Jamieson LMS Jubilee kit build

[ianLMS]

A long while ago i picked up a Jamieson Jubilee loco construction kit. It was just the body and it looks like it came with a Comet or similar type chassis with Romford wheels. I didnt pay much more than £50 so not too bad.

I have been putting it off as the Jamieson kits are a challenge and its just pre shaped nickel silver parts, no detail and limited instructions. It came with FJ Roche drawings which helped.

 

I plan on building it and naming it Eire (wife is from Ireland so she will like that).

 

Very few pics of Eire exist so it will be a bit of guess work on the detail etc.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2020 by ianLMS

[46256]

Eire circa 1959 passing Water Orton Station jct box  look foward to seeing the model best wishes brian

[Steamport Southport]

45572 Eire. I take it you've found these? Seems to be common around the West Midlands.

 

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/mrsalt957.htm

 

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/mrf890.htm

 

http://britishrailways.tripod.com/45572.html

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/taffytank/26788696688

 

http://www.jubilees.co.uk/photos/45572a.html

 

 

Jason

Edited March 15, 2020 by Steamport Southport

[ianLMS]

Thank you both - i had seen some of those pics of 5572 before. The issue, as with most locomotives of that era, its hard to find one dated during the 1930's. I am not too concerned about 100% accuracy. Close enough is good enough for my layout. 

 

5572 went through several boiler replacements and in my LMS Jubilee book there is a pic from the late 30's of 5573 and it had a different top feed/dome (combined?) when first built. I can only assume as 5572 came out of the same workshop, it would have also had the same dome/boiler feed (which i happen to have one of in my spares drawer). Therefore, that is how I have built it.

 

The build has been very challenging so far, and I have messed the front end up a little, but i will live with it.

 

Ian

 

 

[Flying Pig]

1 hour ago, ianLMS said:

top feed/dome (combined?)

 

Just the top feed under a domelike casing.  Steam collection in the early Stanier boilers was at the top front corners of the firebox, GWR style, but this didn't work well for the LMS so they changed to domed designs.

 

Another feature of the early short-firebox Jubilees as built was a twin smokebox saddle, which was replaced by the standard single unit fairly early on as part of the rather complicated boiler evolution of the class.  It's visible on this photo (probably the same one as in your book).  Never seen on rtr models so worth replicating if in period just for something different.

 

Good luck with the build.

 

 

[65179]

I have June and August 1939 photos of Eire (published in the Manchester Jubilees by Paul Shackcloth) which judging by the info in the Book of the Jubilees were taken when 5572 had the same boiler as when it was re-named. On that basis it had a modified boiler with separate dome and topfeed when it was re-named Eire in 1938.

 

Simon

[ianLMS]

Thank you for the info. Much appreciated. Seperate dome and top feed on order! Unfortunately, the FJ Roche drawing is of the double chimney and dome type where the top feed is much closer to the smoke box than the photos show.

 

I am sure i can work out approx where it should go from the pics.

 

Any chance it shows the shed code in the 1939 pic? I know it was at Bristol in 1948 but am hoping it was a little further north earlier on in its life. 

 

Thank you

Ian

[65179]

Millhouses (Sheffield) on renaming then Trafford Park (hence the photos in the book I referenced) until moving to Bristol post-war.  

 

Photos show SF boiler, separate dome and topfeed and one piece saddle.

 

Simon 

[ianLMS]

Thank you - Trafford Park sounds good!

 

I am not 100% on the exact names of loco parts, so please forgive me. Which bit is the saddle you are referring to? 

[Leander]

1 hour ago, ianLMS said:

Thank you for the info. Much appreciated. Seperate dome and top feed on order! Unfortunately, the FJ Roche drawing is of the double chimney and dome type where the top feed is much closer to the smoke box than the photos show.

Always beware when referring to Roche drawings as they are full of compromises and inaccuracies.

