TomScrut Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 23 minutes ago, The Johnster said: Railroad brand within the Hornby setup Yeah it's an interesting one really. Where they have more expensive competition I can see why they do it but some of their models where the only one there is is the RR one isn't ideal. The P2 springs to mind, and Duke of Gloucester too which is a bit of a half way house depending on which model you end up with AFAIK. One could say the same about Tornado but Bachmann do one and also I think I read that the A1 Trust wanted it to be affordable. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Also, I believe Hornby have plans to introduce Railroad Plus. These models will be the RR range but with enhanced livery application. Not sure where this range would sit? Kind regards Paddy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles73128 Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 55 minutes ago, The Johnster said: Which is just about the crux of the problem with the Railroad brand within the Hornby setup. I always refer to the Crosti 9F, for a long time a Railroad model despite being priced similarly to Main Range big locos, and now in the online catalogue as a Main Range loco, but to the best of my knowledge it has not been retooled and still doesn't have NEM pockets. I have a Railroad lined maroon BG which I am happy with as a layout model; the finish is spot on, and I can live with it's faults; it looks quite a bit like a lined maroon BG. It is not up to the very high standard of my Hawksworth BG, but I didn't expect it to be! One of my all time favourites, a very handsome beast in Hurry-Riches's Great Central (he was Gorton trained) livery with the frames all lined out and the curved running plate. It's sister was the 'K' class, an outside framed 0-6-2ST which the GW rebuilt into a pannier, which raises the interesting spectre of an 'L' class pannier neverwazza. Imagine that surviving post 1957 in lined out BR green! Crosti and the new release 9F all have NEM pockets. Front and back. 2 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted October 11, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 11, 2020 On 08/10/2020 at 04:22, TomScrut said: Yeah it's an interesting one really. Where they have more expensive competition I can see why they do it but some of their models where the only one there is is the RR one isn't ideal. The P2 springs to mind, and Duke of Gloucester too which is a bit of a half way house depending on which model you end up with AFAIK. One could say the same about Tornado but Bachmann do one and also I think I read that the A1 Trust wanted it to be affordable. The difference with Hornbys Tornado is that it was designed exactly as Tornado, not the earlier A1 slightly modified to represent Tornado as Bachmann did. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Derails Models Posted October 15, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2020 Couple more 2020 arrivals that have dropped onto the doorstop today so should be arriving at your local model shop very soon, if they're not there already for your perusal: R4994 Mark 1 Network Rail ex-BR Mk1 Structure Gauging Train Driving & Instrumentation Vehicle No.975081 R4995 Network Rail ex-BR Mk1 BG Generator Van No.6264 Ciao! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Simon Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 On 15/10/2020 at 13:27, Derails Models said: Couple more 2020 arrivals that have dropped onto the doorstop today so should be arriving at your local model shop very soon, if they're not there already for your perusal: R4994 Mark 1 Network Rail ex-BR Mk1 Structure Gauging Train Driving & Instrumentation Vehicle No.975081 R4995 Network Rail ex-BR Mk1 BG Generator Van No.6264 Ciao! Just seen a couple of these, which both have warped bogie side frames, has anyone else had this issue with Hornby MK1s and would it be fixable? Simon 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan452 Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 8 hours ago, St. Simon said: Just seen a couple of these, which both have warped bogie side frames, has anyone else had this issue with Hornby MK1s and would it be fixable? Simon Yes I noticed that (maybe having looked at the same image as yourself). Possibly a QC issue in that the factory didn't let the plastic fully 'cure' before taking it out of the mould? (Someone may be able to advise.) Hoping this doesn't happen on the forthcoming RBR (even though that has Commonwealth rather than B4 bogies). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted October 17, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 17, 2020 At least bogies are an easy swap..... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted October 19, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 19, 2020 (edited) On 17/10/2020 at 19:00, jonathan452 said: (even though that has Commonwealth rather than B4 bogies). These will be Hornby's first attempt at Commonwealths, I believe. If they are up to the standard of the very good Collett 7' bogies that were attached to my 57' Suburbans, they'll be very good indeed; I reckon these are the best RTR bogies I have ever had and they have the edge on most kit bogies as well! Edited October 19, 2020 by The Johnster 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted October 19, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 19, 2020 1 hour ago, The Johnster said: These will be Hornby's first attempt at Commonwealths, I believe. If they are up to the standard of the very good Collett 7' bogies that were attached to my 57' Suburbans, they'll be very good indeed. Looking at the Hogwarts coaches, they do indeed look fantastic. Just needs a little bit of paint to pick out the damper arms and springs etc. