst I wait for a loco drawing I want to experiment with, I thouht I would do another EMU on my list. The loco is actually a Bullied, so a Bullied EMU seemed appropriate. This would be the double decker, code named 4DD.

Not a complex design especially as sides are flat. The upper windows extend into the roof, making that a possible problem for scratchbuilding.

Anyway I have done it.

Given that I grew up in the south east and never saw these in action(I did see the units when at Ashford), and I now live not far from where Bullied grew, it seemed right that I should 'preserve' them in miniature.

Edited September 16, 2018 by rue_d_etropal

[nick_bastable]

the devil on my shoulder says buy one fortunately the angel said its not listed 

[rue_d_etropal]

Hopefully listed soon. I only started the design today!

[Clive Mortimore]

Whilst I wait for a loco drawing I want to experiment with, I thouht I would do another EMU on my list. The loco is actually a Bullied, so a Bullied EMU seemed appropriate. This would be the double decker, code named 4DD.

Not a complex design especially as sides are flat. The upper windows extend into the roof, making that a possible problem for scratchbuilding.

Anyway I have done it.

Given that I grew up in the south east and never saw these in action(I did see the units when at Ashford), and I now live not far from where Bullied grew, it seemed right that I should 'preserve' them in miniature.

The top deck windows curve with the roof. https://www.google.com/search?q=4dd+emu&client=firefox-b&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiD44PMqcDdAhUMesAKHaueAcIQ_AUIDigB&biw=1366&bih=635

 

Drawings are in the Golding SR EMU book.

[rue_d_etropal]

The top deck windows curve with the roof. https://www.google.com/search?q=4dd+emu&client=firefox-b&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiD44PMqcDdAhUMesAKHaueAcIQ_AUIDigB&biw=1366&bih=635

 

Drawings are in the Golding SR EMU book.

They are cut into the roof, as per drawings in book, just not that clear in picture. The big problem in Golding's book is that drawings are not exactly to 4mm scale(in fact drawings are to slightly different scales!), so I had to adjust based on measurements. I always scan up to 7mm scale so itis not much effort.

[Kelly]

The top deck windows curve with the roof. https://www.google.com/search?q=4dd+emu&client=firefox-b&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiD44PMqcDdAhUMesAKHaueAcIQ_AUIDigB&biw=1366&bih=635

 

Drawings are in the Golding SR EMU book.

  

They are cut into the roof, as per drawings in book, just not that clear in picture. The big problem in Golding's book is that drawings are not exactly to 4mm scale(in fact drawings are to slightly different scales!), so I had to adjust based on measurements. I always scan up to 7mm scale so itis not much effort.

The Golding book is known to have a number of errors so shouldn't be used for the basis of drawing units from.

 

For the pre br units of the southern the best source is the Mike king drawings.

[Clive Mortimore]

  

The Golding book is known to have a number of errors so shouldn't be used for the basis of drawing units from.

 

For the pre br units of the southern the best source is the Mike king drawings.

I have that somewhere, thanks for reminding me. I thought it was a Stevens-Stratten  drawing, now I know why it wasn't in this Bulleid coach book.

[Kelly]

I have that somewhere, thanks for reminding me. I thought it was a Stevens-Stratten  drawing, now I know why it wasn't in this Bulleid coach book.

The stevens-stratten book is fine iirc, but is mostly the coaching stock with the early 4subs at the end iirc (not the original 3 units from the lswr (never called 3sub)).

[rue_d_etropal]

I have found 'errors' in many drawings, some official. I always try to use measurements as a start point,.

It's very easy to just say a set of drawings or a book of them can not be relied on, but no-one actually says exactly what is wrong. Same is said about some Skinley drawings, and again if someone knows if an error, come forward and say exactly what it is.

Problems are mainly with older prototypes, as many of the drawngs found are ones that have been done from photos, ie interpreted. That is assuming there are enough decent photos to work from, and they are taken from all sides. One reason I don't put all the small detail on my designs is that I would rather leave it up to the modeller, and some might not quite be correct on some drawings.

Having said that I have come across some drawings so obviously not correct.

Big advantage of 3D printing is that it is far easier to fix errors in design.

[Budgie]

How do you fancy doing some Bulleid 4SUBs?

[rue_d_etropal]

How do you fancy doing some Bulleid 4SUBs?

They don't look too difficult, just a lot of variants.

[Kelly]

I have found 'errors' in many drawings, some official. I always try to use measurements as a start point,.

It's very easy to just say a set of drawings or a book of them can not be relied on, but no-one actually says exactly what is wrong. Same is said about some Skinley drawings, and again if someone knows if an error, come forward and say exactly what it is.

