RMweb Gold Regularity Posted May 31, 2022 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 31, 2022 Culture is shaped by the worst behaviour a leader is prepared to tolerate, or indeed to engage in. [Credit to HR Star, who are concerned to get the message out there.] Having lost (long ago) decent MPs and seen Ministers reigning, the current Conservative regime elected a “performer” (top? Possibly- it’s not just the cream that rises) and have let him play fast and loose with, well, virtually everything, which has created a toxic culture in Downing Street. A bit the GOP putting Trump forward as “Presidential”. The gutless, shameless tolerance of such people is merely part of the culture. 7 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocor Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 57 minutes ago, Nearholmer said: I think most people have is an instinctive grasp of the fact that when hard times hit, things actually work like that 1920/30s cartoon, where everyone has to take one step back down the ladder, which is sort of OK for everybody except the bloke on the bottom rung, who steps back down off the ladder altogether, into oblivion. In a civilized society, there is supposed to be a safety net there to catch him, in a civilized society! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 Even when there is a thread-bare one to fall into, most people really don’t want to go there, and we all know that it’s one heck of a job to get off the net and back onto the ladder. Another complicated sub-subject! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caley Jim Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 10 hours ago, Edwardian said: What is wrong with these people???????????? They are 'mericans, as GB once described them! Jim 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted May 31, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 31, 2022 8 minutes ago, Caley Jim said: They are 'mericans, as GB once described them! Mericans, not Mercians - an important distinction. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 6 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: Mericans, not Mercians - an important distinction. As an East Mercian by birth, I'm bound to agree. I'm sorry to say that, among certain ex pats while we were out in the Caribbean, they were known as Seppos; short for Septic Tanks, a cockney rhyming style appellation. 1 3 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted May 31, 2022 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 31, 2022 10 minutes ago, Edwardian said: As an East Mercian by birth, I'm bound to agree. I prefer to think of myself as a Middle-Anglian, but I suppose it’s pretty much the same. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Regularity said: I prefer to think of myself as a Middle-Anglian, but I suppose it’s pretty much the same. As I'm neither too high nor too low, I'll admit to being a Middle-Anglican! Edited May 31, 2022 by Edwardian spelling 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted May 31, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 31, 2022 1 minute ago, Regularity said: I prefer to think of myself as a Middle-Anglian, but I suppose it’s pretty much the same. Anglian by descent but Mercian by nationality, I suggest. Mercia did at various periods rule areas of Saxon settlement, such as Middlesex. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted May 31, 2022 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 31, 2022 15 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: Anglian by descent but Mercian by nationality, I suggest. Mercia did at various periods rule areas of Saxon settlement, such as Middlesex. Oh, I wouldn’t (personally) go that far south… ;) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeysarefun Posted May 31, 2022 Share Posted May 31, 2022 (edited) Quick question cos the news is on the telly here but the sound is turned down so can anyone tell me why there are what look like English blokes with very short hair crammed against a fence while the French fire tear gas at them, is it a renactment of Agincourt or something? If the sound was up maybe I'd have heard "Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of Elderberries!" etc. Edited May 31, 2022 by monkeysarefun Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted June 1, 2022 Share Posted June 1, 2022 5 hours ago, monkeysarefun said: Quick question cos the news is on the telly here but the sound is turned down so can anyone tell me why there are what look like English blokes with very short hair crammed against a fence while the French fire tear gas at them, is it a renactment of Agincourt or something? If the sound was up maybe I'd have heard "Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of Elderberries!" etc. They're football fans, the only export to Europe we have left after BREXIT, undergoing ad hoc checks to see if they comply with EU standards on resistance to tear gas, pepper spray, grenades and rubber bullets. Having failed these tests they will be sent back to the UK, but only after French police have cleared the back-log of illegal immigrants they're letting through to Britain. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
webbcompound Posted June 1, 2022 Share Posted June 1, 2022 (edited) Whilst I applaud the learned Edwardian's humour his use of the term "illegal immegrants" is unfortunate. The terms is surely just a way of othering and dehumanising a group of people in unfortunate circumstances. Up until now migration contrary to law has been a civil offence in the UK. I'm not sure that I know of any other civil offenders referred to as illegal (illegal drivers? illegal builders?). Of course under the new powers to be brought to parliament in June it will become a criminal offence for people to ‘knowingly’ arrive in the UK without permission to be in the country, and furthermore under the bill, the government has said it will also target, "activist left-wing UK immigration lawyers". Even under criminal law I am not aware of lawbreakers being referred to as illegal (illegal burglers? illegal arsonists?). I presume, however, we will from now on have to refer to "illegal lawyers" (those who strive to actually use the letter of the law to protect their clients against government abuse). Edited June 1, 2022 by webbcompound 4 5 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted June 1, 2022 Share Posted June 1, 2022 50 minutes ago, webbcompound said: Whilst I applaud the learned Edwardian's humour his use of the term "illegal immegrants" is unfortunate. The terms is surely just a way of othering and dehumanising a group of people in unfortunate circumstances. Up until now migration contrary to law has been a civil offence in the UK. I'm not sure that I know of any other civil offenders referred to as illegal (illegal drivers? illegal builders?). Of course under the new powers to be brought to parliament in June it will become a criminal offence for people to ‘knowingly’ arrive in the UK without permission to be in the country, and furthermore under the bill, the government has said it will also target, "activist left-wing UK immigration lawyers". Even under criminal law I am not aware of lawbreakers being referred to as illegal (illegal burglers? illegal arsonists?). I presume, however, we will from now on have to refer to "illegal lawyers" (those who strive to actually use the letter of the law to protect their clients against government abuse). That was my satirical voice, describing them as they are thought of by Pitiless Patel and the cohort of Back-bench Morons. Yet it is also accurate, as you note, as HMG have so arranged matters that asylum seekers have virtually no legal routes to claim that status, making them criminals by coming here. I will leave you to imagine what I think about that. So far the government has demonised lawyers seeking to defend human rights as "activists", I don't think any of us are quite yet illegal! But, I agree with all you say and I'm sorry if it didn't strike the right note for you. 7 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Northroader Posted June 1, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 1, 2022 My understanding is when they arrive in Britain they do not present any passport or visa, so in that sense they are illegal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