[Flying Pig]

1 hour ago, ianLMS said:

Unfortunately, the FJ Roche drawing is of the double chimney and dome type where the top feed is much closer to the smoke box than the photos show.

 

 

I think that drawing is of the 2A rebuilds.  There are some drawings and info on this thread - the drawing shows a short firebox engine with dome and single saddle per 65179's post.

 

 

[hayfield]

I see you have a decent chassis under the loco, years ago I bought sale stock from W&H of the black 5, Royal Scott and Jubilee all 3 in differing states of built (not touched them for 30+ years, all 3 have Jamieson chassis, but I bought several extra cast parts from the likes of Crownline. I think these kits today would be called scratch building aids. From memory they are quite fun to build, etched chassis are light years better than the old Jamieson ones

 

I will look forward to your progress with this build

[Steamport Southport]

I haven't got a Jamieson Jubilee. I have got a Black Five and a couple of A3s (with GNR tender). The drawings in those are Skinley. I think I have a V2 somewhere as well, but can't remember.

 

They definitely are more of a scratch aid than a kit. They were cheap though. I think I paid about £10 each. I paid about the same for the Five's chassis and valve gear kits. I don't know whether I'll use those or go with a Comet chassis instead. The chassis is a bit basic. Two slabs of milled brass similar to the Gibson ones, but not as good.

 

The good thing was they all have the solder in them. So at least I've got the recommended type.

 

They are well at the bottom of the kit pile. Not physically as they were at the top. But they're not priorities and I want to get a bit more experience before attempting them.

 

 

 

Jason

[Steamport Southport]

13 hours ago, ianLMS said:

Thank you both - i had seen some of those pics of 5572 before. The issue, as with most locomotives of that era, its hard to find one dated during the 1930's. I am not too concerned about 100% accuracy. Close enough is good enough for my layout. 

 

5572 went through several boiler replacements and in my LMS Jubilee book there is a pic from the late 30's of 5573 and it had a different top feed/dome (combined?) when first built. I can only assume as 5572 came out of the same workshop, it would have also had the same dome/boiler feed (which i happen to have one of in my spares drawer). Therefore, that is how I have built it.

 

The build has been very challenging so far, and I have messed the front end up a little, but i will live with it.

 

Ian

 

 

 

Here it is before renaming.

 

5572 Irish Free State c1936-1938

 

https://railway-photography.smugmug.com/LMSSteam/Stanier-Locomotives/Jubilee-Class/Jubilee-Class-Pre-1968/4555745605-North-British-Built/4556345573/i-3dbFWBZ

 

 

 

Jason

[hayfield]

10 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

I haven't got a Jamieson Jubilee. I have got a Black Five and a couple of A3s (with GNR tender). The drawings in those are Skinley. I think I have a V2 somewhere as well, but can't remember.

 

They definitely are more of a scratch aid than a kit. They were cheap though. I think I paid about £10 each. I paid about the same for the Five's chassis and valve gear kits. I don't know whether I'll use those or go with a Comet chassis instead. The chassis is a bit basic. Two slabs of milled brass similar to the Gibson ones, but not as good.

 

The good thing was they all have the solder in them. So at least I've got the recommended type.

 

They are well at the bottom of the kit pile. Not physically as they were at the top. But they're not priorities and I want to get a bit more experience before attempting them.

 

 

 

Jason

 

I started to build up a collection of Jamieson/Eames locos, ranging from nicely built kits, built bodies, unbuild bodies and complete kits. I must have sold half of them now and still deciding which ones to keep.

 

Definitely on the keeping list are a 62xx, 57xx, 2 x 14xx, SR 700, M7 & E2.

 

Also have bodies for a Collet goods, Mogul and County locos and a LMS 2p along with the three 4-6-0's and a scratch built 44xx.

 

As you see far too many and a timely reminder to do something more than finish the E2 which is on the bench with 2 Wills E2's

Edited March 17, 2020 by hayfield

[ianLMS]

It has definately been interesting and i am quite happy telling you all that it is testing me and that i have made quite a few errors during this learning period. 

