Hills of the North - The Last Great Project

[LNER4479]

Now then, forgive me for getting just a tad excited ...

 

Apologies for poor lighting. Just a quick snap from 1am this morning (!)

 

Yes - we have one quarter of a roundhouse!

 

Set desired road ...

 

Loco moves on to 'table

 

Turns to line up with exit track.

 

And moves off to pick up southbound working (or at least it will once the track beyond is connected up!)

 

In truth, only the tracks on the turntable are energised at the moment. I'm going to wire up these six roads first as a bit of a test to try and identify any pitfalls [sic].

 

More soon 

 

[LNER4479]

Meanwhile

 

More work required at Carlisle No.13 to complete the installation down that end.

 

Here's the little problem. Installation of the headshunt gets in the way of the rodding to the pointwork. And the rodding is required because some fool planned all this to be located on a bridge (meaning that point motors mounted directly underneath is not an option 🙄)

One can be operated using one of those handy 'side on' Peco motors; the other works as part of a crossover so is being rodded from the other point. A rather satisfying, albeit time-consuming and fiddly, way of doing it, using the tried and trusted GEM cranks.

 

As this is all somewhat remote from the operating position then I've set up this interim lever frame installation. It can't go there ultimately as that's where the M&C trackbed goes(!) but most of the wiring at the other end is permanent. Long loops left at this end for now pending final installation.

 

And there we have it (for now). Carlisle No.13 pretty much as it will be. The motors for the two trap points can wait for now - their absence does not hinder immediate operations.

You can see from this pic how the two points concerned are unwittingly plumb dead centre on the bridge over the M&C tracks.

 

A close up of the rodding arrangement.

 

And another, to prove it works! Which - dare I say it myself - it does, rather well.

 

More soon - most of this new trackwork is now live. I'll do a demo post once it's completed.

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by LNER4479

[lezz01]

The way I see it is you have two options. Either make the head shunt shorter by the length of the buffer stop or make the head shunt an inch longer so that the rodding runs either side of it.

Regards Lez.  

[Tortuga]

24 minutes ago, lezz01 said:

The way I see it is you have two options. Either make the head shunt shorter by the length of the buffer stop or make the head shunt an inch longer so that the rodding runs either side of it.

Regards Lez.  

Is there clearance to mount the rodding underneath the board?

[LNER4479]

All done now chaps - ain't gonna change.

 

The length of the headshunt is critical. The first associated point leads into the carriage shed - the headshunt as laid will take a smallish tender loco (a 4F was used to size up) plus 4 local coaches (57/60ft) which is practical for ECS workings to / from Citadel. (my Upperby carriage shed will be two-road, approx 6 coaches in each round. Used for stabling local sets only).

 

[LNER4479]

And so the current bout of wire strangling on the new Upperby running lines is complete.

 

By way of demonstration...

 

The Upperby operator gets control of a train from a handover length of track just before Carlisle No.13. Here, the demonstration train turns off the mainline and accesses the down goods reception line (despite it being a rake of coaches in this instance!). Independent goods lines immediately behind the train.

 

Train comes to a stand at Upperby Junction (Carlisle No.12). Direct access in to the main Upperby goods yard was not possible, so far as I can make out, so ...

 

Train then moves forward straight across the junctions to access the lines that eventually led to Crown Street Goods Depot. This is a somewhat simplified arrangement compared to the prototype (believe it or not) but is the only way I can figure out how to get the train into the yard. It's a single track arrangement on the model but it'll open out into a double track formation.

 

A second loco then hauls the vehicles across into the main yard area, accessed from the so called 'third line' which on my scheme serves as the headshunt.

 

With the train set back into the yard, the released loco can reverse out, in this case using an alternative route into the yard area.

 

And makes its way on to the shed ... except at this point it grinds to a halt. For now.

 

Depot wiring to follow shortly.

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by LNER4479

[Tony Teague]

On 28/10/2023 at 23:54, Tony Teague said:

 

I am very comfortable with electrics, but a bit allergic to electonics where I don't understand what is going on, so whilst my layout and control of it are complex, almost all of it relies on fairly traditional switching.

There isn't really a special design, it's just an extension of normal / basic switching in which one lever or switch on the panel operates multiple devices by firing one or more relays.

