Tyteford Halte

[Neal Ball]

10 hours ago, MAP66 said:

Persevering with the Poppies chassis box (jig) I found a solution to stop the witness rods from dropping out. I have used collar retainers which tighten onto the witness rods with a grub screw. I couldn’t get a close internal bore size of 3.125mm to suit the witness rods, 4mm was the closest I could find but the grub screws wind down enough to grip the rods and now they don’t fall out and everything is held tight and square...

 

All nice and secure now with the collars fitted. Good to see that the coupling rods fit as well!

 

Now it was time to continue with the inside motion, from the above image you can see that I have made a start by already installing the slidebars which basically just slide and push into place with a little levering and manoeuvring with no need for soldering (once you manage to get them in, there not going anywhere). Next on the list to tick off, are the left and right valve gear assemblies. They each consist of an inside and outside drop link and one radius arm. Managed that, just about, a couple of images below…

 

Assembly is assisted by inserting short lengths of 0.5mm brass rod until the soldering iron is called for.

 

Both pairs now soldered together and the brass rods snipped off just proud of the etch to represent the pivots.

 

We end this instalment with a final image of the valve gear assemblies installed within the frames and you will see two short pieces of brass tube cut to 4.5mm long inserted through the motion bracket to represent the valve guides…

 

The lower 1.0mm brass rod passing between the frames is the reverser shaft and will soon be cut back in length. The upper 0.7mm brass rod is just there for support of the valve gear assemblies and is taken out when all is soldered in place.

 

 

That looks excellent - I also like the collars on the assembly jig.

[MAP66]

The 2 internal connecting rods are the final items of detail to add for the inside motion which I completed this afternoon. The chassis then received a well-earned bath to get rid of all the flux residue which was starting to build up. This was also a prerequisite for getting the inside of the frames and the inside motion primed ready for painting.

 

So which colours? Phoenix paints website list signal red, other sources list venetian red. Well, I have Vallejo Vermillion 70.909 so that will be the inside frame colour (well, at least certain parts of it). With oil, grease and grime effects I’m planning to splodge on top, I don’t think the red colour is too critical after all. There will also be some use of gunmetal effect paint. Here is a top and bottom view of all the inside motion detail now completed and before painting.

 

 

 

 

 

[Neal Ball]

6 hours ago, MAP66 said:

The 2 internal connecting rods are the final items of detail to add for the inside motion which I completed this afternoon. The chassis then received a well-earned bath to get rid of all the flux residue which was starting to build up. This was also a prerequisite for getting the inside of the frames and the inside motion primed ready for painting.

 

So which colours? Phoenix paints website list signal red, other sources list venetian red. Well, I have Vallejo Vermillion 70.909 so that will be the inside frame colour (well, at least certain parts of it). With oil, grease and grime effects I’m planning to splodge on top, I don’t think the red colour is too critical after all. There will also be some use of gunmetal effect paint. Here is a top and bottom view of all the inside motion detail now completed and before painting.

 

 

 

 

 

You’ve made an excellent job of the inside motion - looking forward to the next stage of the build.

[MAP66]

Thank you Neal.

I'm pretty chuffed I've got this far and have stuck with it. I find its a case of reading the written instructions several times over and studying the diagrams before committing yourself to the next step.  Sounds like such a small thing but unstapling the 8 pages of instructions, and separating the pages, so that you have the main diagram to refer to and the written instruction stage, you are working on, next to each other helps enormously. That quick tip and a good helping of patience has at least got me to here. All I can do is adopt the same approach for the gearbox and motor stages and lets hope it all goes  runs smoothly. 😁

[longchap]

Great progress Mike and due in no small way to your construction methodology, particularly preparation. 

 

I don't think the gearbox should give you much hassle. The gear set is a bit of a fiddle to align, but the instructions are precise and give good tips to get you through the process. Really understanding the instructions and use of an Optivisor saw me through without problems, with just a bit of filing down bearings to provide clearance.

 

It proved a satisfying experience when hooked up to the rolling chassis and a 9v battery applied to the motor terminals.