 

The riveting on the doors is terrible but im hoping it wont be as obvious once its painted and lined. 

 

Here are pics of current progress. Note: The body wasnt positioned correctly hence the slapshers arent lined up.

 

 

Edited March 17, 2020 by ianLMS

[hayfield]

Ian

 

As usual you are making a great effort on this one, I never attempted rivets and would chicken out if I did by using Archers transfers.

[ianLMS]

I have some of those for the smoke box and possibly the tender.

 

Tonight, I realised the chassis i had was actually for a black 5 kit. Luckily, I purchased a comet jubilee chassis and found it in my kit drawer with Markits wheels so will now build that instead!! Doh!!!!

[hayfield]

1 hour ago, ianLMS said:

I have some of those for the smoke box and possibly the tender.

 

Tonight, I realised the chassis i had was actually for a black 5 kit. Luckily, I purchased a comet jubilee chassis and found it in my kit drawer with Markits wheels so will now build that instead!! Doh!!!!

Ian

 

No guarantee the Jubilee chassis will fit the body !!, these kits were of their time using the information available but limited by the materials and processes to hand at the time

 

Built by someone else but to show what can be done with a few extra bits

 

 

An Eames SR 700 class (wheels not fitted correctly so high at the front, but unlike the BEC SR 700 has the correct wheelbase, the BEC uses the Jinty chassis. A couple of the pipes and the cab & tender hand rails are a bit heavy, but for its time quite good

 

 

As you can see the chassis is a bit of a wreck now mainly down to the chassis keeper plate being wood. If I an going to keep it a new chassis will be required as I use EM gauge. The tender will cause a few more issues as the gap between the two outside frames is too narrow

 

 

For its build date the chassis is quite detailed, but now is not working. My biggest problem is finding a loco chassis, the Gibson one is designed for the BEC model which has an incorrect wheelbase

[Michael Edge]

If you need any encouragement this is from a Jamieson kit.

K's wheels and etched motion (I used to use that etch for all sorts of locos years ago), still works regularly.

Jamieson kits were always seen as an good introduction to scratchbuilding, all the same techniques apart from cutting out and you look to be getting on well with the Jubilee. Comet frame kit will be better anyway and quite easy to put together.

[ianLMS]

It looks like a little fettling required on the front of the frames and it should fit. Main concern is getting it level and the body sits at the correct height.

 

Progress will be made over the next few days hopefully. 

 

Love the advice and pics. If mine looks anything close to yours Mike i will be happy! LMS crimson for me though!

[hayfield]

Getting it to sit at the correct height may be difficult especially where Romford wheels are concerned, due to the larger than scale flanges on the wheels, I am having a bit of an issue with a Southern E1, the old dodge was to fit wheels 1 mm smaller, trouble is Romford do not make 17 mm wheels, you should be OK with the larger diameter wheels

 

As for fitting the footplate, a bit of filing may be needed

[ianLMS]

Made a reasonable amount of progress this weekend. I built the chassis and it got the height relatively close. Its a little high in order for the wheels to clear the splashers but not too bad. Fitted correct dome etc and built the cylinders. Valve gear next mmmmmmmmm!!!

 

Hope you are all staying safe and putting this isolation time into good use on the railway!!

[65179]

Ian, 

 

Looking at that last photo you may want to check the positioning of your chimney and steampipes. They look a little too far back.  Certainly the relationship between steampipes and cylinders doesn't look quite right.

 

Simon

[micknich2003]

4 minutes ago, 65179 said:

Ian, 

 

Looking at that last photo you may want to check the positioning of your chimney and steampipes. They look a little too far back.  Certainly the relationship between steampipes and cylinders doesn't look quite right.

 

Simon

Centre of cylinders, chimney and steam pipe should be in line, see Michael's model etc., nevertheless some very good work.