I use Gaugemaster GM500 relays which are latching, and can be triggered using the same voltage as used to fire a solenoid point motor - so they are literally wired in parallel with those, and sometimes they are in multiple.

I use them to change polarity, to light indicator lamps on the control panel, to switch off the feed to conflicting tracks, and even to reverse the polarity of servo feeds so as to raise or lower semaphore signals that reflect the direction of the point setting.

They use very little current and so I have locations where my CDU might be powering 2 or 3 solenoids plus 2 or three relays with one pulse.

When combined with the DCC Concepts lever switches, which have both passing contacts and two on/off switches (or one to reverse polarity), so these together offer fairly flexible / powerful switching options.

Hope that helps but happy to clarify or respond to any other points if wanted.

Tony

 

If I may just divert back to my previous post on the subject of using the Gaugemaster relays and in case anyone is minded to try out what I have suggested, I omitted one key detail in terms of how I went about it.

When I first used these it was at the suggestion of two guys who were hepling me with the layout at the time, and they had considerable experience in using these in the way that I was proposing.

What they told me was that the relays worked more consistently and reliably if two resistors on the relay circuit board were removed; I have no idea, or can't recall what they said about how they behave without this modification but every one of the 60+ of these relays on my layout has been doctored in this way - see image.

 

 

The two black wires to the right have replaced two resistors that come built into each relay board and whilst I am certain that this negates any warranty, I can say that (touch wood) all of those that I have installed are continuing to work well and I have so far had no failures.

I give no warranty to those either following or ignoring my advice!😁

Tony

 

[Clive Mortimore]

2 hours ago, Tony Teague said:

 

If I may just divert back to my previous post on the subject of using the Gaugemaster relays and in case anyone is minded to try out what I have suggested, I omitted one key detail in terms of how I went about it.

When I first used these it was at the suggestion of two guys who were hepling me with the layout at the time, and they had considerable experience in using these in the way that I was proposing.

What they told me was that the relays worked more consistently and reliably if two resistors on the relay circuit board were removed; I have no idea, or can't recall what they said about how they behave without this modification but every one of the 60+ of these relays on my layout has been doctored in this way - see image.

 

 

The two black wires to the right have replaced two resistors that come built into each relay board and whilst I am certain that this negates any warranty, I can say that (touch wood) all of those that I have installed are continuing to work well and I have so far had no failures.

I give no warranty to those either following or ignoring my advice!😁

Tony

 

I have done a similar mod on some of mine and it does improve them.

 

I use them as they can be mounted somewhere accessible unlike Peco's own switches or micro switches which are attached to the point motor, mine are in the control box.

 

 

[Tony Teague]

1 hour ago, Clive Mortimore said:

I have done a similar mod on some of mine and it does improve them.

 

I use them as they can be mounted somewhere accessible unlike Peco's own switches or micro switches which are attached to the point motor, mine are in the control box.

 

Yes, some of mine are close to the pointwork, e.g. those used for polarity switching. whilst there is a bank of them inside the control panel fro such things as changing panel light indications - but anywhere from the trigger switch to the device they are mimicking works fine.

Glad to know I am not alone!

Tony

[LNER4479]

On 22/07/2023 at 07:18, LNER4479 said:

 

This also on the workbench(!)

 

On 22/07/2023 at 07:39, Enterprisingwestern said:

Fake news, everybody knows Jidenco kits are unbuildable, people even say so on RMWeb!

 

On 22/07/2023 at 08:32, St Enodoc said:

Well, he's hardly started this one...

 

Anyhow, you were saying ...

 

Picked this up again a few weeks ago. Doors thickened by soldering scrap etch on the back.

 

Side detail added; end detail prepared. 

 

Roof was just a thin piece of plasticard - no way of actually attaching it! I soldered on some tabs from scrap etch and reinforced the plasticard from below 

 

And there we have it.

 

If I'm allowed to say, I don't think it looks too bad? According to Jenkinson, they lasted till at least the late 1950s so it's going in the 🐠 train. So there.

 

A nice simple Parkside kit next up!

[Enterprisingwestern]

7 hours ago, LNER4479 said:

 

 

 

Anyhow, you were saying ...