 

Keep having fun 😀

 

 

 

[MAP66]

Thanks Bill,

 

I looked further ahead in the instructions and there's a little way to go yet before I tackle the gearbox. Before that, there's a few things to solder onto the outside frames first, including the rear cast axle boxes. I'm doing well though as I am now mid-way down page 4 out of 8. I wouldn't be without my Optivisor either, I feel blind without it, when working on the small detailed stuff.

 

I have left the build alone today for the first time in over a week, very addictive. Some DIY work on the house was overdue so I have been busy painting door frames today. I am also waiting on a few modelling supplies as well, turns out I was out of primer so now waiting on that to arrive. It will be back to the build Mon/Tues hopefully.

 

Mark.

[longchap]

Ah, we all know the bind it can be to tear yourself away from a modelling project, right when you're in the groove and things going along swimmingly!  I had been looking forward to spending the day in the railway room today, but discoved that we'd had intruders in overnight, fortunately only rodents, so cleaning up and repair work was the order of the day.

 

 

 

[Neal Ball]

11 hours ago, MAP66 said:

Thank you Neal.

I'm pretty chuffed I've got this far and have stuck with it. I find its a case of reading the written instructions several times over and studying the diagrams before committing yourself to the next step.  Sounds like such a small thing but unstapling the 8 pages of instructions, and separating the pages, so that you have the main diagram to refer to and the written instruction stage, you are working on, next to each other helps enormously. That quick tip and a good helping of patience has at least got me to here. All I can do is adopt the same approach for the gearbox and motor stages and lets hope it all goes  runs smoothly. 😁

If it helps, I’ve also set up a “project board” next to the work bench. 
 

It’s simply an easel with a cork board - instructions and photos etc. everything for the project. It saves flicking through the relevant book, as it’s all to hand.

 

1 hour ago, longchap said:

Ah, we all know the bind it can be to tear yourself away from a modelling project, right when you're in the groove and things going along swimmingly!  I had been looking forward to spending the day in the railway room today, but discoved that we'd had intruders in overnight, fortunately only rodents, so cleaning up and repair work was the order of the day.

 

 

 

Hopefully no damage Bill. You need one of Phil’s @Harlequin cats to keep them at bay!

[longchap]

8 minutes ago, Neal Ball said:

Hopefully no damage Bill. You need one of Phil’s @Harlequin cats to keep them at bay!

 

We have three cats Neal, our oldest is a beautiful 17 year old lady and now resides strictly in the kitchen and far too frail to catch mice, while the young mother and daughter outside couple keep rodents strictly under control and will probably become house cats in due course.

 

Fortunately no damage, just some serious tidying up, disposal of foodstuff from a breached kitchen base unit and sealing both ends of a waste pipe through a half metre thick stone wall.

 

Between jobs and some appointments tomorrow, I've a couple of hours planned in the railway room and hope to find the baseboards and progress the wiring and control panel 😀 

 

[MAP66]

17 hours ago, longchap said:

Ah, we all know the bind it can be to tear yourself away from a modelling project, right when you're in the groove and things going along swimmingly!  I had been looking forward to spending the day in the railway room today, but discoved that we'd had intruders in overnight, fortunately only rodents, so cleaning up and repair work was the order of the day.

 

 

 

A ‘mouse in the house’, never a good thing. I hope you manage to seal everything up and stop the little blighters from gaining entry. When we lived in London (semi-detached property) our neighbour kept birds, hundreds of them in outside aviaries and he stupidly kept all the bird seed in his house which always attracted the mice. Being semi-detached, the furry little gits had easy access to our house through the attached loft space and under the floors. If it wasn’t the dawn chorus waking you up every morning at silly o’clock (you would need to experience the incessant cooing of Diamond Doves to appreciate this) then instead, it would be chasing furry rodents around the house with a broom.  Either way, not a good experience and just one of the very many reasons why we moved house. Lets get away from mice and back to trains, hope you get back to them soon 🚂 ☺️ 

[MAP66]

15 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

If it helps, I’ve also set up a “project board” next to the work bench. 

