sem34090's Workbench, Layout and General Wittering

[Lu4472ke]

 

Edited March 19, 2018 by lukeknights4472

[sem34090]

The thread may carry on...

 

But no confused cats, Semprini, silly walks, parrots, fish or cartoons. By order.

Or Icelandic for that matter.

[RedGemAlchemist]

Right, I'm stopping this thread! It's Silly! And rather suspect if you ask me!

 

With apologies to the great Monty Python...

 

Ekki viss um hvaða tungumál það er, en google segir mér að það sé íslenskt. Ég geri ráð fyrir að það þýðir að ég sé vanhæfur? Eða fæ ég aukalega stig fyrir að hafa truflað svar á íslensku? Hins vegar er það allt í London, Chatham og Dover, en að minnsta kosti er það ekki Suður-Austurlöndum. Engu að síður fæ ég fyndið einkunn fyrir að reyna að skrifa um fyrirframgreiðslu járnbrautir á íslensku? Eða hef ég tekið brandara of langt?

The illusion is complete; it is reality, the reality is illusion and the ambiguity is the only truth. But is the truth, as Hitchcock observes, in the box? No there isn't room, the ambiguity has put on weight. The point is taken, the elk is dead, the beast stops at Swindon, Chabrol stops at nothing, I'm having treatment and La Fontaine can get knotted.

 

Sorry, I had to   I am a very silly man.

Edited March 19, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist

[BlueLightning]

It isn't Gaelic or Icelandic!!

 

Although I assume Alex now knows what it is. My knowledge of said language is just one of my many weird skills!!!

 

Gary

 

I notice that google translate thinks it is Icelandic so maybe Alex doesn't know!!!!!

Edited March 19, 2018 by BlueLightning

[sem34090]

So my post was pointless...

[RedGemAlchemist]

How much of the sermonising and racism do you have to plough through first?

 

That was what I wanted to focus on; I wanted to look at the Railway Series, most specifically 'The Three Railway Engines' and 'Troublesome Engines' and to analyse the texts focusing on the character interactions.

 

Postcolonial theory could be applied to the notion of 'dirty diesels' and the influx of West Indies workers in traditional working-class roles such as locomotive drivers and bus drivers, class (big locomotives being none too keen on their having to work goods and also being more intelligent than the smaller locomotives, as demonstrated in 'Troublesome Engines' where the larger or older locomotives discuss holding a deposition) and gender; the coaches are always women and if accompanying a character such as Thomas (i.e. Annie and Clarabel) they're typically more childish and 'wilting' compared to the ladylike, respect-demanding and mature mainline coaches.

 

Exactly what I was on about. Once you get past the undeniable nostalgia - and let's be honest, isn't the Railway Series the foundation of probably some 90% of RMWeb's interest in the subject of railways, myself included? - it is very much a product of its time, at least as far as W. Awdry's work on the series is concerned, and this fact cannot be simply swept away. 

Edited March 19, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist

[RedGemAlchemist]

Yes, apologies sem. These things belong on other parts of the site.

[BlueLightning]

I shall also add my apologies, any further guesses can be sent by PM!

 

Gary

[sem34090]

Anything goes in... Anything goes out...

 

Fish, Bananas, Old Pyjamas, Mutton, Beef and Trout...

 

Repeat Ad Nauseum

[sem34090]

Anyway, I have proven myself to be a big-mouth on account of my having more posts than many of you!

 

So...

 

Where were we?

 

G6, T3, T14, Parrots, Language... erm...

[RedGemAlchemist]

I believe the last post before it all got very strange was:

 

That decapod below yonder Hill is small, this Manning Wardle we’re standing on is big.

[sem34090]

Ah yes, Manning Wardles and Decapod...

 

Both are on 'the list'!

 

Though Minerva's latest announcement makes me wish they were a 4mm manufacturer... I may just need to go 7mm...

[BlueLightning]

Funny you should mention them! I think my Dapol Terrier needs a friend!

 

Gary

[Freightliner Class 66]

Ge sagu orgilde snell scôlere, gên ðæge pro eardian and n¯ænig pro æfnung clipian birihte duguð dafen Englisc fær

 

Gary

 

10 points to whoever can translate that!! 1 point to anyone that knows what language it is!! Using Google disqualifies you!!

 

anglo-saxon, no google.

[BlueLightning]

Now translate it!!!

 

Gary

 

sârig Sir Eustace!!