 

Picked this up again a few weeks ago. Doors thickened by soldering scrap etch on the back.

 

Side detail added; end detail prepared. 

 

Roof was just a thin piece of plasticard - no way of actually attaching it! I soldered on some tabs from scrap etch and reinforced the plasticard from below 

 

And there we have it.

 

If I'm allowed to say, I don't think it looks too bad? According to Jenkinson, they lasted till at least the late 1950s so it's going in the 🐠 train. So there.

 

A nice simple Parkside kit next up!

 

To my BR van aligned eye, it don't half look strange with only half the sides framed!, was there a particular reason for this?

 

Mike.

[Flying Fox 34F]

Mike,

 

The sliding door would have to built further out to clear any external framing, so the framing was provided internally.

Now why all the framing isn’t internal is unusual, but probably related to vehicle capacity.  Look at this way, we’ve ended up with a nice quirky van!

 

Paul

[Compound2632]

10 minutes ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

To my BR van aligned eye, it don't half look strange with only half the sides framed!, was there a particular reason for this?

 

Standard late Midland / LMS arrangement - nothing quirky to it. As @Flying Fox 34F wrote as I was typing (I've started so I'll finish), the right hand side has to be free of projections to allow the door to slide across it.

[LNER4479]

Back at the layout ... more excitement 😃

 

 

 

[Sasquatch]

That's well smooth! 😁

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

Yay, a magic roundabout, although you could do with turning the background music up a notch or two!

Also, if I'm being hypercritical, I don't reckon much to the shed building in the background.

 

Mike.

[Barry O]

On 08/11/2023 at 22:13, Sasquatch said:

That's well smooth! 😁

The Heljan turntables are very smooth.. and quiet. Big enough to get a Princess or Duchess turned easily.

Not cheap but.. easy to operate.

 

Baz

[Compound2632]

2 hours ago, Barry O said:

Big enough to get a Princess or Duchess turned easily.

 

i.e. too big?

[LNER4479]

Yes, but ...

 

Practicalities come into play with my Upperby roundhouse. It is in the corner of the room and will not be easily accessible. Exact positioning of a largely wheelbase loco on the 'table will not be easy, so some latitude is essential if we are not going to forever be stopping the layout to retrieve locos that have been derailed by the movement of the table, caught other locos stabled as they spin round, etc. In contrast, the lengths of the stalls will be as shorter - basically, the instruction will be to buffer up a large loco against the shed wall - so the overall footprint will actually be smaller that the real thing. An overhead camera / screen is envisaged to aid use.

 

It's (allegedly) 90ft in HO which is 79(-ish) ft in OO so not too bad.

 

Other turntables on the layout, that are more accessible will be to scale length.

[Enterprisingwestern]

10 minutes ago, LNER4479 said:

Yes, but ...

 

Practicalities come into play with my Upperby roundhouse. It is in the corner of the room and will not be easily accessible. Exact positioning of a largely wheelbase loco on the 'table will not be easy, so some latitude is essential if we are not going to forever be stopping the layout to retrieve locos that have been derailed by the movement of the table, caught other locos stabled as they spin round, etc. In contrast, the lengths of the stalls will be as shorter - basically, the instruction will be to buffer up a large loco against the shed wall - so the overall footprint will actually be smaller that the real thing. An overhead camera / screen is envisaged to aid use.

 

It's (allegedly) 90ft in HO which is 79(-ish) ft in OO so not too bad.

 

Other turntables on the layout, that are more accessible will be to scale length.

 

The track gauge is a couple of mil out so what's 10 mil on a turntable?

Asking for a friend!!

 

Mike.

[LNER4479]

Sorry Mike - if that's a question for me to ask then I don't fully understand the question? (my bad)

[Graham T]

I suspect there is some allusion being made to the EM fraternity...

[Compound2632]

42 minutes ago, Graham T said:

I suspect there is some allusion being made to the EM fraternity...

 

00 is at its best seen side-on.

[Clive Mortimore]

58 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

00 is at its best seen side-on.

Hi Stephen

 

I have edited your post so it now makes sense. 🫤

[Enterprisingwestern]

6 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Stephen

 

I have edited your post so it now makes sense. 🫤

 

Taxi for Mortimore!

 

 

Mike.