Thanks Neal,

That is a simply brilliant solution which has never occurred to me before. I'm going to use that in one way or another, saves rifling through all those bits of paper.

[Neal Ball]

3 hours ago, MAP66 said:

Thanks Neal,

That is a simply brilliant solution which has never occurred to me before. I'm going to use that in one way or another, saves rifling through all those bits of paper.

It’s so simple to do, but so effective!

[MAP66]

Well, it was back to the chassis build after a spot of DIY. I spent this afternoon adorning the outside frames with various embellishments as the Mrs might describe them in her crafting world. In reality this amounted to the rear cast axle boxes, front cast sand boxes, 0.4mm wire to represent the feed pipe for the ashpan and for the wash out plug bolt, various rivet strips and finally the front and rear rail guards.

 

The plan tomorrow, will be to fit the rear sand boxes and then look at preparing the chassis for painting. Here’s how it’s looking at the moment with all those detail bits added...

 

 

 

[Neal Ball]

That’s looking very nice @MAP66 have you tried the wheels and the plank of wood yet?

[MAP66]

2 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

That’s looking very nice @MAP66 have you tried the wheels and the plank of wood yet?

Thanks Neal,

No, I still have that little gem to look forward to. Truth is, there’s a few things that I’m unsure about with the wheels which are the Alan Gibson ones recommended for the kit, I also have the Alan Gibson crank pins. I’m unsure about the best technique for pushing the wheels onto the axles square, as the hornblocks are not removeable from the chassis. Furthermore, how to get the wheels off the axle again?

[Neal Ball]

3 hours ago, MAP66 said:

Thanks Neal,

No, I still have that little gem to look forward to. Truth is, there’s a few things that I’m unsure about with the wheels which are the Alan Gibson ones recommended for the kit, I also have the Alan Gibson crank pins. I’m unsure about the best technique for pushing the wheels onto the axles square, as the hornblocks are not removeable from the chassis. Furthermore, how to get the wheels off the axle again?

Oh that’s a conundrum- the ones I used on my Metro, were already quartered and simply slotted off.

 

I wonder if @Andy Keane used Gibson wheels and could advise.

[longchap]

Ian Rices's book on 4mm Loco Chassis Construction is the Bible here. I will also review my notes on quartering from the Missenden Abbey course to remind me of the methodology. A slightly mystical topic for all new Chassis builders and like Neal, I also used the self quartering wheels sets with the square axles, which make life a little easier.

 

Best,

 

Bill

 

 

[MAP66]

1 hour ago, Neal Ball said:

Oh that’s a conundrum- the ones I used on my Metro, were already quartered and simply slotted off.

 

I wonder if @Andy Keane used Gibson wheels and could advise.

 

4 minutes ago, longchap said:

Ian Rices's book on 4mm Loco Chassis Construction is the Bible here. I will also review my notes on quartering from the Missenden Abbey course to remind me of the methodology. A slightly mystical topic for all new Chassis builders and like Neal, I also used the self quartering wheels sets with the square axles, which make life a little easier.

 

Best,

 

Bill

 

 

Thanks Gents,

In the meantime, I am finding these cast sand boxes a real struggle to fit. My full report to follow later 🤔

[Andy Keane]

8 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

Oh that’s a conundrum- the ones I used on my Metro, were already quartered and simply slotted off.

 

I wonder if @Andy Keane used Gibson wheels and could advise.

I used self quartering wheels from Markits/Romford. I do have some Gibson sets but thought it just too difficult to get exactly right without some sort of accurate jig.

[MAP66]

Out of all the things which potentially could have gone sideways on this build, I didn’t think for a second it would be the cast rear axles and the sand boxes which caused me the most hassle to prepare and fit. The cast fittings are held on a robust sprue, so robust in fact that the central sprue holding the axle boxes is more like a tree trunk. It therefore takes some care and time (lots of time) in my case to release them. I used the sharp edge of a small file, a Dremel might have been a better choice, but I didn’t have the right cutting disc for the job...