[Regularity]

Postcolonial theory could be applied to the notion of 'dirty diesels' and the influx of West Indies workers in traditional working-class roles such as locomotive drivers and bus drivers, class (big locomotives being none too keen on their having to work goods and also being more intelligent than the smaller locomotives, as demonstrated in 'Troublesome Engines' where the larger or older locomotives discuss holding a deposition) and gender; the coaches are always women and if accompanying a character such as Thomas (i.e. Annie and Clarabel) they're typically more childish and 'wilting' compared to the ladylike, respect-demanding and mature mainline coaches.

Well, in Henry the Green Engine, in the story ‘Henry’s Sneeze’, the story now ends with the boys running home “as black as soot”. I have in my possession a 1969 reprint of a 1967 edition, and the last word in that phrase is similar to the name of a State/River in Africa (Niger) but has an extra “g”.

By the 60s, I think it was generally accepted that the “n-word” was offensive, but more than that, this was a clergyman writing, not some retired major born and bred into the British Indian Army...

Then there are the Scottish Twins, Donald and Douglas, portrayed as fond of a good sing-song but also clearly portrayed as heavy bruisers, seeing as they were built in Glasgow.

[RedGemAlchemist]

Well, in Henry the Green Engine, in the story ‘Henry’s Sneeze’, the story now ends with the boys running home “as black as soot”. I have in my possession a 1969 reprint of a 1967 edition, and the last word in that phrase is similar to the name of a State/River in Africa (Niger) but has an extra “g”.

By the 60s, I think it was generally accepted that the “n-word” was offensive, but more than that, this was a clergyman writing, not some retired major born and bred into the British Indian Army...

Then there are the Scottish Twins, Donald and Douglas, portrayed as fond of a good sing-song but also clearly portrayed as heavy bruisers, seeing as they were built in Glasgow.

Hmm. Wasn't aware of that first bit. My copy (from the early 90s) has the edited one.

And to be fair that stereotype of Glasgow, and Scotland in general, is still very prevalent today.

Edited March 19, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist

[sem34090]

Of course my usernamesake is horrified at one of the latest additions to what was once the Railway Series:

The could've at least done the proper colour scheme!

I don't keep up with TTTE junk stuff, but it seems they even managed to ruin 'Aerolite' - something I thought was impossible!

 

[Regularity]

I am not alone in viewing TTTE as somewhat detrimental to our hobby and how it is perceived.

 

I may be alone in having the cajones to say so in public.

 

Hmm. Wasn't aware of that first bit. My copy (from the early 90s) has the edited one.

Always go back to the original source where possible.

And to be fair that stereotype of Glasgow, and Scotland in general, is still very prevalent today.

Doesn’t stop it being patronising.

[sem34090]

It's very much a double-edged sword - It is a major channel through which at least some children remain interested in railways, but the adult 'fanhood' don't really help the image of the hobby.

[RedGemAlchemist]

I am not alone in viewing TTTE as somewhat detrimental to our hobby and how it is perceived.

 

I may be alone in having the cajones to say so in public.

 

It's very much a double-edged sword - It is a major channel through which at least some children remain interested in railways, but the adult 'fanhood' don't really help the image of the hobby.

 

I totally agree. The Railway Series, while far, FAR from perfect and somewhat dated at times, still on the whole deserves its reverence in railway culture. The TV show on the other hand is just a mess of pandering and corporate money-grubbing done by people who don't really care about the source material and I would LOVE to see someone try and prove me otherwise.

 

 

Doesn’t stop it being patronising.

 

No. No it doesn't. I am merely saying that W. Awdry, who probably had never actually been to Scotland for any real length of time, was simply copying an already well-used stereotype of the time that still exists today. Doesn't make it right, I'm just acknowledging it wasn't entirely his fault.

That being said, at least he apologised for the Henry's Sneeze incident. That doesn't make what he said right either but at least he acknowledged he made an error which is better than nothing and better than can be said for the depiction of Donald and Douglas and also several of the other things AVS1998 mentioned.

Awdry was human and thus flawed like the rest of us. And at least he was less controversial than Ernest Hemingway and Ian Fleming, two writers whose work is also still held in high regard despite also being home to many very outdated views.

Edited March 20, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist

[Annie]

When my children were small we would watch TTTE together on the telly, but it was the nice original Ringo Starr narrated version and definitely not any of the later strangeness that bears no relation to the original Railway Series.  My children just about knew the original Railways Series books by heart and they loved them.  On the question of 'Colonial' and 'Empire' attitudes towards other races and women they were commonplace in a lot of books and children's books of the time.  I'm not defending them, I'm just saying that in sociological terms it was simply the nature of the era in which they were written and printed.  When I was a much younger girl we had a set of  official government printed New Zealand encyclopaedias at home that largely depicted Maori as a bunch of happy go lucky brown folk who were a bit simple minded and weren't expected to amount to much, - so many of those old attitudes were fairly pervasive.