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisis Rail Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 Wonder how things are Hornby production wise after this "eventful" and trying year called 2020? Not to mention 66 action packed pages to go at! Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted October 19, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 19, 2020 67 now. Back in March, when the Covid thing was just working up to speed, I predicted that it would not destroy civilisation and kill millions in the UK as some were stating that it definitely would, which was correct (so far, anyway). But I also predicted that the virus would be used by the big RTR players as a convenient excuse for late delivery, price rises, and general poor performance, so it's only fair that I should say that this was in the event wrong. Hornby have managed to produce items from China when they said they would at the price they said they would charge, and Bachmann have made progress in getting their act together. So, I'd say that things are pretty good for Hornby production wise, despite the distractions of Steampunk and wind up tinplate costing hundreds of pounds. Whether they are as good in investment terms is another matter, and my continued criticism of the confusion and lack of marketing focus that is Railroad, which I believe is to be extended (or as I call it, worsened) by 'Railroad Plus' is, IMHO, still a stone around the company's cultural neck. Hornby have made huge progress in the last couple of decades, and proven that they can produce new hi-fi toolings at competitive prices, but are still train set makers at heart... 2 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan452 Posted October 19, 2020 Share Posted October 19, 2020 10 hours ago, The Johnster said: These will be Hornby's first attempt at Commonwealths, I believe. If they are up to the standard of the very good Collett 7' bogies that were attached to my 57' Suburbans, they'll be very good indeed; I reckon these are the best RTR bogies I have ever had and they have the edge on most kit bogies as well! I believe they have already made an appearance on the blue/grey FO, also on the Flying Scotsman and Duchess of Sutherland (BSK) support coaches. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WILLIAM Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) Just received an unexpected email from Hattons saying Hornby have cancelled their forthcoming Network Rail Mk3 DVT R4990. I only managed to pre-order one a couple of weeks ago as many retailers were saying they had sold out their allocation on pre-order already! Strange? Licencing issue? Edited October 21, 2020 by WILLIAM 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted October 21, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2020 Are you sure that’s the code? Hornbys website brings up a triple pack of retro wagons with that code. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted October 21, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2020 Found it. R4990. Still available on their website. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WILLIAM Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 18 minutes ago, Hilux5972 said: Found it. R4990. Still available on their website. Thanks. Corrected my original post. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
keybuk Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, WILLIAM said: Just received an unexpected email from Hattons saying Hornby have cancelled their forthcoming Network Rail Mk3 DVT R4990. I've had a similar e-mail about two other items: R4991 - Network Rail, ex-BR Mk2F TSO Structure Gauging Train Support Coach, 72630 R4997 - Network Rail, Ex-BR Super GUV, ADB 971003 QQA Hornby list one of those as In Stock on their own website, the other is listed as In Stock in at least Gaugemaster's store. Strange things may be afoot, are Hattons claiming cancellation when they're just not receiving as big an allocation as they expected? Are they having a spat with Hornby too now? Edited October 21, 2020 by keybuk R4991 is purchasable too 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted October 21, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2020 On 07/10/2020 at 16:22, TomScrut said: Yeah it's an interesting one really. Where they have more expensive competition I can see why they do it but some of their models where the only one there is is the RR one isn't ideal. The P2 springs to mind, and Duke of Gloucester too which is a bit of a half way house depending on which model you end up with AFAIK. One could say the same about Tornado but Bachmann do one and also I think I read that the A1 Trust wanted it to be affordable. The main advantage is where the subject was small in quantity and limited in terms of liveries. IIRC the first model done this way was indeed Duke of Gloucester - but when you remember this class consisted of a single loco with one or two possible liveries you can see why Hornby didn't feel it worthwhile to go for the 'full fat' approach The success of this main / railroad hybrid then opened the door for other similar options - be it Tornado (the new build loco has some significant differences to the originals (which is what Bachmnanns tooling represents) or the Crosti 9F. My gripe is when we get this technique applied to things which were built in quantity and where no other model exists. The Mk1 BSO for example is not competing with anything else yet it get saddled with moulded on detail and no close coupling mechanism. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ruggedpeak Posted October 22, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 22, 2020 (edited) On 21/10/2020 at 19:35, keybuk said: I've had a similar e-mail about two other items: R4991 - Network Rail, ex-BR Mk2F TSO Structure Gauging Train Support Coach, 72630 R4997 - Network Rail, Ex-BR Super GUV, ADB 971003 QQA Hornby list one of those as In Stock on their own website, the other is listed as In Stock in at least Gaugemaster's store. Strange things may be afoot, are Hattons claiming cancellation when they're just not receiving as big an allocation as they expected? Are they having a spat with Hornby too now? I have both those items, pre-ordered from TMC and sitting in my stock box. They exist and have not been cancelled. Following other discussions I wonder if Hornby are revisiting their sales model and may have decided that box shifters in general are not conducive to their long term prospects? I can only guess from other sectors that some of them get very favourable terms and over time these can evolve to become less than ideal for the manufacturer or not aligned to their future strategy. With new entrants using a variety of formats to sell their wares maybe Hornby are having a review or rethink? Edited October 23, 2020 by ruggedpeak Update 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted October 22, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 22, 2020 (edited) Pure speculation of course, an ‘overheard conversation’ , hearsay, but we do see box shifters commissioning and generally becoming more involved with the production side, and thus in direct head to head competition with the more established names. I am minded of SK’s response in the tv docudrama to Rails’ Terrier, which he clearly regarded as ‘his’ loco (ignoring that H had inherited it from Dapol); he seems to be pf a proprietorial disposition and quite aggressive in protecting his patch. This makes him a good bet for Hornby’s future prospects, but he’s a feather ruffler! Hornby themselves don’t actually produce anything, and are in that sense ‘commissioners’ the same as the box shifters, NRM, Bachmann, etc. My view, which is worth exactly what I’m charging you for it and is completely uninformed, I don’t even overhear privileged conversations by those who may or may not be better informed and wouldn’t repeat them if I did, is that the standard production model for RTR/RTP is commissioning, and competition is healthy for production slots in the far East. Co-operation between players will attract the attention of whatever the old Monopolies Commission call themselves deze daze, but a bit of general agreement, an acceptance that no-one ‘owns’ the trade or any part of it, and that the trade as a whole needs all of it’s participants to behave in a civilised manner to and with each other, will do nobody any harm. Following the losses of WW2, the UK’s shipbuilding industry entered a boom period for 20 years as replacements meant full order books. In the late 60s, a suggestion from some builders and union bosses proposed dealing with the increasing competition from rebuilt and more efficient German, Dutch, and Japanese yards with a scheme by which each British yard closed in turn in order to re-equip with new plant while their shareholders and employees were paid out of a communal industry fund. We could have had a modern, efficient, profitable, and highly competitive world class shipbuilding industry by the 80s instead of the dying duck we actually had. The majority of companies rejected the proposed scheme, which had originated on Clydeside. A combination of mistrust of the Scots on Tyneside and the Mersey, short term profit taking (order books were still full, but not for long), belief in the then current antiquated system and machinery’s ability to produce superior but unmarketable ships, management/union both ways mistrust, and plain oldfashioned greed and reluctance to assist the home competition destroyed the industry for good. If a ship is built in a British yard nowadays it’s national news because of it’s rarity. Competition red in toof an’ clore devil take the hindmost is not always the best way, as old horny’s done this before, and picks the hindmosts off one by one until there’s no one left, and some in the model railway trade might want to consider this. Edited October 22, 2020 by The Johnster 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted October 22, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 22, 2020 24 minutes ago, The Johnster said: old horny’s done this before No way to speak about Mr Kohler. 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
truffy Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 1 hour ago, The Johnster said: Hornby themselves don’t actually produce anything, and are in that sense ‘commissioners’ the same as the box shifters, NRM, Bachmann, etc. Someone has to do the research though. The bit between the brilliant marketing plan and the factory. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted October 22, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 22, 2020 Research is not that much if the loco is in existence; you send a bloke out for a day with a measuring stick. The difficult bit that has to be done in-house is thenoroduction engineering for the CADs you send out to th actual producers. They will produce exactly what the CAD tells them, so you have to get this right first time, and unless the model can be produced cost effectively you won’t generate a profit with it, however well it sells. A production engineering mistake on a high profile model can be very damaging as you try to restrict the supply of loss makers that are in high demand. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted October 22, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 22, 2020 12 minutes ago, The Johnster said: Research is not that much if the loco is in existence; you send a bloke out for a day with a measuring stick. That way lies many a pitfall. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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