webbcompound Posted June 1, 2022 Share Posted June 1, 2022 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Edwardian said: But, I agree with all you say and I'm sorry if it didn't strike the right note for you. As we say, no problem, and I didn't for one minute think you were using the term in anger. As you are a lawyer perhaps you could enlighten me on an issue I have noticed. Whilst unauthorised migration is a civil issue it is the case that it is up to the defendant to prove they were on the right side of the law by producing documentaion (driving licence, proof of permission to build etc), but once unauthorised migration becomes a criminal offence doesn't the prosecution have to prove that an offence has occurred without any shadow of doubt, whilst the defendant has the right to a lawyer, and not to incriminate themselves. Unless of course these offences are treated to special courts, summary convictions, and transportation for life? Edited June 1, 2022 by webbcompound Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
webbcompound Posted June 1, 2022 Share Posted June 1, 2022 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Northroader said: My understanding is when they arrive in Britain they do not present any passport or visa, so in that sense they are illegal. Well they may have committed an illegal act, but they themselves can hardly be called illegal. In practice they are referred to as illegal even before it has been proved that they committed an illegal act. The only illegal act they may have initially committed, when arriving in the UK in a "pleasure craft" is the failure to submit a form C1331 by post. This only requires the names, nationalities, passport numbers (and signatures) to be listed by the owner/operator of the vessel. It is then the owner/operator's responsibility to identify if any visas are required and to seperately inform the National Yachtline by telephone, who will then provide further instructions as necessary. Edited June 1, 2022 by webbcompound 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
webbcompound Posted June 1, 2022 Share Posted June 1, 2022 All of which discussion reflects sadly on the difference in pre-grouping times when our Railway Companies ran migrant specials from the East Coast ports. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted June 1, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 1, 2022 The reintroduction of a property qualification for enfranchisement for UK elections (one must own photo ID, which has to be paid for) has led to considerable outcry. I understand the proposals are to undergo some modification, to make it clear that the possession of photo ID for certain employment (doctors, nurses, teachers, librarians, lawyers) will lead to automatic disenfranchisement, whilst possession of a copy of a newspaper on the approved list will pass as suitable ID. 1 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted June 1, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 1, 2022 1 minute ago, webbcompound said: All of which discussion reflects sadly on the difference in pre-grouping times when our Railway Companies ran migrant specials from the East Coast ports. Yes, but those migrants were heading straight for Liverpool and hence New York. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium petethemole Posted June 1, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 1, 2022 4 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: Yes, but those migrants were heading straight for Liverpool and hence New York. Apart from those who had been fraudulently sold tickets they couldn't read, that didn't include the transatlantic leg. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Hayter Posted June 1, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 1, 2022 Not just to Liverpool Stephen. London and Glasgow were definitely on the map. I think other major cities wre also end destinations. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeysarefun Posted June 1, 2022 Share Posted June 1, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, webbcompound said: Well they may have committed an illegal act, but they themselves can hardly be called illegal. In practice they are referred to as illegal even before it has been proved that they committed an illegal act. The only illegal act they may have initially committed, when arriving in the UK in a "pleasure craft" is the failure to submit a form C1331 by post. No offence but your government needs some more work before it can claim to be treating asylum seekers at Australian Standard level. For instance you need to introduce a boat turnback policy so boats are towed back out of your territorial waters and waved goodbye as they putput back to Indonesia if they don't sink first. Excising territorial islands from your migration zone is another good trick, as the asylum seekers struggle ashore at some remote coral atoll to discover that they aren't anywhere in the actual world and so have no legal status to claim asylum. You also need to build internment camps on other Pacific nations territory and pay them millions to mistreat any inmates unlucky enough to want a better life away from the middle east wars or persecution in Myanmar. Also threaten any medical personnel, NGO staff or any other person who attends the camps for humanitarian purposes with jail if they reveal any of the conditions. Also, vilify a Norwegian sea captain who had the temerity to rescue a sinking boatload of asylum seekers and attempt to bring them to your country. Get the SAS to board his boat to intimidate crew and passengers, and refuse permission to allow them to land, in contradiction of various international laws and treaties. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tampa_affair Finally just for the lols, make sure the second verse of your national anthem contains the lines "for those who've come across the seas we've boundless plains to share" Feel relaxed doing this safe in the knowledge that eventually New Zealand always ends up taking them off your hands, problem solved. Edited June 1, 2022 by monkeysarefun 3 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted June 1, 2022 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 1, 2022 5 minutes ago, monkeysarefun said: No offence but your government needs some more work before it can claim to be treating asylum seekers at Australian Standard level. I can't help feeling that your country imbibed methods of dealing with undesirable elements of the population at the mother country's breast. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson044 Posted June 2, 2022 Share Posted June 2, 2022 On 31/05/2022 at 17:35, Caley Jim said: They are 'mericans, as GB once described them! Jim 'merkins. I love the idea of The Merkin People. It's not a word often used. merkin /ˈməːkɪn/ noun an artificial covering of hair for the area. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now