Problems are mainly with older prototypes, as many of the drawngs found are ones that have been done from photos, ie interpreted. That is assuming there are enough decent photos to work from, and they are taken from all sides. One reason I don't put all the small detail on my designs is that I would rather leave it up to the modeller, and some might not quite be correct on some drawings.

Having said that I have come across some drawings so obviously not correct.

Big advantage of 3D printing is that it is far easier to fix errors in design.

There has been discussion about the books errors elsewhere on here, I can't say myself as I'm not well enough versed in the subject. But an example is the 2bil drawing, compared to pictures and Mike king drawings the windows are too small and out by a scale foot or more. The other problems come from the decision to use vector drawing. There are two brass kits for the 4dd available, one from Marc models, but not available as a kit anymore due to the difficulty of getting the curves right, and available from worsely works as a set of sides, roof and ends.

 

It would be great if you did the bogies as well, as they're unique to the unit. Getting the correct wheel size is a potential issue however.

 

The suggestion for a bulleid 4sub (and follow with a bulleid 4epb as it developed from the 4subs) is a good one. Following from that the bulleid 2hal potentially. There are photos of all of these from my visits to the ERM in Coventry (before it closed and the collection dispersed around the country) on my Flickr, if you decide to look at them and want higher resolution images from my Flickr feel free to ask.

[rue_d_etropal]

I am mainly looking at less common designs, and covering most of the country.

The vector technique might explain the odd curve shape in printing. As I said, I only use drawings as a guide, but would prefer a specfic list of errors in drawings, than a general comment. I have sen older posts and think tose are general as well.

As for the bogies, I don't tend to do those, as most modellers adapt what is available. My aim is to get designs out there for as many people as possible( the type that used to be referred to as the 'average modeller', until that term became abused, and most modellers adapt r2r bogies(even for kits), as they run better. 

[Budgie]

I am mainly looking at less common designs, and covering most of the country.

Could you make an exception for the 4Sub in 4mm scale? Please? Pretty please?

 

I (and no doubt several/many others) would be eternally grateful.

[chris p bacon]

 As I said, I only use drawings as a guide, but would prefer a specfic list of errors in drawings, than a general comment.

 

 

I've found the best way to find errors is to assemble all the available information and study it, Try visiting the NRM or TNA Kew and studying the rolls for GA's, it's fascinating.

[Kelly]

I am mainly looking at less common designs, and covering most of the country.

The vector technique might explain the odd curve shape in printing. As I said, I only use drawings as a guide, but would prefer a specfic list of errors in drawings, than a general comment. I have sen older posts and think tose are general as well.

As for the bogies, I don't tend to do those, as most modellers adapt what is available. My aim is to get designs out there for as many people as possible( the type that used to be referred to as the 'average modeller', until that term became abused, and most modellers adapt r2r bogies(even for kits), as they run better.

 

With the dd, there is nothing that can be adapted really as they're unique to the units due to the size.

[rue_d_etropal]

Just had a measure up against my Hornby 2BIL(that matches drawings in book, so not sure how window size is incorrect in drawings?), and the bogie sides would satisfy most people. I have done bogie sides for some other  models myself in HO, which fit to sides of motor unit. Good enough for me, and most people. If people are prepared to accept they are running on wrong gauge then they should be happy to compromise on other detail.

I also now tend to use the phrase 'aid to scratchbuilding', which is how someone described 3D printing when I started. It is not meant to be a complete model, but something that helps as many people as possile. It fits between r2r and kit/scratchbuilding.

[Kelly]

Just had a measure up against my Hornby 2BIL(that matches drawings in book, so not sure how window size is incorrect in drawings?), and the bogie sides would satisfy most people. I have done bogie sides for some other models myself in HO, which fit to sides of motor unit. Good enough for me, and most people. If people are prepared to accept they are running on wrong gauge then they should be happy to compromise on other detail.

I also now tend to use the phrase 'aid to scratchbuilding', which is how someone described 3D printing when I started. It is not meant to be a complete model, but something that helps as many people as possile. It fits between r2r and kit/scratchbuilding.

It may have been a different unit, my memory can be faulty at times.

 

As for bogies, I meant sides rather than a complete bogie.

[nick_bastable]

It may have been a different unit, my memory can be faulty at times.

 

As for bogies, I meant sides rather than a complete bogie.

BR / SR bogie overlays would be most useful 

 

Nick

[rue_d_etropal]

Trouble with bogies, even just their sides is having enough detail. I can do basic ones which are good enough for me in HO, but to do a better design I would require decent drawings. I am also not just designing for 4mm/ft, but other scales, and in those many are less concerned.

With my other designs, many with unique styles of bogie, most have been happy to do their own thing. I don't see why that should be different here. Putting smaller wheels in bogie actually reduces height, with a few mods, not much and it is pretty close. Any reasonably modeller should be able to do that.