 

That central sprue is a bit of a beast!

 

The axle boxes have some nice fine detail to them and look the biz when fitted. You do need to find an effective way to hold them in place, without moving, while soldering though. I managed it eventually, using 2 of my spring clamps.

 

Then it was the sand boxes, front ones not so bad but the rear ones tested me. The unfinished, unseen part which fits up against the side of the mid spacer needed quite a bit of filing down to get it flat. There is also a locating peg on the back of the sand box which locates in the hole of the mid spacer. I couldn’t get it to fit nicely and I found it much better to file the peg off completely which then made it easier to file the back down nice and square.

 

After all that, I eventually needed 3 clamps to hold it securely in place while soldering. Fortunately, the instructions advised earlier not to solder in the mid-way spacer, so removing it helped, ever so slightly, when fitting the rear sand boxes. So, what really should have been a 10 min job, took all afternoon.

 

View looking from front

 

 

From the rear

 

 

The chassis needed a further clean after all that and it has now had a dusting of grey primer. I’m leaving it for 24hrs for paint to fully harden and them I’ll start some of the painting within the frames.

 

All primed up, axle bushes masked off.

 

After that, it will be time to do some body shell surgery of the Airfix doner, which is necessary to allow the chassis to fit. Following that, assuming taking the scalpel to the body will result in a success, it will be time to tackle the compensation and at some point those wheels will need to go on.

 

Detail from the instructions of the body shell prep required for chassis to fit.

 

 

 

 

 

[Andy Keane]

That is looking most impressive - where did the brass sandbox and axle castings come from - were they part of the kit or sourced separately? - my 517 kit has white metal versions but I think your brass ones are rather nicer

Andy

[MAP66]

18 minutes ago, Andy Keane said:

That is looking most impressive - where did the brass sandbox and axle castings come from - were they part of the kit or sourced separately? - my 517 kit has white metal versions but I think your brass ones are rather nicer

Andy

Hi Andy,

 

They are part of the kit, along with the cast rear axle boxes. They do all have really nice detail, just a little more work required than expected to get them fitted correctly.

[JimRead]

Hello Mark,

 

A couple of things you might find useful; one is a Piercing Saw with some 48 and 32 TPI blades cheap on eBay and Faithfull blades are very good. The other thing is Blue Tack I use it to hold electronic componets in place on PCB's while I solder them.

If you've already got these onboard my apologies.

 

Cheers - Jim

 

[edit] Forgot; the teeth on a piercing saw should face the handle gives much better control and easier starts to a cut.

Edited November 23, 2023 by JimRead

[MAP66]

2 hours ago, JimRead said:

Hello Mark,

 

A couple of things you might find useful; one is a Piercing Saw with some 48 and 32 TPI blades cheap on eBay and Faithfull blades are very good. The other thing is Blue Tack I use it to hold electronic componets in place on PCB's while I solder them.

If you've already got these onboard my apologies.

 

Cheers - Jim

 

[edit] Forgot; the teeth on a piercing saw should face the handle gives much better control and easier starts to a cut.

Thanks again Jim,

 

That's useful to know, I have a piercing saw but I think the teeth are too coarse or I have the saw blade in the wrong way round, I will need to check.  I never thought of using blue tack. just imagined it wouldn't cope with the heat. I use the spring clamps as sometimes a bit of force is required when holding these components together. By the way, please keep the tips coming when you think of them as they are proving extremely useful.

[MAP66]

I got the paints out today, not the white satin finish for the door frames – had enough of that malarkey. No, I mean the model paints and it makes a nice change. Last bit of model painting I did was for the coach passengers exactly a month ago.

 

So, I’m hand painting the chassis and the colours of choice are; Vermillion for the inside frames, motion bracket and parts of the valve assemblies and a contrasting gun metal for the valve guides, piston rods and parts of the valve assemblies. Then it’s an initial coat of weathered black for the outside of the frames, sand boxes and axle springs. Finally, some MIG oil and grease mix over the inside motion. Here are the results so far…

 

 

Underside view