[RedGemAlchemist]

When my children were small we would watch TTTE together on the telly, but it was the nice original Ringo Starr narrated version and definitely not any of the later strangeness that bears no relation to the original Railway Series.  My children just about knew the original Railways Series books by heart and they loved them.  On the question of 'Colonial' and 'Empire' attitudes towards other races and women they were commonplace in a lot of books and children's books of the time.  I'm not defending them, I'm just saying that in sociological terms it was simply the nature of the era in which they were written and printed.  When I was a much younger girl we had a set of  official government printed New Zealand encyclopaedias at home that largely depicted Maori as a bunch of happy go lucky brown folk who were a bit simple minded and weren't expected to amount to much, - so many of those old attitudes were fairly pervasive.

Exactly my point. And look at the way we today view some foreign cultures here in Britain today - ultimately we're no better.

And also, I did when I was a child. Thankfully I stopped watching about Series 4 before it all started going downhill. 

 

Man, this conversation is interesting.

Edited March 20, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist

[Freightliner Class 66]

I am not alone in viewing TTTE as somewhat detrimental to our hobby and how it is perceived.

 

I may be alone in having the cajones to say so in public.

 

yes well i think attitudes like yours are detrimental to the hobby and how it is perceived! for whatever faults it has, the rws and tvs have both been hugely important and inspirational in getting generations of children into railways and then ultimately the hobby itself. and that goes for me as well. i grew up with both the books and the original television series and it was what gave me my love of railways, and if i wanted to model something from the thomas universe then i should be allowed to without the fear that i'm going to be looked down on by people with a superior attitude and made to feel like i am in some way harming the hobby!!

 

i spend a lot of my time on social media and on there are some absolutely fantastic modellers making amazing representations of places and characters from both rws and tvs, but according to you they are a detriment to the hobby. it's no wonder they tend to stay away from forums like this when there are people with such deplorable attitudes on them. what are you going to do, tell someone with autism that they are wrong and stupid for still liking the ttte universe even as an adult? are you going to look down on them too?

 

on the subject of the fandom, i agree that it is a very strange and toxic place at times, but then so is rmweb! as far as fandoms are concerned, blame the people not the source material.

 

weather you like it or not the future of this hobby is going to be the generations who grew up with ttte, and that is fine with me because whatever gets more young people into modelling, visiting preserved railways, and learning about this countries railway history should never be looked down on or belittled. if people want the hobby to stay as some sort of racially pure "you must hate ttte this much to enter" club, then I hope it dies out one day. i would never want to be a part of that.

 

i am 29. i have apsergers, i did my degree in railway history and have had a railway related job and no one is going to convince me otherwise that ttte has had anything but a positive effect on my life and my time in the hobby!

[sem34090]

Some interesting posts there...

 

As I think I've said before, my first introduction to the SECR, LBSCR, NLR and LSWR was through the Railway Series, so best not to knock it too much!

 

It is vital that it continues, for the sake of the hobby, and of late it has (I looked into it a bit more last night whilst sleepless!), I believe, had to dispatch two original characters (cannot remember their names off the top of my head...) in favour of two, new, Female ones. Now I can see both sides of this, but when something has been around, albeit much altered (Like all locos!) for well over 70,years then I can get that people are worked up about it.

 

Personally, the Bulleid is a bit annoying because it will now become a common line when I'm wandering around the shed at the Bluebell or the yard at Ropley, to hear children referring to 'Blackmoor Vale' or 'Wadebridge' by the new characters name. It's bad enough with Stepney, and as far as I know that one hasn't appeared for many a year! Nobody highlights 'Primrose', 'Bluebell', 'Adams', 'Cromford' or 'Baxter' now, do they... and they were some of the few 'faceless' locos to ever appear!

 

What is potentially bad for the hobby is some of the very poor content produced by some online with regards TTTE, including Fan Fictions, but also some (BY NO MEANS ALL!!!) Youtube series. I think some will see where I'm coming from here, and I come across some slightly disturbing stuff whilst researching LBSCR Locos. That's another annoying thing - when one is trying to find pictures of actual E2's, not  a stumpy little blue tank engine which may or may not have had a passing resemblance to one at some stage. There are some very nice pieces of TTTE modelling, and some of the best can be found right here on RMweb, but I can't help thinking some of the poorer examples on Youtube (Not modellers The sort who use shop-bought toys. Oh. Wait...) are not helping some of the Hobby's image of men playing with toy trains (something which, as proven in this very forum is entirely untrue)